Potlatch Land?

[WalleyeDundee]

Anyone here lease Potlatch land? What is your take on it? Other than not being able to build, is there a catch?

[pikerliker]

I'm also curious about this. How much do they charge, how much land can you lease, etc?

~piker

[PerchJerker]

I lease 80 acres of Potlatch, along with a buddy of mine. He has private land on one side of it, I have private land on the other side. In the past there's been other groups that hunted it more than we did, but when it came up for lease we felt we "had" to try to get it, for a couple of reasons:

1. If you get the lease, you can renew it every year (ie. no one else can get it or apply for it). That means that if you don't get the lease, you may never be able to get it.

2. You can post the land to keep people out. We did not want to risk having someone else get it, kick us out, and set up right on our property lines.

Do we want to pay to lease it? No way.

Are we posting it to keep other hunters out? No, at least not yet. We hunted it this year, along with the group that's hunted it the past few years. But we are not going to allow any new groups to hunt it. FYI, I am referring to deer hunting. That parcel also gets grouse hunted, and if we post it the grouse hunters would have to stay out too or be in violation of the trespass laws.

And that is really the downside to the lease program. If you don't get the lease, you might lose out on your hunting land. If you do get the lease, you risk creating disputes and ill will with other hunters that have used the land in the past.

This year Potlatch has 120 acres for lease on the south side of my property. I can't afford to lease it. I really hope I can still hunt on it. Having all the "public use" land around my place, including those two Potlatch parcels, was one of the appealing things to me when I bought the property. After this year all the nearby Potlatch land will be leased, which might put more hunting pressure on the other public lands around me (county, state, and national forest).

The Potlatch hunting lease HSOforum has lots of good info and probably answers any questions you might have.

Good luck.

[LuciandTim]

I lease a 80 acre plot of potlatch up near Nevis, MN. We pay around $400.00 a year. It is great. We lost some land over the past years so we had nowhere to hunt. For a couple years we hunteerd unleased potlatch and that was a zoo. It is nice to have our own again. We post it heavily year round. We haven't had any problems except from a guy who bowhunted on it. He tryed to buy it from potlatch under us after we denied him access. He offered us money and even asked to be put on the lease. He was crazy about a couple bucks he calimed were utilizing the land as a bedroom. He was right about the bucks, I have seen both once together...huge. Never have gotten a shot and haven't heard of anyone else getting them either. Maybe they are dead and maybe they are still hiding in there somewhere. We do well on the land. This year we got 5 deer for 3 people. A couple local people are a little agitated but thats a long story...No harm, they are friends. Except for the one guy everything has been fine. We did find some evidence of someone trespassing but we haven't had problems. The neighbors of the land are also friends and they keep a good eye on things. Overall a good deal!

[BDR]

I also hunt in a group that leases 240 acres of potlatch. We leases the land around my uncles farm that we have hunted for 100 years. If we did not lease it someone else would and the tradition would be gone. We have a pretty big group and it came to $100 a person. Not bad compared to the cost of buying.

I have heard talk of "sealed bids" for upcoming years on the leases, this may drive the prices very high. Also I have heard that Potlatch is on thier last leg financially, so who knows what the future will hold.

[huntingmaxima]

I leased 200ac. of Potlatch this year, cost was $1200 but we divided it up 6 ways. We were told that 26 other peoople applied for our lease. We were the one whos name were drawn out of the hat. It was a great lease, and we will be doing it for a long time. They pay the taxes on it, and I beleive we were required to post it. Potlatch says that there were to many people that were leaving garbage and now they have someone who can also keep an eye on it for them.

[Rogue Hunter]

I applied last year, but didn't get a lease. Don't think I'll apply this year...other things going on, and don't have the time to go look at specific lease offering.

The thing I wanted to say, though, I kind of lement the fact that this could be the beginning of the end to hunting as we grew up knowing it. Within ten years, If you can't afford to buy or lease land, you won't be able to grouse or deer hunt.

Is it a sign of the times? Has this country reached the point where Europe has been for so many years?

There was a time when you could buy a plat book, and anything that said Polatch, you knew you could hunt. I guess I won't be buying anymore plat books. And before I get a lot of negitive replies, I'll go one step futher. In twenty years, middle income people, like those on this board, won't be able to afford these leases either--"sealed bids"!!!

I understand the desire to have a place to hunt, where you feel you had sole access...in the first paragraph I said I applied for a lease. BUT, I think the stage is set.

Two points/questions:

when Polatch purchase these lands years ago, did they get any special consideration from the state?

were they under any special tax programs with the state that resently ending...pushing them to this lease program?

If the answer to either of these questions are yes, perhaps the people of Minn should stand up now, for future generations.

Thanks,

Rogue Hunter

[ccarlson]

Rogue Hunter,

You are right on. I too fear that hunting will become a sport of the elite. Prime examples are south dakota with hunting guides leasing up all the land and now in Minnesota with Potlach leasing what used to be available to all.

I too purchased my land where I live next to Potlach land. That was a small part of the appeal. It is now leased for hunting to others which isn't bad for me since I hunt elsewhere but it still changes the dynamics of everything. Plus, what does the future hold? A development of houses perhaps?

I think we are just at the tip of the iceberg. Remember, the only constant is change!

ccarlson

[M.T. Bucket]

Quote:

---

The thing I wanted to say, though, I kind of lement the fact that this could be the beginning of the end to hunting as we grew up knowing it. Within ten years, If you can't afford to buy or lease land, you won't be able to grouse or deer hunt.

Is it a sign of the times? Has this country reached the point where Europe has been for so many years?

There was a time when you could buy a plat book, and anything that said Polatch, you knew you could hunt. I guess I won't be buying anymore plat books. And before I get a lot of negitive replies, I'll go one step futher. In twenty years, middle income people, like those on this board, won't be able to afford these leases either--"sealed bids"!!!

I understand the desire to have a place to hunt, where you feel you had sole access...in the first paragraph I said I applied for a lease. BUT, I think the stage is set.

Two points/questions:

when Polatch purchase these lands years ago, did they get any special consideration from the state?

were they under any special tax programs with the state that resently ending...pushing them to this lease program?

If the answer to either of these questions are yes, perhaps the people of Minn should stand up now, for future generations.

---

Glad you posted this, because I was going to. Leasing all of this Potlatch land has the same effect as selling off chunks of public land. Those who can afford it do just fine, the rest of us get pushed somewhere else. I think the amount of public land Minnesota has is the best thing this state has going for it. It's sad to see that everything keeps moving in the direction of subdivision and privatization.

We tell our kids to share but we keep setting up systems to make sure we don't have to.

[northman]

I bought 20 acres right across the road from 2,500 acres of potlatch land. I to did it because of the appeal of that land across from me. This 2,500 acres is now set to be leased. All of it. I checked the current land to be leased this year and it was sectioned off. I notified my dads deer party and they have applied for a lease on 130 acres of it. The rest will go to whom ever and Signs will be up next year on all of it, keep out. I am sure. My grandfolks owned a farm about 1 mile from that land and I hunted it since I was a kid. By this next year. I won't be able to hunt it. It is all very sad. I agree. We are all getting pushed on an ever smaller area we can hunt. And with the new atv laws in the works. I will also have an ever decreasing area to ride. Northman

[bigbucks]

I realize my perspective on this could be off a little, as there's never been any Potlatch land available to hunt on in my hunting area, but hasn't that always technically been private land? It must stink to lose the ability to hunt land you've hunted for years, but isn't it similar to if my Dad were to sell his land & the new landowners wouldn't let me hunt? It would stink, but it would be their right & if I'd bought land for hunting I'm not likely to let the previous owners hunt it.

It wasn't ever truly public land was it? Now if the state gave special tax considerations so it could be used as such & they're still giving them, that's a whole different ball game.

[PerchJerker]

Potlatch is private land that was open to the public for hunting, hiking, atving, etc. From a practical point of view, in the past if you saw Potlatch land on a plat map you could safely assume that it was open to public use. Now that they're leasing it, it's up to the leasees to decide if they're going to allow anyone to use it. Since they're paying for it you can probably assume that the public won't be allowed to use it anymore.

Potlatch say they're the largest private landowner in MN. I don't recall how many acres they own or have leased, but it is HUGE.

[Satchmo]

From what I understand Potlatch used to recieve tax breaks as long as they allowed public access to the land. A couple of years ago those incentives were taken away by the State of MN. The lease program was put into place to recover the taxes Potlatch must now pay, with a little extra tacked on to pay for running the program.It is strictly the economics of running a business.

[Craig_S]

You're real close on the tax thing Satch. The tax structure was changed and I believe a loop hole developed. Under the old system, companies got a tax break if they allowed public hunting on ALL of their ownership in MN. Now, they still get a tax break on acres they choose to enroll. But, they can withold acres they think thay can make more money on leasing or selling. The change in tax structure spawned this whole mess. And I'm not real happy about it.

But, it is private land. And I do believe strongly in the owners ability to do as it wishes.

Craig

[mizpah]

I am a little late to this discussion. Back in the early 90's some land near me went up for sale. The owner asked if I was interested but I told him I couldn't afford it. It was a 1000 acre piece at $500.00/acre. He said to hunt it and get back to him. Well, the hunting was great but that kind of money for hunting just wasn't in the cards. I told him I would buy the hunting rights and was surprised when he agreed. I paid $30,000 for these hunting rights. At the time most folks thought I was nuts. I have a 100 year lease with exclusive hunting rights. No one, even the property owner can hunt this property. My lease is a very good one. What's my point. Well, it costs me $300.00 a year to hunt on a 1000 acres of great hunting land. It is a steal. With the cost of land it would seems to me that leasing will allow more hunters to get there own place than would have been able to in the past. I know some other hunters will get displaced but it wasn't their land to begin with. Leasing land is cheap and we have no european's in our group. If you can lease the land you currently hunt why wouldn't you do it. Just think of the safety factors for your party. Just my 2 cents.

[LuciandTim]

You guys act as if Potlatch is the only land that is open to public hunting. You still have the real public land. Maybe you should be thankful that potlatch even let people hunt their land. How can you depend on a large corp. for your hunting land? Myself and family have used it as last options in the past or have done drives through it when nothing else is going on. As far as expenses? Its so cheap. I am broke. Don't have much to my name. School, rent, and bills gets my money. I do manage to pay $130.00 a year for an 80 acre lot split with three other people. The locals in my area like the fact that its leased also. Now they know who is in the woods. They know there isn't going to be strangers running through the woods next to their houses. You also can't blame potlatch, it's probably nice for them to know who is on their land. They have rules you have to follow, they are the same rules that were supposed to be followed by the general public in exchange for hunting their land. With people leasing these plots now maybe the rules will be followed and their land won't be trashed with garbage strewn about, Permanent tree stands, cutting of trees, and nails in trees too. It's not that bad.....2 cents

[northman]

Well I own 20 acres now but for 50 years I relied on potlatch land to hunt. I grew up on potlatch land with my grandfathers farm less then a mile away. I have shot hundreds of grouse on that land and several deer. After all, potlatch got tax breaks for leaving there land open. They only harvest the trees. Yes I was greatfull. I also followed the rules. I have never left trash on there land.

In the old days, others did not either. For the last 15 years now. I am seeing more and more trashing of there land. A year and 1/2 ago. I reported to potlatch by email of an old car I found on there land. It was an old beeter. It either on purpose or accidently went off the logging road into a tiny pothole and is tipped over on its side. People have been shooting at it. Potlatch thanked me by email reply and said they would check it out. This past fall I only hunted grouse there once. That old car is still there.

Remember to, we are not talking chump change here. Potlatch is the LARGEST land owner in northern minnesota period. I think the railroad might be second. Even if I leased one plot. The other plots will be off-limits. I don't know about you but I like to explore minnesota. I love to go to new places just to see new land and new lakes. My primary hunting is still on real public land and I do have my 20 acres but when a person grows up and for about 45 years hunts a piece of land. I am talking about 2,500 acres. All I am saying is that it is very very sad. All this reminds me a little bit of the book and movie 1984. We are all little by little and probably in the future going to be hurded onto our spot to hunt. there we will stay, year after year. Northman

[Neiko]

Huntingmaxima, I had the same thing for me 2 years ago. I applied online and awhile after the deadline I called to see who got the lease. "Luckily" no one had been chosen yet and he looked up my name and they never recieved it so I submitted my information. I asked how many other parties were put in and he said around 10. Well I did get the lease which makes me wonder if there was really anyone else that was interested. We leased it the first year and passed last year because it was getting to be too much $ for just hunting. I have enough acres to keep me busy but would have been nice to have just incase some Yahoos get it. I think they try to play up the competition so they can charge more especially if they do go to sealed bids. Why would they go to sealed bids instead of going for the fixed dollar amount. A big corporation like that shouldn't be gambling on income like that. It could back fire on them.