Gun case bill

[BlueLundFishrman]

my guess, based on nothing more than personal observation while at a few different lodges, is that many of these accidental discharges in south dakota involved pheasant hunters in the field. low shots, quick excited shots, idiots who hunt pheasants 1 weekend out of the year with a gun they bought at scheels or sportsmans the minute they stepped off the plane....etc etc.

I agree. I would also place a hunch that alcohol is a factor in some of these.

[Capt. Don*]

Exactly, I lived in Kansas more than a few years ago. Traveled and worked in KS, NE, ND, SD. and hunted in all the states. No case laws in any of the states, fully loaded allowed in KS and SD. Some of my guns stayed cased for cosmetic reasons,others were out, never had one in the chamber, but magazine or clips were loaded at times. Unsafe, heck no. Often wondered why the case laws existed in MN. If this were to pass why would anyone care, you would still be able to case your guns if you want, plenty of MN people I hunt with in other states do. My guess is that if they repeal the case law and it bothers people, those people are the type that like to make everyone elses business their own and I think they need to take care of themselves and mind their own friggin' business.

Had the Big Sky racks mounted on the roof, best gun racks made.

[fisherking01]

Never have trusted a gun in a case myself. If I can't see the chamber, I assume it is loaded, but it always makes me nervous, especially handling a cased gun that belongs to someone else. Ie. I had a friend, more of an aquaintance, that leased land for hunting from my Dad. Upon returning to his residence, he was unloading the truck, grabbed a cased gun, Wrong End first, and as he pulled it from his suburban, it discharged, 20 guage in the guts, 2 feet away, = dead man. Cases are great for cosmetic care. Good for nothing else. The cheater will cheat, the poacher will poach, For everyone else cases do not matter.

[Augusta]

The only hunters in North Dakota that I"ve seen with uncased guns are the one's who slam on the brakes, jump out of the truck or car, run past the no hunting signs shooting, grab the bird and speed off! We don't need the same in Minnesota, whether in a vehicle or on an ATV! Keep the gun case law!

And did you notice that they all had Minnesota license plates....

[Splake]

Well said. I notice when hunting in situations without cases, more attention is paid to muzzle control. It seems when a gun is in a case, people consider it safe and and don't give it as much respect.

[Recon]

And did you notice that they all had Minnesota license plates....

As a matter of fact the three times this year were all residents. All I was saying is that in my opinion, uncased firearms are going to result in more violations. Shooting from the road, etc. " Convenience" seems like a poor reason for removing the gun case bill!

[SM1]

There would probably be too much red tape involved, but maybe the state should consider a "trial period" of one or two years to see if accident and violation rates change.

If someone still wants to have cased guns-then case them. At least give everyone the option.

[Splake]

So it's the gun that's responsible for the violation?

[96trigger]

Do you guys really think the people who are shooting the deer in road ditches and doing drive care if their gun is cased/loaded or not? Its not like I'm going to suddenly say, "Hey, my gun can be uncased, sweet, I can start road hunting." Just like the guys that are breaking the laws aren't going to quit because, its not quite as exciting.

[BobT]

Ditto. That kind of thinking is just nothing more than more ammunition for the anti-gun, anti-hunting, anti-everything else groups.

Maybe it's time this society starts taking responsibility for its own actions and requiring the same.

Bob

[Cootz]

All I have to say is I've never once killed anyone in Montana, South and North Dakota where I ALWAYS have the gun uncased except where I don't want it damaged. All the laws/rules in the world don't mean anything if you don't have enforcement. Maybe the state could make a law for someone else to shoot my guns so I don't have to worry about hurting myself. When are we ever going to get back to having consequences for our own actions?

[Tom7227]

As I've noted before the implications of this change go well beyond hunting safety.

As a prosecutor I charged hundreds of gun crime cases. A huge number of them started with instances where the presence of an uncased gun was found in a car, and many many times that led to much more significant charges - for example dope found after the car was searched incident to the arrest on the uncased charge, felon in possession charges... I suspect that more illegal transportation of a firearm charges are filed in urban areas than rural areas.

The other problem with the bill is that it currently allows the guns to be both uncased and loaded. It is a bit hard to read because there's a double negative in the bill. Cornish and Dill claim that it is a drafting error but so far it hasn't been changed.

And for those who want to apply labels - no I am not anti-gun. I own many and enjoy hunting, target shooting and such. I am strongly anti-crooks with guns however.

Tom

[Black_Bay]

The other problem with the bill is that it currently allows the guns to be both uncased and loaded. It is a bit hard to read because there's a double negative in the bill. Cornish and Dill claim that it is a drafting error but so far it hasn't been changed.

So I was right it did say you could have a loaded uncased weapon.

I better show that to the wife. I was right one time.

[Cootz]

Even though other states allow for a loaded firearm including one in the chamber, I do not load a round into the chamber. But then again, I believe my father and grandfather instilled the right values. Back to personal responsibility. I'm really not trying to start a fight with you Tom7227 but if that person had an uncased gun in the the vehicle with them in possession of Illegal substance and got a stiffer sentence/penalty I'm really not feeling a whole lot of sympathy. If it happened to me I'd pretty much say I deserved it. I used to say to my friends that I had a lot of bad luck (back when I tipped the bottle a lot more) and one of my good friends said to me and opened my eyes, "No, your luck is just fine. Your CHOICES are what are bad." Changed the way I look at things.

[96trigger]

Quote:

I'm really not trying to start a fight with you Tom7227 but if that person had an uncased gun in the the vehicle with them in possession of Illegal substance and got a stiffer sentence/penalty I'm really not feeling a whole lot of sympathy.

I don't think he wants us to feel sorry for them. I think he wants us to realize that the gun case law has led to bigger arrests than just an uncased gun, like possession etc....and that it is not necessarily a bad thing. Most of us probably don't want people that are under the influence to be using guns.

As my previous post stated, I don't think those people will stop doing illegal things, but a good point was made about the gun case law making it easier for CO's and Police to search for other violations.

[Cootz]

Ya, I guess I only see it threw the eyes of a sportsman. Thankfully my immediate world doesn't involve those issues.

[kkahmann]

I have a problem with Police using the Game and Fish Act to go on a fishing expedition looking for Criminal Code violations. Seems like a Slick Willy way to get around the Constitution.

[96trigger]

I don't, but thats another topic.

[BLACKJACK]

I have a problem with Police using the Game and Fish Act to go on a fishing expedition looking for Criminal Code violations. Seems like a Slick Willy way to get around the Constitution.

kkahmann, People complain about the ACLU - American Civil Liberties Union - but we need some organizations, even the news media, to watch over whats happening between cops and ordinary citizens so our rights don't get trampled.

Why do you suppose they want to make not wearing a seatbelt a primary offense? Saving lives? Naw, people that don't wear seatbelts usually smoke, or are dumb enough that they'll figure out some other way to kill themselves. Its so the cops can use it as an excuse to pull you over and go on a fishing expedition. You can't tell me that they can accurately see whether you have on your seatbelt when they meet you going down the road at 55 mph.

Back to the gun case law, its handy out in SoDak where we pheasant hunt not to case your gun because we go from spot to spot hunting, it may only be 5 minutes down the road, its just easier not to case, uncase, case, etc. Here in MN I would like to see the gun case law stand, it makes it easier to shutdown road hunters that ground pound pheasants, shoot at deer from the road, etc. That just gives all hunters a bad name.

[Splake]

BLACKJACK, that is a mighty high pedestal your on.

[big drift]

"I am strongly anti-crooks with guns however."

Tom,then why should the rights of non criminals be infringed upon? The criminals are already breaking the law.

Most crooks I have dealt with already do not use gun cases so why add more restrictions to law abiding people.

If the bad guys are armed with loaded weapons that is the charge to hold them accountable for as well as the amended charges for possession of a firearm while commiting a criminal act.

[SM1]

[BLACKJACK]

BLACKJACK, that is a mighty high pedestal your on.

Explain yourself - what part of my post didn't you like? About the ACLU? About the seatbelt law? About the gun case law?? My guess is that you're in law enforcement...

[kr8r.tom]

i thought you made some good points, i agree with 99%.

[Splake]

The thread is about the gun case bill. You said the SD non-case law worked for you. You weren't compelled to ground pound your pheasants and it seems you didn't shoot your self. Why does it work in SD,resident and nonresident, but it wouldn't work in MN?