7mm - 08

[caseymcq]

Doe anyone have any experience with 7mm-08 cartridge? I am thinking about getting a new rifle in either 7mm-08 or .308. Any thoughts on one or the other? Pro's? Con's?

Thanks.

[irvingdog]

2 very different rounds. Both very good. Tell us about what you hunt, when and where.

[caseymcq]

I live in NE Minnesota. It will probably be used by my wife for deer hunting and possibly for moose. I have talked to a few people that have used a .308 for deer and moose. They said that it was just fine for moose.

Gander has the 7mm-08 on sale $20 cheaper than the same model .308

[irvingdog]

.308 is going to transfer more energy at greater distances. Your wife will find the 7-.08 more shootable. I don't believe most people whack a mooose at really great distances anyway, and moose have a kill zone roughly the size of a trash-can lid. Both are great choices. I think for year in-year out shooting, she would appreciate the 7-.08 more. For me, I'd take a .308, but then again I'm 6 feet tall, 210 pounds and not recoil shy. I also shoot at greater distances than most area of the northeastern corner of the state provide, and I'm quite proficient with a rifle at long range.

[harvey lee]

You can buy a bigger caliber for the wife and then put a muzzle brake on it. Just make sure she can handle the added noise from the brake. It will take alot of recoil out but the added noise is loud. I had a brake put on my 300 win mag and I believe anyone could shoot the gun but the noise on that caliber is louder than I thought it might be. You only take one shot and the noise is not that bad. The loss of recoil was worth the added noise to me. That way she will not be afraid of the recoil and will be able to shoot the gun without flinching.

[icefishingdude]

I shoot a 7mm semi auto w/a BOSS....its quite possible the softest shooting rifle I've ever owned...a child could shoot and endure the kick(makes it easy for several shots), however...ear protection is a must and it adds time to your shot, so..choose your poison, shock w/ out the bang or the bang with a slower shot(unless you like to wear hearing protection steady in the woods) if i had to buy a rifle again, I'd get the muzzle brake again, its great...but I'm hearing the new kid in town is the .270 wssm (less recoil, more stability, shorter cartridge, and more power). just my 2 cents

[irvingdog]

Excess noise can be a huge contributing factor to flinching. To loud is bad. Period. Getting carried away with magnum rounds for Minnesota whitetail is also a little un-needed. These are not bull elk were killing here. 150-250 pound whitetail die pretty darn easy when you put the little bitty bullet where it belongs. That occurs most often when people are confident with their gun. Scare them away, and that might never happen.

[Whoaru99]

I have a .270 Win and it's a great cartridge. Works fine for me, but if I were doing it all over again, I'd probably go with the plain old boring 30-06.

It's darn hard to beat a 30-06 as an all around cartridge. Lots of combinations from moderately light to relatively heavy loads. I could be wrong, but I don't know of any other cartridge that is quite as versatile unless you get into handloading - maybe not even then.

In addtion to the wide variety of standard loadings, there are reduced recoil and very light managed recoil loads available for the trusty old '06.

Any particular reason for short action other than aiming for less recoil?

[leechlake]

casey, the 7mm-08 is a great round, I shoot a .308 for deer and I'd be just as happy with the 7mm-08, one thing you may consider is that presently the .308 comes in the "managed recoil" loads which for deer are advertised as working well to 200 yards and from anecdotal information here on fm have worked well in practice also.

Presently the 7mm-08 managed recoil isn't offered. For youth hunters and small adults the managed recoil is great (I wouldn't use it on moose) for deer. For that reason I'd go with the .308. If she has no problem with recoil the 7mm-08 is good also, if I'm not mistaken the 7mm is a .28 caliber so it's a slightly smaller diameter bullet.

Remington has a neat HSOforum where you can compare muzzle velocity and energy and compare up to three bullets/calibers including the managed recoil.

[get-the-net]

I shoot a 7mm-08 Rem Model 7 and I love it. I have made one shot kills on antelope, whitetail, and muledeer some of which exceeded 400 yards. I have also harvested several elk with this rifle also with one shot kills. As with any rifle I shoot, all shots were successful because I took the time to place my shot carefully.

The reason I trust this round is two-fold. One is the fact that at around 6.5 lbs total weight, carrying this rifle around in the mountains or swamps doesn't tire you out and gives you a better chance of staying fresh when you come upon the animal of a lifetime.

The other reason I trust this rifle is that unlike many of the new ultra-super-stomper rifles out there, it has very little felt recoil which allows me to practice regularly at the range without worry of developing a bad flinch.

If you get the chance, see if you can find one of your friends that has one and buy a box of cartriges and try it out. I have a feeling that you won't be dissapointed. Many bullet weights are available, it is easy to reload your own rounds, but if you're not intersted in getting into reloading, a box of cartriges won't break the bank. If you're ever around Mankato, I'd be happy to let you take a look at mine to get an idea if something like it is what you're looking for.

Good luck.

[Ufatz]

I hesitate to think about the number of rifles and calibers I have owned down through the years! Yikes. But tell ya what: after you sift through all the "450 yards in a blizzard with one eye frozen shut, off hand" kills and similar stuff consider what YOU need. Sounds to me like you need a rifle to shoot deer in the MN woods and MAYBE something larger. An 06 with the right load is simple AND with the right load your wife can shoot it all day. If you actually get around to a moose just load up a 220 gr. and away you go. For what its worth, no more I lugged a 6.5 around AK for nearly 40 years. And a .458 too I might add. If you shoot carefully the 6.5 will do what you need. I'm not neccessarily suggesting it to you, but it WOULD do everything you are LIKELY to shoot. AND she can shoot it all day.

Get something SHE can shoot, perhaps without all the whiz bang devices on it. Then let her SHOOT it. She'll be fine.

[83walleye]

The 7mm-08 is a fine round - very accurate with lower recoil than your typical 30 caliber deer rifle(308/30'06). I do want to make a case for the reduced recoil 308 rounds though - they kill deer v e r y effectively, and the recoil is way(!) down. The 308 is also a very accurate caliber, and if a trip out to the west is in order, or a moose permit comes along, standard velocity 308 rounds would make the 308 entirely adequate for longer shots(>200yds) and bigger animals.

Getting used to a rifle is the big thing. If you find a 308 that's easy and comfortable to shoot with the reduced loads, hunt deer with confidence in MN, and remember it's an easy - and temporary - switch to fully loaded rounds as your hunting style changes.

Although bullet weight and powder charge are involved in recoil, the single biggest factor in recoil reduction is the weight of the rifle itself. Remington's Model 7 is a great gun, but if it doesn't fit well, it's lighter weight will contribute to greater recoil than say, a regular Remington 700. Muzzle blast becomes more pronounced as the barrel gets shorter - while you don't usually feel the recoil or hear the muzzle blast while shooting at game - the 20 rounds or so you put through the rifle at the range each year will cause some discomfort, which leaves a pretty strong impression on those who don't shoot often...I've been hunting for 35 years and I still use sandbags, ear plugs AND ear muffs at the range. I hate recoil, and I hate loud noises. But, I do shoot straight when I need to!

Best rifle in my eyes? Regular sized Rem 700, Win 70, Ruger 77 in a 308, whichever feels best, with a 3x9 Mueller illuminated dot scope(about $150-200 online). Any of these are rock-solid and can do it all. What's best for you is, well, best for you.

[leechlake]

I second the point of rifle weight, I'd get a standard weight rifle to reduce recoil.

[Whoaru99]

I think this tells a pretty good story...

This is from the Federal Cartridge HSOforum.

23 loads listed for the 30-06, 14 for the .308, and 5 for the 7mm-08.

If I have my count right, Remington lists 18 loads for the 30-06, 10 for the .308, and 3 for the 7mm-08.

Don't get me wrong, I'm sure the 7mm-08 is a fine cartridge, I just personally think the sheer number of loads listed for the 30-06 speaks to it's versatility and time-tested proven success.

[83walleye]

Well, here goes nothing - this ought to be good for discussion:

Hunters have been very successful shooting lions in Africa using the 30'06 - it's way too much gun for the deer we shoot. The average deer we shoot is probably around 130-180lbs on the hoof(before gutting). Back when modern hunting guns were evolving, military rifles provided the basis for many sporting rifles. "If it was good enough for the army, it must be good enough to hunt with" mentality. There's a reason there's so many different rounds available for the 30'06 - it doesn't fit right into anything. The thinking back then revolved around the "use enough gun" philosophy. Big bang->big kick->big hole=less meat.

I think the 30'06 has outlived it's usefullness. Yup, it still kills deer dead, but I've read where the old 30-30 has killed more deer than anything. The 30'06 180g kicks hard - 20ft/lbs of recoil energy - even the 7mm Rem Mag 150g only has 19ft/lbs of recoil energy. 308 180g is at 17.5; 150g is at 15.8. The 30-30 by comparison with 170g is at 11ft/lbs. The 308 has been written to be ballistically superior to the 30'06, and with the reduced loads, it will be a proven deer killer easily within the range we shoot most of our deer at here in MN & WI.

My question is why the need for all the horsepower?

[Whoaru99]

Horsepower? That's the 30-06 beauty. With dozens of factory loads available, you can choose your poison.

Need light? Get a 125 managed recoil. Need medium? Get a 170 reduced recoil or a 150 standard load. Need something a bit bigger? How about a 150/165 premium loading. Bigger yet? Get a 180 Trophy Bonded in a High Energy load. Believe in the slow and heavy philosophy? Get the 220 grain Cor-Lokt.

And accuracy? Pretty much any rifle has more inherent accuracy than the person pulling the trigger anyway - especially in field conditions. Think a deer cares if your rifle shoots 1, 2, or 3 inch groups?

How much more versatility could one ask for in a rifle?

[leechlake]

now back to the program...

[bode]

as this is only my 2nd post i don't want to start any problems, i just wanted to point out that there is no real difference between a 308 and a 30/06 or a 220 swift and a 22-250. same bullets only 100 or so feet per second and that's only if your not reloading. bullet placement is what is important. a 243 win is great for pred to deer, a 7mm-30 cal is great for deer to moose/bear. with that being said, a 300 Win Mag will kill a deer with a bad shot just like a 3 1/2" 12 ga will kill a dove with a bad shot. i think either will work just fine and with the reduced load the recoil will not be an issue. best of luck and y'all have a great new year.

[irvingdog]

as this is only my 2nd post i don't want to start any problems,

What do you think guys? Chase him away with pitchforks and torches, or welcome him to the mix? I don't think he was any problem at all.

Welcome aboard!! Keep posting!

[leechlake]

Bode, keep the posts coming, when we post most people are looking for good opinions based on our experiences. They aren't always right or wrong just based on what we all know, when we all put our experiences together we learn a lot. Keep it coming and welcome, try to get those posts into the thousands!!!