ATV users beware.

[TMan]

JMN, I think your opinion on banning ATV use on public land is a bit hypocritical considering you are using public land yourself, at least from what I acertain from your descriptive experience...Maybe we should just close all public land to hunting and solve the problem that way? Or hunt your own land, I paid for this public stuff too.

I know Bemidji like the back of my hand and have hunted the public land there (Zone 284 Turtle River area) for 25 years (Since I was 14) and never have I had my hunt ruined by someone/something like you describe. How long have you hunted where you are and are you the intruder on someone else's long time hunting ground? Perhaps after you graduate from BSU and get older you might actually want an ATV, yet because of all the emotional outbursts of people who take similar tones when discussing issues (Not anti-ATV, but more so in the way you present your position) you may never be able to. I am all for raising the bar for education and using the funds that we pay as licensee's for enforcement of regulations. Yes, it's difficult to enforce, but there have been some good crackdowns lately that highlight these actions of a few to readers and the public, some of whom may not know that it is not acceptable to trash wetlands, destroy farmland, etc. Let's let the law breakers know there are penalties for their actions and teach our kids what it means to be a responsible ATV rider.

[metrojoe]

Dave,

I think you bring up a great point. Not knowing the regs is no excuse, but educated users make better decisions. What would you think of having everyone using a “motorized vehicle” including boats, sleds, jet skis, atvs, etc. be required to be tested on the regs for their particular activity?. Maybe it wouldn’t even have to be a test, more like homework, something that shows that they have at least read thru the regs. Continued efforts by the OHV community to promote responsible riding habits and enforcement by the DNR will eventually lead to more trails. I think what is happening now is really just a knee jerk reaction to the explosion of ATV’s in Minnesota.

Ray,

This topic was about ATV’s and hunting so when I used the term “motorized vehicle” I was referring to ATV’s.

I wasn’t calling for an all out ban of ATV’s. My thought was at the time the state was considering the regs for ATV use on public land during hunting season, that ATV’s would be looked at as more of an aid for the handicap and elderly. It’s just “my opinion” that it was a mistake to allow ATV’s to become such a big part of the hunting experience.

[GrouseHunt'R]

What is the real issue being discussed here?

Is it the use of ATVs for hunting period?

Is it the retricted hours of use during the firearms season?

Is it the use of ATVs by handicapped or disabled individuals?

Or is it all of the above?

[Dave]

It started as some federal lands, and more state lands in the future, will prohibit the use of ATVs, even for hunting.

Some don't think ATVs should be used for any part of a hunting trip.

Some don't think ATVs should be used during the day while they're out hunting.

Some are hesitant to let elderly and/or the handicapped use an ATV to get to areas while hunting.

It started as one topic and as always includes more and more. That's partly my fault for letting the topic stray that way. I will make new topics for some of the discussions.

[metrojoe]

You’ll find that all “hot button” issues have a problem staying on topic because people get too emotionally involved. Most times these issues are like experiencing a grade school hurling epidemic.

I think that’s why a lot of people usually stay away, myself included

[mauler]

I have read all of these and just want add me two cents also. I know we all feel like this is becoming a dead horse that we are all beating but here is my take on it. I am an ATV owner and use it all year, including hunting. I hunt all over the state, in the woods and on farm land. Some of the land is public and some is private. People saying that only ATV's disturb their hunt have never really looked at the whole picture. Just this year on bow opener a buddy of mine and are were hunting state land in central MN off hwy 23. We had been in the stands for a couple hours when we heard a bell ringing. I thought to myself, "it's to early for the Salvation Army, isn't it?" A while later we got out of the stands and headed for the truck. As we are walking back I asked if he had heard it also. He had, but even better he saw what it was. A guy was out riding a horse through the woods. Most people would say so what, that wouldn't matter. The only deer I saw that entire weekend was spooked by that noise. Now I know that an ATV can do the same thing but do you think for a second that a horse and rider or a few guys, walking for birds with dogs, who are talking and whistling and calling the dogs back don't disturb us also. We all share the same passion. I have hunted many times for birds where people are deer hunting. But you can look at as they are deer hunting where I am bird hunting. I don't even agree with the current regs on time of use. I would rather have the options to use the ATV that I paid good money for anytime I want, RESPONSIBLY. We all pay taxes on the land that we all use and some of us pay license fees on ATV's and want to get the use out them.

[Ely Lake Expert]

First off, I would like to welcome you to the forums mauler, You found a great site.

Secondly, Wow I am not on for 2 days and this topic is still going wild. Ahh shoot, my dad just said it is time to go to the hunting shack. I will have my comments after deer season.

Ryan

Ok nevermind, I will not even put a new post to bring this thread to the top. I just reread everything and I think all the pro-atvers said everything well.

[knoppers]

WOW! there is a lot of caps being used by the anti-ATV people here, same as shouting at us.

I own a ATV, but do not use it much during the firearms season, I obey the laws! I also walk as much as 5 miles a day during the season, without even unloading the wheeler out of my truck. in fact the two of use that brought up wheelers never unloaded them all weekend. they are nice to have just in case you need them.

to blame ATV's for your poor expierences dosen't cut it with me, get off the friggin trail.

I believe the first poster was upset about the new federal land law against ATV use in federal forests, such as the chipewa and the superoir national forests.

[Kodiak]

ERIC=LIBERAL

[shortfatguy]

first i will start by saying that i am not anti atv. i own and use them. i did however expierience some one driving around all day long this year during deer season within sight of our stands on public land. we had to move some of our stands because they would drive by about every half hour all day long. the hours that are in place are there to stop this type of thing from happening but it isnt the atvs that cause the problem. i have yet to see an atv go cruising by with noone on it! it is the inconsiderate jerks driving them who are the problem. they are probably jerks all year not just during deer season. people need to think about others before they do something. if there was more compasion in the world it would solve alot of problems not just annoyances like some dingleberry driving a wheeler past your stand at 8 am on opening morning!!! and for all of you who think i am a wimp for using a wheeler to drag out some of the deer i shoot..... next time i shoot a 240+ lb buck over a mile from the nearest truck accessable road i will leave the wheeler at home and call you to help drag it through the swamp and up the side of a mine dump or 2!

[knoppers]

shortfatguy

you need to get there licences number if you can and call the local CO. that would really mess up anyones hunting with that illegal activity going on.

[Dave]

Was it another hunter riding the ATV or recreational rider? Rec riders aren't restricted to riding times but that isn't very respectful to others who are hunting. That's one area in which ATV clubs are trying to spread the word about riding during hunting season.

[shortfatguy]

it was another "hunter" if thats what you want to call them. we did call the co but i wasnt there because my dad was in the hospital and the other guys had moved the stands by the time i got back. i would have gotten the plate number and will if it happens again. the worst part about it is that on opening morning one of the guys walked up to my brother inlaw at around 8 am while he was sitting in his stand and told him they had stands about 500 yards away and it was unsportsman like of us to have a stand that close to them. so we moved that stand across the road by our other stands. i guess hunting quietly is unsportsman like but riding around on a wheeler next to people who are hunting is cool

[Benny]

Hey Shortfatguy, only a fellow ranger would call the reject piles "mine dumps".

I grew up right in the hart of the range cities just down from you in Pengilly.

We hunt right below one of the tailing ponds, had to use my Bronco and LOTS or rope one year to drag a 200lbs'er up the side of the dump so we didn't have to dag it two miles out to 169.

Benny

[shortfatguy]

benny,

you may be right about that! do you fish swan alot? it was great last fall!! not quite as good this fal but still pretty good. i also have drug deer up the side of the mine dump from the top... the hardest part about doing that is finding all the rope it takes to reach out there. i shot a deer in 2001 off of the dumps near buhl. it took 4 guys and a wheeler to get it out... weighed 236 lbs... if we hadnt had the wheeler it would have taken 8 people!

[Benny]

Well I don't get up there as much any more.My folks live near the lake and my uncle fishes it all the time.

He claims to have done good there this year but as you said ,not as good as last year.

He fishs over by Ma Roberts bar and in front of the old deaf camp along the east side of there.

Lots of weed walleyes in that lake, the west shore is good for pike and can turn on for walleye as well.

Those dumps out side Calumet are the ones we used to spend hours at trying to climb with the 88 250R's.

Seen a few ATV's tumble all the way down the big one South of Calumet.Most of them are now off limits and the CO watches them close.

Benny

[tripper]

Dave I've had a couple RC's but will try to be nice here so you don't have delete this.

Somebody mentioned that maybe the disabled and old should set close to roads where someone could keep an eye on them. All I can say to this person is that if you think that a disabled or older person enjoy's haveing to admitt they need an atv to hunt you need one of them white jackets. I have not met one yet that would not gladly trade their atv for a good set of legs, back, heart, lungs or what ever thier problem might be. A lot, if not most, of the disabled and old got that way trying to make things better for you and now you want to limit them even more on where they can go or do. Is it not enough that they have been basicly shut out of national and now state forests when it comes to hunting or just being able to go uot and enjoy the outdoors the best way they can. These people are disabled or old not dead, they still enjoy the out doors as much,no, more then they did before.

Do I know a little about what I'm talking about, I think so. I hunt in a party of 8, five of which have a disabilty of some kind,3 need their machines most days to get to and from their stands. That leaves one adult and a 12 and 13 year old to do any draging. The disabled are as independent as can be and will use their machine to retrieve a deer to the nearest trail where it can be picked up with a trailer that we use. machines are only used during leagle hours if possible.

Maybe I'm fortunate in living in and hunting in an area where we respect one anothers hunting area and leave buffer zones between party's so we don't interfer with each other.

At any rate, if not disabled, you will be older some day and find out what it is like to have to slowly give up what you truely enjoy.

[northman]

Since the new law about atv use in superior national forest is so new. I am going to reserve judgment on it. I read that they are going to put up signs on roads ok for atv travel on the roads they will allow us to ride on. I suspect they are far from done doing that yet since that forest is so large. If they are real restrictive about it then it will be a very sad thing.

We also know that the new law will be coming in the next 2 to 4 years about minnesota state land and state forest land, including county lands that border state forest lands. They are still working on their assesments. All land that is now managed and wide open to atv riding will, when done become closed to atv riding unless posted open to atv use. I suspect that when that is all said and done. We will be very upset about that.

Also, although potlatch land is their private land. Now that they are taking thousands of acres of their land and leasing it out. These thousands of land that we used as public land is going to be posted no tresspassing, thus lost to us.

The obvious trend here is that, very rapidly, we are not only loosing thousands of acres to ride atv's on but also to hunt on. This will force a mass no. of people condensed in a much smaller area of public land to hunt. I see big problems then. Real big problems.

One of the problems I see is that there is a big difference between recreational atv riders and hunters that use atv's.

The recreational rider does not exactly care where he rides. He simply is looking for legal trails to ride. Hunters on the other hand want the legal right to ride our atv's where we hunt. Big difference. I personally belive that recreational riders do more damage to the land then us hunters. I use my atv grouse hunting. I am not looking for atv challenges when I am hunting and I want the roads/trails to be in the best condition they can be. Can you imagine a deer hunter for example that would WANT the trail to there deer stand to be all muddied up and tore up.

For me personally as a grouse hunter. My favorite place to hunt has an old logging road that makes into a full circle and goes for about 20 miles. There is bird hunting on that road but what I do is ride my atv on the circle and park it and walk hunt all the side trails off of it. I am not capable of walking about 25 to 30 miles in one day in the woods, plus the hunting part of it. If this area becomes off limits. It will be a major set back for me. Besides that trail. Along the 20 mile circle there is another logging road that goes for 11 miles and birds can be hunted along it to. That road then comes out to a state forest. From there, one can ride around the state forest and hunt more places. It is a very very large area indeed. If atv's become off-limits it will be a real drag and then like the guy said in post no.1. Maybe it will be time to sell the atv. Lets hope that the dnr and legislature does the right thing for us. Otherwise, things look bleek, for sure !!

northman.

[Dave]

Tripper and Northman, very well said. Now, make sure your legislative representatives hear the same things from you.

[Jason Boser]

Itasca county just sent an appeal to the forest service on the new changes we will see how it goes. I also wrote my government officials about this and actually have recieved replies back saying they are working on it the only one who wouldnt write back was dayton go figure

Jason