Sioux Logo

[cbrooks]

Hmmm, the fighting Dakota's. Scoring for the fighting Dakota's # 21 Matt Fratin. It doesn't sound as good.

BTW, Scott got that UND book I ask you about month ago. Highly recommend any UND hockey fan to read. Title"Fight on Sioux".

[Steve Foss]

Yeah, it's a good book. The old man knows his hockey onions, and knows his Sioux hockey history. He started learning hockey when he was barely out of diapers, and started learning Sioux hockey in 1969.

Fighting Dakotas? Since it's the University of North Dakota, I doubt anyone would want to see the University of North Dakota Fighting Dakotas.

[cbrooks]

Wow 41 years of covering Sioux hockey. What year did he retire? I read somewhere that he covered college hockey longer than any sportswriter in the country and that was ten years ago.

[DHK]

Why not change the name/logo to "Canadians" as a way to welcome recruits and fully reflect the composition of the team? The current roster has only two North Dakotans.

[wolfman-k]

Yeah, Montreal won't mind now would they? Try again, then again don't.

[Steve Foss]

Wow 41 years of covering Sioux hockey. What year did he retire? I read somewhere that he covered college hockey longer than any sportswriter in the country and that was ten years ago.

I think he's been retired for three years. I lost count. He decided to retire when the sports editor at the time pulled him off the Sioux hockey beat in favor of a "change of pace." Retirement was the best move he ever made, he said. Now he gets to do whatever he wants with his time, and he still gets to cover Sioux hockey. Good gig if you can get it!

That sports editor has since moved on to a career in public relations.

[cbrooks]

Well, he's still the voice of the fighting Sioux even in retirement. I'm glad he still writes a column.

[scsavre]

The canadians, now thats funny. Where were you when I was outnumbered the hole second half the year.

[cbrooks]

Where were you when I was outnumbered the hole second half the year.

Yeah right. There's way more Gopher fans or Sioux haters on here.

[Scoot]

Why not change the name/logo to "Canadians" as a way to welcome recruits and fully reflect the composition of the team?

The accuracy of that joke really makes it funny!!!

[DHK]

Since Montreal's team isn't the "Canadians" but rather the "Canadiens" I can't see why they'd mind.

[cbrooks]

I can't help that the Canadains what to get a quality education at a good school:)

[Scoot]

I can't help that the Canadains what to get a quality education at a good school:)

Did you learn to spell "Canadains" at said "good school"?

Just funnin' ya, cbrooks! I sure miss the old NDSU/UND days...

[cbrooks]

, I totally just put my foot in my mouth. I'll get ya back Scoot

[Scoot]

, I totally just put my foot in my mouth. I'll get ya back Scoot

Now THAT, I believe! But, when you sling it, ya gotta be able to take it. ...and, I sling plenty.

For the record, I've been a Bison my whole life (at least since I was three years old or so). I've similarly NOT liked the UND sports teams. However, I think this whole thing is hogwash and I sure hope it gets resolved in some manner that allows UND to keep its nickname/logo. What a joke.

[cbrooks]

Yeah its really early to say what will happen for sure but I like the chances for the nickname as of lately.

I just saw on the news tonight that UND will play NDSU in basketball next year. I wonder who will win LOL. Well at least we are getting closer to having a football game. Hey Scoot, who won that last game?

[Steve Foss]

Here's some of the latest:

From the Grand Forks Herald, by Virg Foss

The tribal council of Standing Rock Reservation, presented with a petition including more than 1,000 names of Native Americans calling for a vote on the use of the Fighting Sioux nickname at UND, asked the state for direction.

The North Dakota State Board of Higher Education gave it to them — they effectively told the Sioux tribe to go to hell, though not that bluntly, of course.

Didn’t matter that the Spirit Lake Sioux had overwhelmingly voted to support the nickname. Didn’t matter that very likely it would have received the same support at Standing Rock, had the board allowed time for democracy to proceed and a vote take place. It apparently doesn’t matter to the Board of Higher Education. How else can one explain the ruling? Had that scenario played out, North Dakota would have met the criteria spelled out in the court case agreement with the NCAA, winning approval of the two Sioux tribes in the state to keep the name.

I heard the news on my car radio last week as I passed by the little Minnesota town of Effie on my way to Ely for the weekend. What an Effieing joke, I thought to myself.

I still hold out hope that the Fighting Sioux name can be saved. The Board of Higher Education painted itself into a corner, no doubt. If Standing Rock holds a vote and approves use of the name, what does the SBoHE do then? How could the board not restore the name? History is ripe with land grabs and other abuses by our ancestors from the Native Americans. To not let the democratic process play out at Standing Rock and that voice be heard would add another sordid chapter.

I understand the communication between the SBoHE and the two Sioux tribes, Standing Rock in particular, has been difficult, for many reasons. I understand UND’s rush to join the Summit League to end nightmare/costly scheduling as a Division I independent, in basketball in particular. It doesn’t excuse a rush to judgment by the SBoHE in taking away the Fighting Sioux name until all voices are heard.

I am puzzled, too, about UND’s voices — other than that of Ralph Engelstad Arena officials — being so quiet through this process. I have no idea where UND President Robert Kelley or athletic director Brian Faison stand on the Fighting Sioux name. You can fault the media for not pressing them on the matter, or you can fault leadership for not making their views known.

I understand, too, that the decision was taken away from UND by the SBoHE and perhaps that explains the sound of silence whispering from the offices of UND’s leaders. Yet they took away the decision, not the voices, so I am have been puzzled by this.

UND’s coaches and athletes have been eloquent in their comments about the pride and honor they feel going by the Fighting Sioux name. None more so than women’s basketball coach Gene Roebuck, who said he’d give up a chance of Summit League membership if it meant the school could retain the nickname. That was a powerful statement by a man who understands the issues and passions as well as any in the state.

If the name does go away, we don’t need a replacement, for a long, long time. In our hearts, we’ll be Fighting Sioux forever. For UND to force another name upon its fans any time soon would alienate many who already feel the hurt of being disenfranchised. And please don’t leave that decision in the hands of the SBoHE if it comes to that eventually. They’d probably think calling UND the “Little Bison” would sound cool.

The North Dakota State Board of Higher Education has given me no reason to trust it to make an educated decision in any issue regarding the Fighting Sioux name. All I’m asking is for the state to allow the voices of Standing Rock to be heard.

If Standing Rock votes no, I can live with a name change. I would respect the wishes of the tribe. If Standing Rock does vote and the vote is yes, I hope the SBoHE has the wisdom and fortitude to reverse itself. Slow down, please, let democracy have its say. After all, isn’t that what our country is supposed to be all about?

Virg Foss, who wrote sports for the Grand Forks Herald for 36 years until his retirement, writes a weekly column exclusively for the Herald from October through April. Contact him at [email protected] or at (701) 772-9272.

[cbrooks]

Nicely done. Thanks for posting Steve. Virg sum it all up in at least amount of words possible. I love the effie reference.

[LMITOUT]

"Little Bison".

[rayguy]

ND CRYBABIES

[cbrooks]

"Little Bison".

Now that is offensive to any UND fan. I would rather be called the Canucks

[wolfman-k]

Steve, thanks for posting your Dad's article on this, his opinion does really matter to alot of us. I do, obviously, agree 100% with his take. I can only hope some common sense will settle this issue once and for all.

[scsavre]

Good info and a perfect summary to what many think. , thanks steve.

[Steve Foss]

The latest:

From the Grand Forks Herald by Chuck Haga, Staff Writer

Gov. John Hoeven has advised the chancellor of the North Dakota University System to “give due consideration to any vote by the Standing Rock Sioux Tribe” regarding the UND Fighting Sioux nickname if it occurs before Nov. 30.

In his letter to Chancellor Bill Goetz, dated Tuesday, Hoeven noted that the state Supreme Court recently affirmed the State Board of Higher Education’s “authority and responsibility to decide on the use of the logo” subject to a lawsuit and settlement agreement involving UND and the NCAA, which considers American Indian nicknames and logos hostile and abusive.

The board on April 8 directed UND to begin the transition away from the 80-year-old nickname.

“It is important, however, that all involved in the process of deciding whether or not to retain it feel that they have been adequately heard,” the governor wrote.

Hoeven was asked last week by nickname supporters at the Spirit Lake Sioux Tribe to use his influence with higher education officials to allow the people of Standing Rock to speak to the issue. He forwarded a copy of that appeal, from the Spirit Lake Committee for Understanding and Respect, to Goetz and to Richie Smith, president of the higher education board.

Under terms of the lawsuit settlement between UND and the NCAA, the university had until Nov. 30 to win the blessing of the two namesake tribes or begin retiring the nickname and logo.

Spirit Lake voters gave their support last year, but the Standing Rock Tribal Council, citing procedural hurdles and calling such a vote a low priority, has not scheduled one despite the presentation by nickname supporters on the reservation of petitions containing more than 1,000 signatures.

Tribal officials have said they are looking into what would be required by tribal law and the Standing Rock constitution to hold a plebiscite on the nickname.

Eunice Davidson, one of the signers of the Spirit Lake appeal, said that she and others on her committee “would have liked a more forceful response” from the governor. “But I think he responded the best he could, and we are grateful for the governor’s statement,” she said. “I believe it leaves the door open, if Standing Rock does have their vote, for the Board of Higher Education to revisit their decision.”

Erich Longie, a member of the Spirit Lake tribe who opposes the nickname, said the governor’s letter changes nothing.

“The logo is retired,” he said. “The Fighting Sioux nickname is retired. As far as I’m concerned, the thing is over. You can’t put the genie back in the bottle.”

Longie said that he and other nickname opponents at Spirit Lake have collected about 300 signatures on petitions asking for another vote there.

“We don’t see the need to do that now,” he said, “but if circumstances change we will request another vote. We believe we’ve changed some minds, and another vote will go against the nickname.”

UND President Robert Kelley said he doesn’t believe the governor’s suggestions to the board alter the university’s situation. “We’re proceeding to implement the charge from the chancellor” to begin the transition, he said.

Jody Hodgson, general manager of Ralph Engelstad Arena, said however that he was “encouraged” by the governor’s letter.

“I support the governor’s request for the board to re-evaluate and reconsider their position,” he said.

Duaine Espegard, a member of the state board from Grand Forks, said today the board “absolutely” would revive the nickname issue if Standing Rock votes and offers its support.

“It appears the governor agrees with what we’ve been saying,” he said. “Should they vote at Standing Rock, and it is positive (toward continued use of the nickname), we would certainly give them consideration — and beyond that, go with them.”

So far, “no progress has been made” on arranging a vote at Standing Rock, Espegard said. “But if they do vote, and they give approval and a long-term agreement, absolutely I’ll bring it back,” he said.

“It’s what I anticipated the governor would say,” board member Grant Shaft, also of Grand Forks, said.

“We all agree it would be the best scenario if Standing Rock members were able to vote,” he said. “That’s what we’ve been asking for for 2½ years. And if they do vote, the board should give that due consideration.”

Charles Murphy, the Standing Rock tribal chairman, and Jesse Taken Alive, a council member who opposes UND’s use of the nickname, were not available for comment.

Davidson said she has talked with Archie Fool Bear, a leader of the Standing Rock petition drive seeking a vote there.

“I think a thousand people, their signatures on a petition — that says a lot,” Davidson said. “So I hope they (members of the tribal council) allow them to have a vote. They should.”

[Bear55]

I haven't heard anything in a while, any news Sioux fans?