Question On ATV Private/Agricultural Use Registration

[slotlimit]

I seen this on a previous post but the people that had them just stated that they just use them to check there fences and not just anyone can have them. I looked this up because I've just baught a new ATV and need to register it. I took this off the DNR site:

ATV Private/Agricultural Use Registration ATVs (Class 1 and Class 2)are registered for private use when used exclusively for agricultural activities, harvesting wood or on private property. A private use registration is valid until the ownership of the ATV is transferred.

By getting the dual permit from what I have read is you would be able to legally be able to drive on state and county roads. With the public permit you can just ride outside ditches and township roads. So if I carried around my chainsaw I should be able to drive on the road???? Maybe I would be better off carring some logs around???

[Dave S]

Depending on what class of ATV you bought. If you have a class 1, then you can operate within the ROW on any county roads as long as there are no ordinances that prohibit ATV's and you're using it for ag purposes like cutting wood. But trust me when I say that if a CO catches you on his way about his business for 2 weeks straight, you could get a citation if you're carrying a chainsaw just for the sake of riding on the road.

No matter what, your ATV needs to be registered, whether it's used only on private land, or public. In Willmar, ditches are now closed until August 2nd (closed dates are April 1st to August 1st).

[BobT]

That's a good point. Too many think that the Ag permit allows something it doesn't. Having the Ag permit only allows you to wave certain restrictions WHILE engaged in farming activity and you best be able to prove it.

Bob

[slotlimit]

I don't think the ag permit allows something it doesn't. To me if it's legal for a farmer to drive on the road to go tend to the animals, pull hay racks, cut wood, etc. It should be allowed for any responsible adult to drive on these same roads. Anything that relies using a ATV on road can be done using a pickup. It should be an all or nothing law. Someone with an ag permit can pull his hayrack down my road but I can't drive an 1/8th of a mile down the road to my neighbors. Come on! It is probably 100 times more dangerous pulling hayracks. An ATV doesn't have the stopping power in an emergency situation especially compared to a pickup whether the hay rack is full or not. Someone with an ag permit can drive down the road to his field where his combine is at or back home. I understand not riding in town and I don't think anyone under 18 should be allowed. But someone living in the country should be able to go for a joy ride around the section or to visit a neighbor.

[slotlimit]

I did read the part of ditches being closed. But from what I read it is the inside ROW of those ditches. If you a riding on the outter part of the ditch(away for the road) it is legal. I may have read it wrong but that's the way I uderstood it. I also don't think a CO would be in anyones neck of the wood for 2 weeks straight much less 2 days unless they live by you. They just have too much territory to cover if they are doing their job the right way to be sitting in the same spot. Which is too bad because maybe then they could be getting more of these people poaching and taking more fish then they are suppose to and the guys filling their freezers. They are even more conserned with people burning garbage. It's easy money writing those tickets.

[slotlimit]

Here is the section of the ROW I copied from the regulations it is a little confusing sounds like it could go either way depending on the mood of the CO.

Public road right-of-way means the entire right-of-way of a roadway that is not privately owned, including the traveled portions, banks, ditches, shoulders and medians.It is illegal to operate on the inside slope, shoulder, and roadway of state and county roads.

In one part it says ditch and in another it says the inside slope. SO which is it?

[Dave S]

Slot,

I have to agree to an extent that the law could/should be an all or nothing. I do believe the law was intended for farmers who are heading out to the fields or for related farm work so they can use their ATV that may get 20-30 mpg vs. the old chevy/ford/or dodge that only gets 9-10 mpg on short trips.

My comment about a CO seeing someone for 2 weeks was meant as if they live within a short distance and would happen to cross paths with a rider.

As far as the closure from April 1st to August 1st, it includes the entire ROW, from outside slope to outside slope. During the open periods, you can ride on the outside slope or outside half of the ditch (as shown in the diagram)of a county or state ROW as long as it's not otherwise prohibited by local ordinances.

[slotlimit]

I agree with you totally. I'm all for farmers taking the ATV. It's an excellent way to travel and easier to pull behind the combine out to the field. Thanks for clearing up the ditch riding as you can see the way the law is written it is a little confusing. I wonder if anyone has faught it in court and won.

[russ]

Lep7mm, FYI. I don't believe you can ride on ANY county (gravel) road. The regulation says you may ride on a TOWNSHIP road provided there are no regulations against it. Not all gravel roads are township, in fact most are not. Any county plat book identifies which are township and which are not. Gravel does not mean you can ride on it.

[Dave S]

Russ,

all of my posts are in reference to operating in the ditch (within the ROW) during the legal operating dates or on the road surface with the proper registration (private/agriculture).

DS

MN DNR ATV Instructor

[russ]

Lep7mm, Ooops, you're right. That's what happens when I don't start reading at the beginning I guess. My bad.

[Dave S]

No problem Russ. Even though I do the safety training for the DNR in my area, one of the BEEF's I have with the DNR is most of the laws don't change from year to year, but yet whoever types up the format for the regualtions has a tendency to change the text. This in turn leads to misinterpretations and confusion of what the laws really are.

My powerpoint presentation that I developed for my courses is over 100 pages long, including the written test. You can imagine the frustration of having to go through that every year and getting it to match the terminology in the regulations.

Either way, I feel it's worth my time if I can make a difference for our sport. Whether it's changing a perspective on what's ethical, moral, or just the right thing to do, my biggest goal is to help the students become better/safer operators of their equipment and to teach them to avoid injury or death.

[slotlimit]

Keep up the good work and thanks for the information.

[slotlimit]

Lep,

Here's my dilema. I live out in the country and I have 2 neighbors each about a 1/16th of a mile away from me on either side on the opposite side of a county road that is tar. Say a storm hits and they are gone or just being the nice guy that I am I decide to go plow their driveway out for them or just go over and help. Their is no way I would be able to take the ditch because around here they were full of snow to the top. If I did manage to get down the ditch I would still have to cross the road. By the slim chance that the DNR is around and they see me drive over their on the road or in the ditch and then cross the road they can give me a ticket for driving on the road. To do this legally I would have to load my ATV (class 1) on a trailer and haul it over. I'm not a dishonest person but other then the ag permit I don't see any way of getting around it. Both these people have horses so I could say I'm checking on them or just put a chainsaw on my ATV and grab a freshly cut piece of wood before returning home. If you have any other ideas that don't involve being dishonest I would love to hear them. Anther question I have is about riding in ditches where I own the land. If I have 40 acres running 1/4 mile along a road can I then ride in just that ditch? What if I own the land on both sides of the road? This is of course without the ag permit.

[Dave S]

Slot,

I don't know of any CO that would give you a ticket for plowing snow. That could be considered an "occupational" use and most CO's, not all, would probably let that slide.

If you owned land adjacent to the ROW, the ditch would still be off limits. I do understand that some people will mow the ditch to the pavement and there are currently no laws that forbid that. But ATV's are a whole different monster so to speak. Property owners only own up to a certain point, but the rest of it is considered county or state property.

Again, I ahve to admit that some of the laws on the books don't make a lick of sense and our legislators took a shoot from the hip stance when creating the laws without much thought into other necessities. But on the same note, we have ourselves to blame for not policing our own and now we pay the price. Snowmobilers went through the same troubles back in the 70's and were almost banned. Now it's our turn.

[BobT]

slotlimit,

I did not write the law nor did I suggest that I agree with it but as a farmer I certainly appreciate the ability to use my ATV for my farming operation. My primary reason for owning an ATV is due to my farming practices. The entertainment aspect comes second.

I use my ATV for farm related purposes other than just pulling trailers down the road, which is actually a rare use of it. I use my ATV for picking rock, fencing, field inspection, hauling parts, seed, tools, and myself to and from the field. This makes it easier and more economical to leave my equipment out in the field at the end of my day rather than driving the entire rig back to the house, which also reduces the impact my equipment has on the ground and the environment.

I am able to get into areas with my ATV that would not only be more damaging were I to use the truck or tractor but impossible under certain conditions. Just this past weekend I was out inspecting fence lines with my ATV, which would have been impossible using a truck or tractor. Had I tried to do it with a truck or tractor they would still be sitting out there probably until sometime in May. Its lightweight and 4wd make this possible with minimal impact. Even walking would have been far more work due to the muddy conditions plus the ATV made it possible to carry along all the tools and material I needed to do the job.

For some it can become necessary to work in classified wetland or ditches. Even so, the law still requires we keep our impact to a minimum.

This is MY property and yet I am forced by the rest of society to leave certain parts of it untouched because they have an interest in mind. I am also restricted from property I OWN and pay taxes on that is occupied by a biking/hiking/snowmobiling trail right-of-way of which I am not allowed to traverse using my ATV, tractor, truck, or horses. Sure I could be bitter but I support most of those laws and feel it is a small price to pay.

I am a hunter, outdoorsman, and conservationist and I support keeping my impact low. It’s other snowmobilers, ATV enthusiasts, and hunters that think my land is public property that I have to contend with. I have had people wantonly drive their trucks across my alfalfa fields during hunting seasons in a wet autumn causing ruts and tearing up my fields just to get closer to a pond that supports ducks. What’s worse is they could have taken a route that would not have damaged my crops. Do they have any idea what it costs to seed down and maintain alfalfa? Ever tried to walk a hay rack across rough ground?

Just a month ago someone buzzed my fields with snowmobiles feeding the pheasants out in the open on hill crests, something I believe is more harmful to the pheasant population because it exposes them to dangers from predators. I appreciate the thought but is it fair that they can assume to do this without my knowledge or approval? Do you think they respected the wetlands on my property? Of course not! They don’t have that much sense! Feed them out in the open where they are vulnerable and destroy their cover. It was a feel-good effort, nothing more.

So what is fair and right? Personally, I don't think it is fair to restrict road ditch travel during the summer months. I have never, and I mean never, found nesting birds in my road ditches. My hay fields, yes but road ditches, never. I believe they avoid that unless necessary because there is too much activity close to roads. Just my opinion though.

Bob

[slotlimit]

Lep,

Again thanks for the information. Are their currently organizations fighting to change some of these ignorant laws? Do they need a petition sign? A letter written to my legislator? When you say most CO's wouldn't give a ticket for that I would say yes 5 years ago. Now the older, wiser, more understanding CO's have been retiring and being replaced with young people that for some reason need to show their power and stick to the law word for word unreasonable or not.

[slotlimit]

Bob,

I could be totally wrong here but just by the way you write (Having the Ag permit only allows you to wave certain restrictions WHILE engaged in farming activity and you best be able to prove it.) It sounds to me that just because you are a farmer and the laws says what it says only you and others like you should be able to use an ATV AG Permit. So I guess if I'm a terrible person because I'm going to get an ag permit to plow my neighbors driveway or just drive over there to say hi...so be it.

I'm also all for you being able to do the things you can do with your ATV. Of course it is more logical to use your ATV for the things you use it for. I do however think you should not be able to haul a Loaded Hay rack down the ROAD for your safety and others no matter how often you do this.

Let me also ask you this and be honest. This is a question regarding the statment you wrote "Having the Ag permit only allows you to wave certain restrictions WHILE engaged in farming activity and you best be able to prove it." How many times during the checking fences, driving back to the house from the field, farming use of an ATV, etc. Did you happen to stop and talk to the neighbor, maybe see a deer down a different road so you go a little out of the way from the direct path to your house, drive you ATV on the road and then go hunting, put up a deer stand, drag a deer home, use your ATV to chase down the people with good or bad intentions on your land. I bet it has been many times and probably for sure the answer isn't "Never". These things would all be against the law. So please don't think bad of me because I'm going to get the ag permit to help out a neighbor or drive over and say hi. Not to drive 10 miles into town to pick up milk. Not to drive down the gravel road to visit a neighbor while tearing up the road with 10 donuts in my wake. My only feeling is that I don't feel like I should have to be dishonest to do something like this. I also would never drive across another mans land without asking first. But from what else you have written I understand you are a good law abiding man but we must admit some laws need to be changed. Because we all break laws even if we don't know it. Not to be bad people but becaeuse some laws just don't make sence. Just for fun I'm going to give you some laws that are on the books in Minnesota.

• A person may not cross state lines with a duck atop his head.

• A woman isn't allowed to cut her own hair without her husband's permission.

• All bathtubs must have feet.

• Every man in Brainerd, Minnesota is required by law to grow a beard.

• Hamburgers may not be eaten on Sundays.

• Harper Woods: It is illegal to paint sparrows to sell them as parakeets.

• In Minnesota, it's illegal to tease skunks. (As if being sprayed weren't enough of a deterrent.)

• It is illegal to sleep naked.

• Minneapolis: Red cars can not drive down Lake Street

• No man is allowed to make love to his wife with the smell of garlic, onions, or sardines on his breath in Alexandria, Minnesota. If his wife so requests, law mandates that he must brush his teeth.

• Virginia: You're not allowed to park your elephant on Main Street.

• Wayland: Anyone can keep their cow on Main Street downtown at a cost of 3 cents per day.

[Dave S]

BobT and Slot,

thanks for the replies. I think we're all on the same page as to what needs to be done. But, before any of these laws are changed, the general population of ATV riders needs to show that they can respect the land, both public and private. The sad thing is, there are the select few that refuse to abide by the laws or simply have no concept of what a good set of ethics and morals are.

BobT,

I agree in that in the years of walking roadsides or traveling in the ditches, I've never seen a significant number of nesting birds for the same reasons you mentioned above.

Slot,

I don't think that Bob was trying to imply that farmers, and only farmers, should have the special concessions to ride on the road surface. I feel he had a very well put post in regards to the needs of a farmers and how ATV's relate to those needs. If anyone in our state knows anything about land, it's our farmers. The land is their life and their paycheck. I have to commend Bob for some very well put comments about the impacts of an ATV vs. trucks or tractors and how much faster and easier it is to use an ATV vs. walking the fencelines. During the peak times of the year, time is money for the farmers.

It will take some time to change the laws to be more realistic. ATVAM has lobbyists at the capital who spend countless hours trying to keep our privilege to ride ATV's in MN. But we as an entire group of riders have to prove that we can show some restraint/discretion on how we (ATV riders) treat the land. Keep in mind that the non riding public doesn't know you from me or where we come from. They only look at the common denominator, the ATV. It only takes one "less reputible" indvidual to ruin the impression for all of us.

I would like to thank both of you for keeping this civil. Lots of great info.

DS

[BobT]

It sounds like you have taken offense to my opening comment. The purpose of my comment was not to boast or be condescending but rather to point out that the Ag permit does not legalize driving on otherwise areas that are off limits. Just having an Ag permit does not allow me or anyone the right to ignore the laws. If I am not in the performance of farming I am no more legally able to run a road ditch or county road than anyone else and I have not stated to the contrary. That is the law whether one agrees with it or not.

That some COs may turn their heads does not negate the law. Even those laws you pointed out that may be on the books can be enforced. It is likely that some of them may be overturned by society if they were and that is society's priviledge. In the same way, if we decide that some of the ATV rules are unfounded, unfair, ridiculous, or otherwise in need of reversal then we should vote to do just that. That is what we hire congress persons for.

Oh, and I would love to see the ATV that had the power and weight capable of pulling and/or stopping a fully loaded hayrack weighing in at over 4 tons.

Bob

[slotlimit]

Lep,

thanks for the reply again. Like I said I'm all for Farmers and people for that matter using tools to make their jobs easier and more economical. Most of my relatives are farmers and my Dad is an implement dealer. My Dad used to rent me out to pick rock, bail hay, pull weeds, etc. Every kid should have to do it. Not being a Farmer I don't know what laws concerning an ATV a Farmer would like changed. For me though starting with something in the lines of within 2 miles from home not including town if someone was to live that close to town. Farther then that I would most likely drive my vehicle anyway. I know that is just for my needs and others may see if different and thats ok.

[Scott K]

ds,

I agree, a few can give all a bad name! But I think the solution for all this would be to get the state to set up riding areas for people to ride. How many registerd atvs in mn are there? If you take all that money from registration and purchase some land for atvers to ride, I think that would give people a place ride and would stay off roads, and ditches, and out of the eye of the non-supporters of this sport! I personally registar 5 atvs in mn and can honestly say 99% of my riding is in wisconsin. I bring friends with everytime I ride, usually a group of 10 or so! I ride there about every 2-3 weeks from may till nov, about 10 trips a year. Now if you count the money just my group of 10 spend in wisconsin every trip, Im sure $1000 or more on each trip x 10 trips a year, how much dollars in tax money is being sent to another state because we dont have any riding areas!

Now this is just my group, I dont know if you ride in wisconsin much, or even travel there much, look at the traffic going into wisconsin pulling atvs on any givin friday afternoon, Think about them tax dollars all going across the border!

I think if I was a mn politician I would be thinking about how to keep that money here! If I had the choice to not pay for stickers in mn and just buy the wisconsin sticker I would! The laws in mn are so tough, if you have private land and allow the public on it, you can get in trouble. Something needs to change, and I havent seen many advances in atv trails in about 5 years, especially down south near me.

I guess to make my point, If the state had riding areas set up in more areas, I think there would be alot less complaints of people riding where they shouldnt be! And as for having the ditches open from augast to april to ride in, most of this time they are full of snow, or are to wet and cant ride do to a bad public image givin! Just my story, and .002.

Scott

[slotlimit]

Bob,

I was wondering how you get that hayrack moving but being I never tried I didn't want to say anything. Can you stop an empty rack? Even that to me seems unsafe maybe it's not though. I did see that you side stepped the questions I had of using your ATV for only AG purposes. I'll take that as you're not always being "legal" when it comes to the AG permit. It's nice talking to you and I hope that you are planning to plant lots of corn this year. Bet you wished you had it all in corn last year.

[slotlimit]

Scott,

I'm all with you on more areas to ride. The thing is I didn't buy mine to go trail riding. I'm fine with my fees going to your cause. I would just like to drive to the neighbors without worring about geting a ticket or having to buy an ag permit and strapping a chainsaw to my wheeler.

[Scott K]

slot,

I see your point, I guess my point is we dont have any places to ride legally, whether its ditches, roads, trails, ect... and as I brought up the ditches are only open during the times of year we cant really ride in them! And as for roads, I think it would be to hard to make a law that says you can ride so far from your house, because, on one instance the road may not have any traffic and would be totally safe, but on the other there could be high traffic, and around corners it would be unsafe to ok atv on the roads. So I wouldnt think there would ever be a law passed saying that you can just ride on the road if its within so many miles of your home. Dont get me wrong I know what your saying, its just there would be to many safety issues to make this a law. And I think most co's wouldnt ticket you for driving down the shoulder of a road with a plow on ,on a road with no traffic, and most likely would ticket someone doing a wheely down the center of the road!