child support paying dads

[psegriz]

Yes a guy can make them prove documents on where the money is going. Atleast I did. At first we just made verbal agreement then she wanted more. I gave it to her then she wanted more again and I gave it to her. I have always paid the health insurance. The third time she wanted more I said no so off to court we go. Judge threw it out said if I had been paying on time to an agreed upon amount and giving increases state was not even going to get involved. The first couble years were bitter but ten years later we're more civil. Best part is neither one of us ever paid an attorney.

My buddy is in a different deal and he is getting scewed. he'd been paying support for ten years. His x got mad and told him the boy wasn't even his. He went, got paternity test and it wasn't his. She has her own business and making 6 figures. She had any visitation stopped. Went after the real father for child support and ten yrs. back support. My buddy does not get reimbursed for the ten yrs. he paid but the real father has to pay 10 yrs. back. Something needs to be changed there in my opinion.
I believe people should pay support, I also believe it should be fair. Everyone has thier idea of what is fair the support is for the support of the child not the x spouse.
My $.02
GRIZ

[BRUNO]

Having recently been through the divorce process I felt compelled to pitch in on this one. I was married for 23 years, my ex-wife suffered from mental illness and MS. She in the last 10 years became verbally abusive to my son, my daughter and myself. She physically attacked me and then my son. I found about a gallon of pills or prescriptions hidden throughout the house that she refused to take. Finally I had to call the cops on her. I have custody of the kids, I pay her and I am glad I am doing so. Why? Because I have a responsiblity to those two kids. They need love and a home more then the money I give her each month. I don't have much but what I have I am thankful for. We can only try to do the best for ourselves and the kids. I have seen my son grow into a fine young man that I am beginning to think of more as a friend than a kid. The abuse left deep scars on the daughter but just I hope my love and persistence pays off.

I keep one thought going that helps me, aside from fishing, I was in love when I married and I was in love when I got divorced.

[JohnMickish]

Here's a question for you all, but first a little background. I pay child support to a woman that I wasn't married to (stuff happens when you party naked), and she started the whole process of payment by going through the state so I don't get a tax credit. Now here's the question, has anybody figured out how to get the credit, as least every other year? This is something that I believe needs to be changed.

[kwkfsh]

Here is some information for non-custodial parents that may offer a bit of hope in the effort to achieve equitable awards in the matters of custody and support.

There was mention earlier in this post regarding a bill in front of the legislature currently. Actually there are a number of bills which have a direct bearing on these issues. The one that was mentioned was HF778/SF758. This bill was authored by Rep. Steve Smith and Sen. Tom Neuville, and will in fact raise the amount that you will pay as a non-custodial parent. If you are a non-custodial parent it is in your best interest to see this bill die. It appears that it is headed in this direction at this time.

Another bill in front of the legislature currently is HF664/SF600 . This is a cost shares bill and will more accurately reflect the costs of raising a child rather than an arbitrary percentage of income. This bill also exempts a portion of income in order to allow the non-custodial parent to support themselves.

There is also a bill that deals with presumptive joint custody. This bill would change the law to assume that both parents would have equal rights to joint custody. If this passes it will make for some great changes to the current system.

There is an organization called r-kids that is working very hard for the rights of non-custodial parents, and to try and change some of the unconstitutional, and discriminatory laws that affect support and custody.

They are currently in the process of starting a constitutional challenge to current support guidelines, as well as starting a class action lawsuit against the state on behalf of non-custodial parents in order to get the current laws changed. I am not going to post a link, but the name of this non-profit organization is r-kids.
They believe that children need and deserve the emotional, physical, and financial support of both parents.

If you have been treated unfairly by the family courts system it would be in your best interests to support this organization or another like it and make some noise with your legislators. r-kids is working hard to, and is on the verge of making some real and positive changes to support and custody guidelines here in MN. and in other states.

[This message has been edited by kwkfsh (edited 03-30-2004).]

[Ole1855]

I've been reading this thread with interest.

I got divorced in 1986 when the courts didn't want the Father to have custody. At the time of the divorce, I had to "explain" to my soon to be ex-wife, that if she didn't voluntarily relinquish custody she would have the fight of her life on her hands. You see, the reason I got divorced was she was running around behind my back partying and carrying on with a boyfriend. I "explained" to her that I would be bringing up all of her not too popular behavior in front of the courts. I also explained that I had way more resources to fight with than she did, she signed the papers right away. Here's the funny part, when she got on the witness stand in front of the judge, he asked her, "do you understand what you are doing giving up custody"?, he asked that 3 times and made here answer each time, after the 3rd time the judge hit the gavel and said case dissolution allowed.
She ended up paying me from Nov. 1, 1986- May 31, 2003. Life was kinda busy having kids ages 1.5 and 2.5 being a single parent, but I wouldn't have changed a bit. Had they grown up with her they probably would have turned out to be trouble, as it is they are great kids. My son is a Jr. at Winona State U. and my daughter is in Cosmetology school, no thanks to their mother!!!!

So all you single Dad's and Mom's that had a bad ex and are raising your kids on your own, hang in there, when your kids get older, they knew exactly who it was that took care of them. For all of you single parents that got screwed by the courts, I'm really sorry, your kids would probably have been better off with you.

Sorry, this has brought up alot of old feelings and it is getting kinda long, I'll quit!!!

Ole

[bucketmouth64]

Wow, this thread has generated more response than I imagined. Great stuff folks. Kwkfish, thanks for correcting me on the bills in the legislature. Didn't know of the different versions being discussed. I like the second one you mentioned better than the one I mentioned (778). My ex has the kids in another state. Trying to gain custody of any of them is next to impossible according to my attorney. Need to prove of abuse/neglect of some sort. Manipulations/mind games don't work. Which she is good at. She does everything right so there is no way she can lose the kids. She is totally disabled (ms) and is remarried (4th time). Only way to gain custody is if the kids want to come to live with me. Oldest wanted to move here last year, but then changed his mind (maybe some manipulations?). Don't get me wrong, my ex treats them good and the kids seem to be happy too. So life goes on. I put my trust into the Lord for keeping my kids safe from harms way. I have stopped stressing over the thought of my kids living with me at some future time.
Keep up the good posts. Glad there are many of us dad's that have similar thoughts and go thru similar problems.

[jr1318]

hole hopper not saying all are like my wifes exjust saying all you hear is the fathers side. Im sure that the majority are doing whats best for the kids, but some dont, if you heard the excuses like she has you'd understand where im coming from. "Heck you'll always have to pay to put a roof over your head and have utilities, so how much "extra" is really needed????" Can It Be Luck,I cant believe that you made that statement, we have 3 girls at home i can tell you kids now are not cheap to raise, with braces, clothing,food,and the time it takes to raise then it is not cheap

[SCUMFROG]

Bruno I feel your pain. My ex also has M.S. and abuses my kids. She plays mind games with them. I've had my son for 3 years now and I'm still trying to get him help for what she did. Now I'm fighting for my girl who is almost 15. Her and the ex fight all the time. My son wont even go over there any more.

When she gave up on him and I got him I was still paying her for about 5 months. This is how I was paid back. Frist they would take the money out of my check, then they would take 40 dollars of that money and give it back to me. So in my eyes I was never paid back.

Now I'm paying the lawyer to get my little girl before she gets to messed up.

[blgoose]

Mnfishingguy,The tax form u r looking for is 8332.Release of claim to Exemption for a child, But she has to sign it! to get the ded. After 5 years of waiting and not claiming a darn thing for my son. She gave it to me.BECAUSE SHE HAD NO INCOME FOR 03. I Havent filed taxes yet so stay tuned..think maybe a refund coming..

[HoleHopper]

Scumfrog, I was in the same boat as you!
The whole first year that I had (physical custady) of my son I had to ****inue to pay her support for more than a year, while she ****inued to delay the court hearings. All the while costing me buckue $'s for my loyer.
She never paid me back one dime, for the support of her son. And whats ironic is the fact that the courts did not order her to pay it back either.
Oh well, got to move on, and over all I am glad I did what I had to do for my son,
Good day, HoleHopper

[HoleHopper]

Guess I cant say that, Those darn ***'s

[HoleHopper]

JR1318, 'Excuses', That is my X's middle name. So I do understand where you are coming from. What you are doing for your stepchildren is great. I commend you.
Good fishing
HoleHopper

[SCUMFROG]

You know what I just don't understand, is why these ex's have to use the kids to get back at the other person. I hate hearing about that and i hate it when my ex does that to me.

I almost had my girl until the ex gave her back her cell phone and t.v. and let her hang out with anyone she wanted to. (She took that stuff away cause she wanted to live with me.)

Don't they realize what they are doing to them?

[JohnMickish]

Did you guys know that in North Dakota if you fall behind on you payments (for whatever reason) they can suspend your hunting and fishing permits?

[can it be luck?]

Hey jr., believe it, I said it, do the math. Yes, you'll always have to pay for certain living expenses whether you live by yourself or not. Now for every "extra" child you have your thrown an extra $400-$1000 a month from a different Dad. Pick the right "Daddy"...and you're raking it in! 10 kids at $1000 a month, WOW! $10,000 a month! Now for example, the mom's a "crackhead" and feeds her kids(if even at all) maybe some dry cereal once in a while or some nasty hot dogs....Do you see what I'm saying?? Did you read my earlier post THOUROUGHLY...or just bits and pieces???? Just like welfare, the system is setup for abuse. Not always...But can be!
I've had my share of child raising, whether by support or them living with me I know. I've a 22 yo daughter and a 18 yo son. My daughter moved out not to long ago to California, she moved from MY HOUSE. So yes I know. The funny thing is, for a time there I was still paying support while she lived with me!

------------------
http://groups.msn.com/canitbeluck

[This message has been edited by can it be luck? (edited 03-31-2004).]

[big drift]

maybe some of your guys experiance will help me I have joint custody with my oldest daughter and i am paying support but during the summer i have her all the time is it possible to have support cancelled during that time or not, also my support keeps going up even though my wages don't and now i am remarried with three other kids. I love my daughter and pay for her insurance, sports, vacations, etc. i don't get to see her much except for school holidays due to the distances and the disruption she had when we tried. no easy way around it it all sucks for those involved. the funniest thing is when we last went to court my ex wanted my current wifes income included in the tally the judge outright laughed because we got her to say on the stand that it was for her new boyfreind that she left me for new bar refrigerator. oh well 7 years and counting then she wants to move in with us to go to college. just wanted to vent

[Fish Head]

After reading this.......suddenly my wife doesn't seem so bad after all.

[can it be luck?]

Dobber, time heals all things....But during this time it can be overwhelming to deal with daily affairs of life. Seperation, breakups, divorce, custody battles, child support, visitation, etc. can take it's toll on a person. Just when you think your life is complete, something like that happens.
Hang in there buddy! Time will heal all wounds.
I know that may sound pretty generic, but it's all I can say to help. I've been down that road before.
Keep taking it day by day, Mark

------------------
http://groups.msn.com/canitbeluck

[bucketmouth64]

Dobber, I can sympathize what you are going thru. I went thru the samething the first 1-2 years. It takes faith in the Lord to help thru you all of the unfortunate pain. I went to counseling with church pastors and it helped greatly. Just make sure you get a counselor who has some years behind them instead of the young ones who only can give you text book answers. Another thing that helped was my church offered a divorce care group program. Went thru it twice and that helped me the most because you get to hear first hand that your problems/emotions are not so unique. I found some good support in the group and it was good to talk about your situation because everyone understood. As far as me, over the years(6) the pain has subsided more and more. And now I don't stress over it. Hang in there Dobber, there is light at the end of the tunnel.

[Grabs]

Dobber, I think something to keep your mind away from this would be helpful, at minimum some kind of distraction, something to look forward to each day, each week or each month. And I don't mean drinkin' to forget about it!

I assume you like to hunt and fish? Are you involved in any leagues or clubs? Something like this would be a great thing to get involved in.

Good luck man, things will work out!

[This message has been edited by Grabs (edited 03-31-2004).]

[ackotz]

"Never mind"...-- Andy

[This message has been edited by ackotz (edited 03-31-2004).]

[bucketmouth64]

big drift,

Yes you can stop the COLA increases that take affect every 2 years. You need to prove that your income has not gone up. I believe you need to bring in paycheck stubs as proof. You can go to your court administrator, contact your social worker, or contact an attorney. Other things that can stop the increase are increases in your health care cost premiums. I think you need to show a 20% increase. As far as not paying during visitations you can have that done too. I had that put in our divorce decree. Didn't make sense to me why she should get money when I had the kids. If you don't have this agreement in your decree, assuming you are divorced, then you might have to contact an attorney. If this can stay out of the courts the better. Judges don't like to hear changes in divorce decree once established unless it is significant. Hope this helps, good luck.

[big drift]

bucketmouth

thanks thats what i thought i work for a law firm but did not want to mix work and personal as i deal with the criminal aspect of it all. to all of you out there just remember the pain comes and goes and to take care of yourself first so you can be there for the kids, and most of all even if you have to move for the sake of all it is no longer about you and her it is about you and your kids and where to go next, you need to be the adult and rise above the mind games and manipulation and focus on your priorities it will all eventually fade

big drift

[Guest]

Dobber, if you're willing to try something that has has helped me and several of my closest friend's give me shout via email

[email protected]

It's nothing out of the ordinary, your plight touched some of my old "wounds".

------------------
Chells

[rockhardinmn]

#1 the Kids COME FIRST Period.
#@ Your are now #2 ,Wanna guess who is Last?

#3Last and for most; your exs RIGHTS to be part of YOUR LIFE HAS BEEN REVOKED!so cover your rear cause they will try anything and everything to get at you
this is from a guy who paid a divoirce lawyer $10,000 in 6 months to not get divorced.On the other Hand the wife found out just how down and dirty i would get to give my kids the choices they deserved. ans yes i am still married to that same woman today .

to those with out your kids ,,, at a certain age the kids may decide NOT to live with the Spouse they are living with now . if this takes place when they are old enough to be listened to by the court(13min)odds are you will then get custody of the kids after a court Battle, Listen to your kids , explain to them that if thats what they decide they want you will have to more than likely fight mom for them to have that choice.if that happens dont count on her coughing any cash up even if it is odered for her to do so ,, the state of Mn is really bad about forceing the wife to pay a thing.

[This message has been edited by rockhardinmn (edited 03-31-2004).]