National Push to Ban Lead Ammo and Fishing Tackle

[swamptiger]

Quote:

if lead was banned in ammo and fishing tacle we all will still be buying ammo and tackle, we just have to adjust...

Some of us need to be convinced there is a problem first.

[HC Eye Hunter]

Is this lead bullet hype based on what a doctor out in Bismark said?! Why all of a sudden an attack on the rifle ammo we use? Why is someone else deciding for me what kind of bullet I can and can't shoot?! I certainly don't want too, nor will I eat bullet fragments be it lead or copper as I do not consider bullet fragments part of my diet. I also won't eat plastic wrappers, metal soup cans and all he materials used to contain store boughten food products. I don't need the government or anyone else telling me this cause I always cut out the bloodshot meat making sure all the meat is clean and I always remove the wrapping on my food products. It is all pretty simple.

[jerkbait]

sounds to me like everyone who is fighting to keep lead is scared they will end up paying more for ammo if this ban happens..... this is kind of like gas, when gas was like 99cents a gal everyone complained kinda like how i know some who complain about ammo right now, when gas prices rose everyone got scared about how much it will cost to go places and what gas will cost now, well gas prices rose to almost 3 bucks a gal now and were all still buying it and using just as much of it as we were when it was cheap, we adjusted to the change... if lead was banned in ammo and fishing tacle we all will still be buying ammo and tackle, we just have to adjust...

my 2 cents is a lead bb and a steel bb will be left on the ground and they will be there for many years, but the lead bb is more toxic and harmful than the steel bb, my name isnt NATURESRESPECT just because, ill pay the extra cash and have a less harmful metal left behind

To just go to a complete ban would be really exspensive. Exspecailly the fishing tackle. I can understand the shotgun shot but not the ban on lead bullets or fishing tackle. I probably have $1000 dolars in Muskie lures and I am not going to just throw them away and replace them, not to mention all the jigs in my tackle box. The lead shot in waterfowl was proven to make a differance, the rest of this now is just feel good nonsense. If companies stop making lead products I will gladly buy the new stuff, but I am not going to take what I currently have and just dump it in the garbage because of some feel good law someday.

[NaturesRespect]

To just go to a complete ban would be really exspensive. Exspecailly the fishing tackle. I can understand the shotgun shot but not the ban on lead bullets or fishing tackle. I probably have $1000 dolars in Muskie lures and I am not going to just throw them away and replace them, not to mention all the jigs in my tackle box. The lead shot in waterfowl was proven to make a differance, the rest of this now is just feel good nonsense. If companies stop making lead products I will gladly buy the new stuff, but I am not going to take what I currently have and just dump it in the garbage because of some feel good law someday.

you have a really good point. They would most likely allow the use of lead bullets and lead tackle but ban the marketing and selling of lead products, if the ban were to happen that is. who knoes man this is a never ending debate

[psepuncher]

Is this lead bullet hype based on what a doctor out in Bismark said?! Why all of a sudden an attack on the rifle ammo we use?

I can't answer the "why all of a sudden now" question. But yes,

it's because of him.

What I found out about the guy is not only is he a physician, but

he also sits on the board of Governors for an ethanol company.

Some people might want to question why that is bad.

[jeffreyd]

However some states have already put a ban on lead ammo. In California it is the whole state, in AZ it affects only a couple WMU's in the northern part of the state. Until I read this article, I never knew who this doctor in ND was, this topic has been discussed for years in AZ. As far as the Wikipedia stats, those are great, but to answer your question should we stop driving, clearly we know the answer to that. But states, cities, and game and fish departments put signs up to indicate the presence of wildlife, they put management criteria in place to lower the numbers of wildlife on roads, and I can share here in AZ on highway 260 east of Payson they put in a diversion device that forces wildlife into a tunnel vs crossing the road. There are also flashing lights to warn drivers of elk and deer on the side of the road. So your example of dead or roadkill animals is great, it is moot in my opinion since we are talking about lead and not 3000k of plastic.

[NETim]

Some of us need to be convinced there is a problem first.

+1

This thing carries with it the stench of Global Warming.

[HC Eye Hunter]

WOW! So one guy, a doctor, that lives in ND, has stirred up this much controversy on the subject of lead fishing tackle and lead bullets. The fact that the whole fishing industry, the ammunition manufacturers and us hunters are listening to what one guy that lives in ND says is crazy. We are in hard economic times and hunting and fishing is already an expensive endevor with fuel and the current cost of equipment. As everyone knows both hunting and fishing industries are already suffering with the current economic trend and the fact is there are getting to be less and less hunters and anglers. I can't imagine the new costs of copper bullets and non lead jigs. As the costs get driver up there will be fewer and fewer hunters and fishermen. I am sure that a doctor sitting on the board of Governers for an ethonal company will have no problems affording bullets and jigs while he single handedly stirs up enough controversy to help bankrupt the hunting and fishing industries.

One bullet, one kill cut out the bloodshot area and make sure the meat is clean seems to be a cheaper and more economical way of handling the bullet controversy. As far as lead and fishing, prove to me that we are harming the wildlife and I will listen. If they can't prove a legitamate claim where lead jig heads/weights is a serious risk to fish, birds and what ever else, then leave it alone.

[swamptiger]

Quote:

However some states have already put a ban on lead ammo. In California it is the whole state,

Not sure it's a good idea for anyone to use California as a good example for anything...

[psepuncher]

This thing carries with it the stench of Global Warming.

Well, I want to know why Cornatzer thinks it's ok to throw pollution in the air, on land and in water.

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Overview

Red Trail Energy, LLC was organized as a North Dakota limited liability company on July 16, 2003 (the “Company.”) We were originally formed for the purpose of raising capital to develop, construct, own and operate a 50 million gallon per year corn-based ethanol plant in Richardton, North Dakota. Based on estimates from our design engineer, ICM Inc., we expect our ethanol plant to annually process approximately 18 million bushels of corn into 50 million gallons of denatured fuel grade ethanol, 170,000 tons of dried distillers grains with solubles, or 430,000 tons of distillers wet grains. In this process we will consume approximately 133,000 tons of lignite coal per year. Unless otherwise indicated, whenever we use the terms we, us, our or ours, we mean the Company.

We anticipate that our business will be that of the production and marketing of ethanol and distillers dried and wet grains. We have entered into an agreement with Commodity Specialist Company, Inc. located in Minneapolis, Minnesota to market our dried grains with solubles. We intend to be our own marketer of wet grains, and we have entered into an agreement with Renewable Products Marketing Group, LLC located in Minneapolis, Minnesota to market our entire ethanol output.

approximately 90 percent of ethanol is produced from a mix of corn and other input

Most ethanol is currently produced from corn and other raw grains, such as milo or sorghum, especially in the Midwest. The current trend in ethanol production research is to develop an efficient method of producing ethanol from cellulose-based biomass, such as agricultural waste, forest residue, municipal solid waste and energy crops.

Based on ICM data, we expect that our plant will burn approximately 133,000 tons of lignite coal per year (375 tons of lignite coal per day) for which we have a ten-year contract with General Industries, Inc. d/b/a Center Coal Company. This contract provides that we can purchase and have delivered to our plant approximately 133,000 tons of lignite coal annually, or 375 tons per operating day

Based on the ICM plans, our plant is expected to make approximately 166,500 tons annually of raw carbon dioxide and release it into th atmosphere. At this time, we do not intend to capture it.

William E. Cornatzer,

Dr. Cornatzer has been a practicing physician in Bismarck and Dickinson, North Dakota since 1985. In addition, he owns farms in Oliver County and Burleigh County, North Dakota.

Dr. Cornatzer has served as a Governor since our inception

Now they're talking about adding at least 100 more ethanol plants.

I think for the most part we're all right...until they continue to build more plants.

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coal pollution is not limited to carbon dioxide, which warms up our planet

coal burning releases nitrogen dioxide and sulphur dioxide. Both chemicals make acid rain, which in turn is making the oceans more acidic

All coal burning releases soot. Many people die from inhaling soot each year

coal burning creates ash The ash often contains traces of heavy metals such as cadmium, lead, mercury and arsenic.

coal burning release mercury into the atmosphere. Some species of fish are very good at absorbing mercury and that makes eating those species dangerous for the very young and for pregnant women.

The "clean coal" campaign was always more PR than reality — currently there's no economical way to capture and sequester carbon emissions from coal, and many experts doubt there ever will be. But now the idea of clean coal might be truly dead, buried beneath the 1.1 billion gallons of water mixed with toxic coal ash that on Dec. 22 burst through a dike next to the Kingston coal plant in the Tennessee Valley and blanketed several hundred acres of land, destroying nearby houses. The accident — which released 100 times more waste than the Exxon Valdez disaster — has polluted the waterways of Harriman, Tenn., with potentially dangerous levels of toxic metals like lead and mercury, and left much of the town uninhabitable

[PurpleFloyd]

Wikipedia:

In 1993, 25 schools throughout New England participated in a roadkill study involving 1,923 animal deaths. By category, the fatalities were:[5]

81% mammals

15% birds

3% reptiles and amphibians

1% indiscernible

Extrapolating this data nationwide, Merritt Clifton, editor of Animal People Newspaper estimated that the following animals are being killed by motor vehicles in the United States annually:[6]

41 million squirrels

26 million cats

22 million rats

19 million opossums

15 million raccoons

6 million dogs

350,000 deer

This study may not have considered differences in observability among taxa (i.e. dead raccoons are easier to see than dead frogs[citation needed]), and has not been published in peer-reviewed scientific literature.

This doesn't include insects, frogs, lizards, snakes, etc.. The number of roadkilled deer actually looks low to me, but I don't have any statistics at hand to back it up. Does this mean we should quit driving?

It looks to me like the number on cats should be much higher

[PurpleFloyd]

If it is a good practice to ban lead shot because waterfowl ingest is and then die it would only stand to reason that all of the lead sinkers, jigs etc that are used for fishing would have similar results so why would that be resisted if it is so easy to accept banning shot?

Secondly there would be an added exposure to birds that eat fish that contain lead (Ever had a fish break your line with a lead jig still in the fish's mouth ?). That would more than likely be the eagles, hawks, possibly pelicans etc.

I am not going to go out and advocate the ban on lead but if it happens I am pretty sure I will adjust and move on just like I did when they took lead out of gas and I had to switch to unleaded.

[swamptiger]

Quote:

It looks to me like the number on cats should be much higher

No argument there...

And the article doesn't even mention skunks...

[Scott M]

Funny looking back that the EPA concluded they couldn't ban lead in ammunition and fishing tackle on the grounds that they don't have the authority, when they had the authority to do so with paint, gasoline, particulate emissions, etc.

I don't think this issue is put to bed, I see the same groups bringing it forward in 2011 with lawsuits.