Alternative format for bass leagues?

[smallie_hawgin]

This format is something our group of guys has been doing since 2003... Thought it might spur on some good discussion....

Link to article online

Conservation-Minded Fishing League Format Sweeps Western Wisconsin

by Jason Halfen on May 15, 2012

submitted by:

In the face of increasing state regulations of fishing tournaments and community concerns about the impact of competitive angling on local fisheries, a group of innovative, conservation-minded anglers have adopted a novel strategy for conducting weekly walleye tournaments on a set of lakes and rivers in western Wisconsin. These events do not require fish to be transported in livewells to an off-water weigh-in at the end of the event; rather, the length of each fish is documented with a digital photo before it is quickly released back into its native environment. This catch-record-release format ensures that the events have minimal impact on the overall health of the fisheries by eliminating fish mortality associated with livewell transport. Moreover, the 100% release format without an off-water weigh-in, coupled with limitations on the number of competitors, allows the leagues to operate without direct intervention from state regulators. The founders of these western Wisconsin walleye leagues envision this format taking hold in other areas where regulatory or community concerns have negative impacts on club-level competitive angling.

Dr. Jeremy Frigo, one of the founders of the Menomin-Tainter Walleye League , explains how the league was established in 2011: “The original inspiration for starting a walleye league came from the idea of melding the love of walleye fishing with the idea of local competitive fishing. Local multispecies leagues already existed, but nothing specific to walleye. We chose the “catch-record-release” format, introduced by Anglers Insight Marketing (AIM) for a number of reasons. First and foremost, it’s the best thing for the fisheries. The fish are caught, measured, photographed and released. This is not any different from normal fishing in which catch and release is practiced. Second, since all fish are released immediately, we are not tied to any size limits, culling restrictions or daily bag limits. This allows great flexibility. Third, since all fish are immediately released and not brought back to a weigh-in, the process is greatly simplified on a number of fronts,” by eliminating the need for fish handling and weigh-in facilities.

In the Menomin-Tainter Walleye League, each fish is measured on a standardized, league-supplied tournament ruler, and digitally photographed using a league-supplied SD card. Competitors only have access to the rulers and cards while the events are underway, ensuring that any fish registered in the weekly events are caught, photographed, and released during the 3-hour, weeknight competitions. The winners of each night’s competition are determined by the cumulative length of their four longest fish. Since fish are released immediately after being measured and photographed, anglers need not worry about the impact of bag limits or restrictive harvest “slot” limits. The relatively short time commitments, close-to-home locations, and modest weekly entry fees make the competitions accessible to a wide variety of anglers, some of whom still travel over an hour to join in the camaraderie of the league events.

Involvement of young anglers and partnerships with local communities are paramount to the health and growth of these walleye leagues. Dr. Frigo explains, “One of our utmost important goals of the league is to involve young anglers. Last year, we agreed that the greatest example of our success was the fact that parents felt comfortable enough to bring their children and involve them in our activities. As a result, some of these kids have absolutely turned into fishing machines! Not only do the parents have a chance to take their kids out for a great night of fishing, they also get to introduce them to the world of competitive angling in a fun, friendly format that just breeds enthusiasm.” Moreover, “community feedback to our league has been very positive. Essentially, the bad rap (mostly unjustified) was that fishing tournaments kill fish due to the stress of the weigh-ins. Whether this was justified or not, we totally removed that variable from the equation. Overwhelmingly, support came due to conservation of the fisheries being kept at the forefront. That is something we all can feel great about. Last year we caught A TON of walleyes—all which went back to be caught another day.”

Another testament to the success of the catch-record-release format for weekly competitions is that this same format has now been adopted by two other regional walleye leagues. Dr. Frigo explains that these other leagues, “are almost mirror images of our format. Jesse Krook, who fished our league one night with us last year on Lake Tainter, has now established the St. Croix Valley Walleye League. He loved our format so much he begged, pleaded and bought us 5 cheeseburgers each to help him establish a similar league near Hudson, Wisconsin. The response to that league has been huge as well. Likewise, Jason Sullivan and his committee members recently started the Chippewa Valley Walleye League, based out of Chippewa Falls, Wisconsin. Since all of our formats are nearly identical and have such common goals, it will allow for future growth in the direction of uniting the local leagues under one basic entity. In my crystal ball, I see a possible local weekend tournament series, formation of new local leagues and seminars. Essentially, the door is wide open.”

While professional-level bass and walleye tournaments, held on expansive bodies of water with traditional off-water weigh-ins, are likely here to stay, the catch-record-release format adopted by the Menomin-Tainter Walleye League is an excellent adaptation for local events where reducing impacts on smaller fisheries is of paramount importance. In this format, anglers can still enjoy the thrill of the competition and share in each others successes, while still maintaining a strong, 100% live release, conservation ethic. We look forward to watching the Menomin-Tainter Walleye League, and other similar organizations, continue to grow and prosper in years to come.

[hockeybc69]

Right on SH.

Hope more people start doing similar things.

I just cringe at how smaller local leagues treat fish. I see it several times a summer.

I am in a couple leagues/clubs. We do what we can to handle the fish as little as possible.

Some of the clubs I see and how they do their weigh ins, they should be cited for something.

Guys with bags full of fish and no water, and standing in line. Or the guys that come up with a couple bass, and wait while standing there holding the fish.

Or the best one, the guy with a dip net full of fish and standing around yakking with people.

The bigger venues tend to be a bit more focused on how to handle the fish. Its the small local leagues and clubs that need some revamping of how they do their weigh-ins in many cases.

[TurnUpTheFishing]

I agree completely. Some people have no common sense or just dont care about the resource enough. I fished my first club last year and have sat in on other small club weigh-ins, while most guys seemed to do things right I too have seen guys lugging around bags of fish with very little water for far too long.

Last year I saw a guy dump 5 fish back in the lake at the landing and several fish floated. It was a busy launch and non tournament people watched it happen and gave them and the rest of our members a strange look as fish where released. I could see one couple commenting about it. I grabbed one tried to revive it but it was dead so I put it in my bag to drop it somewhere else. Dump your fish and make sure they swim away. If their are any floaters dont leave them at the launch at least make an effort to look like you care and dispose of floaters somewhere else. It definitely didnt leave a good impression of us on some people that night.

Most guys seem to be good about fish care and some went well beyond and brought a nice large limit back out to deep water to release instead of dumping them into the hot, shallow, boat launch area.

[cruiseforever]

If their are any floaters dont leave them at the launch at least make an effort to look like you care and dispose of floaters somewhere else.

Sounds like wanton waste to me. Sure is a lot of upset people when piles of netted fish are found. How is this different other than it is in ones and twos in the garbage instead of a big pile.

[TurnUpTheFishing]

Sounds like wanton waste to me. Sure is a lot of upset people when piles of netted fish are found. How is this different other than it is in ones and twos in the garbage instead of a big pile.

Yeah that's essentially what it was. Are you saying what I did was wanton waste after the fact? I wasnt going to eat it but at least I put it in the trash instead of leaving it to float around the launch.

[firefish_12]

Yes that's called wanton waste

[RK]

Hiya -

I'd really like to see non-transport formats like this adopted by more organizations - especially small clubs that don't have the infrastructure and resources to support a weigh in adequately. It takes more than a little equipment to run a weigh-in with high survival in some situations (my friend who was tournament director for the PWT used to haul their gear in a semi) and I doubt most small clubs are equipped to do it.

Last summer I went over to the public access for the lake my cabin is on to watch a local bass club derby weigh in. I was considering joining the club, not because I wanted to fish tournaments (I don't have anything against tournaments - I just don't enjoy them that much) but because they're local, and I'd rather support a local club.

Seeing their 'weigh in' pretty well cured me of any desire to join. Guys standing around on an 80 degree day with fish in bags with no water, setting bags of fish down on scorching hot blacktop, dropping fish on the pavement, lobbing fish out away from the dock to 'release' them... No way to say for sure, but based on what I know of fish physiology, I'd have to say a lot of the fish ended up as turtle food, even if they did 'swim right off.' It was nauseating.

To me it's pretty simple ethics - if you're going to release them, do so in a way that maximizes their chances of survival. There's also just the public perception side of it. Fairly or not, tournament anglers are under the microscope right now for all kinds of reasons, from AIS issues to use of public ramps, and all kinds of other stuff. Showing a total disregard for the fish is just lousy PR, at a time when tournament anglers don't need any. I honestly went from possibly joining a club and not caring one way or another whether there were tournaments on the lake my cabin is on to never wanting to see those guys back again, and never again considering joining. Tournament anglers would do well to remember that Ray Scott didn't make BASS events catch and release because he gave a dump about killing bass. He did it because killing bass was bad PR for tournaments.

I'd think small clubs would be all over this idea. Fishless 'weigh-ins' are a lot easier and cheaper to run for small organizations with pretty low infrastructure costs. I know I'd have a whole different attitude about tournaments that didn't involve guys standing around with fish suffocating in bags.

RK

[hockeybc69]

Quote:

I know I'd have a whole different attitude about tournaments that didn't involve guys standing around with fish suffocating in bags.

Ya nailed it Rob.....

[TR21HP]

There was a tournament on the outdoor channel for the last couple of weeks that had BASS and FLW pros in it and for the life of me I can't remember the name of the show but they caught, weighed and released fish in the boat.Of course they had a marshall to record each fish but that makes a lot more sense to me as well. Each marshall had a i pad and it was a total fish tourney with no limit. Unique idea and well worth it but I realize that people want to see the big bags brought in and that's why they show up to the Elites and FLW events. As Rob mentioned they are equiped to handle safe catch and release but club tourneys should have a boca grip with them and catch, weigh and release to save the fisheries.

[TurnUpTheFishing]

Yes that's called wanton waste

No, what I did was not wanton waste.

[RickyBobby]

Definitely a good way to go with small clubs where everybody knows everybody else and the "honor system" is in play.

With these catch-photograph-release formats is there anyway to prevent a single fish from being photographed multiple times??

[mabr]

Maybe I will be in the huge majority on this but I wouldn’t like it or trust it. UNLESS, it was purely a draw team format where you fish with a different person each tournament or have an impartial judge in the boat at all times. Judge wouldn’t be an issue with me but the draw I don’t like, I like fishing with my partner for a reason. It’s hard to find a good fishing partner that you both fish good together. It’s a great idea in theory, but when money becomes involved some people will and have done some pretty stinky things to win. Picture doesn’t mean anything if it has a pound weight inside its mouth that’s not viable. That’s just my opinion.

As far as RK’s experience in seeing the fish being handled in-properly. I don’t doubt it happened, but in the almost 25 years I’ve been tournament fishing I’ve never seen anything even close to that happening. I will admit to seeing a few multi species tourneys where guys had fish in a net while waiting to be weighted but never in a bass tournament. Not saying it doesn’t, but I’ve never seen it. Had I, I would have said something to whoever was running it. I’d guess that the majority of us on here have way to much respect and love of catching bass to treat them in a way that we wouldn’t have a chance to catch them again.

I’d also venture to guess that when a tournament was being run like RK”s experience it won’t be around long. Again I’d guess that even though some people might not say anything verbally, there actions by quitting the trail is in a way of speaking out eventually.

[RK]

It’s a great idea in theory, but when money becomes involved some people will and have done some pretty stinky things to win.

[GooBack]

Thankfully none of the top bass circuirs in the state will ever go to paper tounaments No competitive angler could believe its fair.

Clubs are clubs. I regard leagues the same, with very little. Couldnt care less about em but if the curcuits i fish now went to paper i'd stop fishing em

[mabr]

Yes it does RK. Through those 25 years I’ve seen a huge change, and not for the good. Sad for sure, and the biggest reason why I fish very few anymore.

You’re correct I did miss the length part of it, I guess I was referring to TR21 (I think it was him who mentioned it) the weighting then releasing. I'll give you this, you've caused me to give it some more thought and not be so closed minded. LOL Man I wish I could write like you!

Could this format make it the bigger leagues? I don’t know, personally I liked the anticipation of seeing the fish brought to the scales and guessing the weight, seeing how much this person needs or how much you need. It’s all part of the tournament atmosphere. Then it’s (I don’t know how else to say this) about showing off your skills as an angler in front of everyone. I don’t think it would be the same with that format. Just seeing the difference between a 10lb sack and a 20lb is pretty impressive in my eyes.

[Craigums]

Newest issue of InFisherman talks about how bass are far more resiliant than once thought. Some fish surviving up to 13 minutes out of water! I think with a little bit of care and common sense there is no reason to be afraid of live weigh-ins

[TonkaBass]

I like the regular tourney format. Its not hard on a fishery, just hard for some pencil pushers to accept.

[grab the net]

Overall, I think the format mentioned works best for walleyes, but not so much for bass. Limits are the norm for most bass league venues, while walleye leagues are a little light, so measure and release works ok for the very few fish they catch. Walleye guys also seem to get great joy in just being out on the water, enjoying the evening and so forth, actually catching a fish is a real reason to celebrate, thus memorializing it with a picture makes perfect sense. If I ever decide to join a marble eye league, I will surely join a CRR, it sounds like a hoot.

[smallie_hawgin]

Quote:

Newest issue of InFisherman talks about how bass are far more resiliant than once thought. Some fish surviving up to 13 minutes out of water! I think with a little bit of care and common sense there is no reason to be afraid of live weigh-ins

... And we all know to trust our popular magazines...

There is no question in any researchers mind that if you have a fish (any fish) out of water and in a bag in summer heat or even in cooler temps, it's stressful on the fish. If you guys truly feel that there is in now way this has the potential to affect a fishery if done multiple times.... Then there truly is a disconnect between you and the resource... For that, I truly feel sorry for you. Might be time to open your mind a little to alternatives...

Keep in mind, I enjoy fishing weigh in style tournaments too, but, I want something better for the lakes and rivers.... Not just the status quo. So Tonka, I aint no "pencil pusher"

A few refs that are easily found through google scholar all suggest there is mortality due to stress induced from the tournament process.... I can list many more. And while we all know the mortality is not high relatively speaking.... There is an affect.

Tourney article 1

Tourney article 2

Tourney article 3

Tourney article 4

Tourney article 5

And even the organization that initiated the market on the bass tournament acknowledges there is mortality.... Of which I might add I am a life member of since I was 12.... BASS-keeping bass alive

[TurnUpTheFishing]

Newest issue of InFisherman talks about how bass are far more resiliant than once thought. Some fish surviving up to 13 minutes out of water! I think with a little bit of care and common sense there is no reason to be afraid of live weigh-ins

unfortunately there seems to be a fair number of fisherman that lack that common sense. Catching fish from cool deep water on a hot summer day, prolonged weigh in stress and excessive time out of water kills fish. I would assume these fish are not cared for very well when culling or in the livewell also.

That said I dont think length works for competitive events. Imagine catching a 20 and an 18 and losing to three 13" fish.

Tournament directors just need to impose strict guidelines for proper weigh ins and make sure rules are followed.

[smallie_hawgin]

unfortunately there seems to be a fair number of fisherman that lack that common sense. Catching fish from cool deep water on a hot summer day, prolonged weigh in stress and excessive time out of water kills fish. I would assume these fish are not cared for very well when culling or in the livewell also.

Tournament directors just need to impose strict guidelines for proper weigh ins and make sure rules are followed.

Agreed on those particular points sir!

My personal suggestion that for larger events IF they feel the need to have an actual weigh in, they should at the very least institute an "in water weigh in" system. This at least reduces the stress on the fish from the time they leave your boat to the time they go back to the water. It is not that big of a step for the larger tournaments to take. Frankly, I am amazed some of the larger tournaments still use the "dry bag" or dry tub method for actually weighing fish... Then the grand standing with the fish for five minutes or more for photo opps.... A little much if you ask me..

I have to admit one of the most well run tournaments I have been involved in, was the Rainy river/lake tourney, in water weigh in, off site even, and the fish were handled very well... A premium was placed on the health of the fish. This is all I believe, what we should be striving for.

Ideally, no weigh in is even needed, I do agree the more money that is involved, the trust issue and some of the complexities become more evident. But, I also know that we as anglers can be a creative group.... IF we decide to.

[TonkaBass]

Smallie, I wasn't referring to you as a pencil pusher. I was referring to the suites in St. Paul who haven't cast a line in ten years and know nothing about the topic, but have all the power to make nonsense laws about it. Obviously I agree with you that its better to not have a fish in water vs. out of water. However I simply don't believe a new tournament format is needed and I wont support it. Great care is put into the weigh ins at most tournaments. Where there isn't, maybe the DNR should regulate those tournaments by having an intern post up at a couple, they might learn something. After all they paid the DNR to get the permit. It's not that I'm ignorant, it's that I firmly believe that the recent push for catch and release along side the great respect "most" tournament fishermen have towards the fish ensures strong populations of bass in the future. Lakes, as I'm sure you know, go through cycles that are out of our control. It's best left that way. Im also aware that you have a lot more experience doing actual studies on fisheries, Im just giving you the perspective of one tournament fisherman who also pays attention, no by catching them with a shocker, but with a rod and reel.

[TonkaBass]

I'd be ALL for an in water weigh in, and I've talked about it several times with people. Not sure why its not done. Cost for the upgrade wouldn't be very high.

[hockeybc69]

I noted that earlier too, that bigger tournaments have a pretty good handle on how to make things as best they can for the fish....

Its more the small leagues/clubs/tournaments that are not equipped properly, and just throw caution to the wind. The original post is about a Walleye league implementing this. Not large tournaments.

Our bass club does the same thing. And it works splendidly!

Dont rule it out.

[smallie_hawgin]

Quote:

Im also aware that you have a lot more experience doing actual studies on fisheries, Im just giving you the perspective of one tournament fisherman who also pays attention, no by catching them with a shocker, but with a rod and reel.

Tonka, with all due respect..... First off, in the realm of fish stuff... I am an angler first... A fisheries biologist second. I got into the job BECAUSE of my love for fishing and the resource... Not the job per se'.

I enjoy trying to understand and potentially make improvements to the resource faced with increased pressures from anglers, apathetic lakeshore development, changes in habitat, invasive species and the like. While the rod and reel can tell me a little about the lakes and rivers, the other gear we use tells me much, much more.... reliably, unlike angling does.

As mentioned earlier....I also enjoy the competitive angling, but, I am not satisfied with the way many smaller clubs and even some of the bigger organizations handle fish. That's why I posted the article initially, for this type of discussion... So far, so good.. There are quite a few other organizations that are doing this with bigger money in place as well.

Quote:

Lakes, as I'm sure you know, go through cycles that are out of our control. It's best left that way.

Not to totally disagree here, because to a certain extent you have a point. Recruitment in fish populations is variable depending more so on environmental conditions as well as the abundance of spawning stock present (specifically in the case of bass), however, research indicates repeatedly, that special regulations have had a positive impact on manipulating size structures. This can be done for several reasons (overharvest, compliance with quotas, addressing recruitment concerns, increasing trophy potential, etc). So while some natural variation is there, we also have a way to level out the peaks and valleys through special regs and "using" anglers to help restructure or focus harvest on a specific component of the fishery... With overall increases in participation (just total anglers overall), It aint all just mother nature anymore!!!