Summer Bass Fishing - Deep or Shallow ???

[FlipR70]

For the sake of my post, "deep" here is going to be defined as fishing deeper than 6 feet ...

I've been thinking about summer fishing (actually dreaming about it). I'm wondering if most of you tend to fish deep or do you go shallow to heavy cover and why. Also, for you tournament guys, do you find that most tournaments are won shallow or deep during summer months? It seems to me when I watch the guys down south fishing tournaments (in summer), that most of them are fishing in less than 6 feet of water. Sometimes, you'll see a guy fishing C-rigs deep but for the most part, it appears that guys are fishing the cover shallower.

Personally, I am biased towards fishing heavy cover in the summer and looking for a pattern but I hear stories of a lot of people going deeper and fishing the deep side of the weedline to catch numbers of schooled bass.

If I remember correctly, Deitz won a tournament on Big Marine last year and I'm assuming that he fished deep. Also, for you guys who tend to fish deep in summer, do you tend to notice that you find schools or do you tend to put together patterns and catch fish scattered.

Looking for info,

FlipR70

[sami0115]

i almost always fish shallow cover, mainly because that is what i feel comfortable with. i NEED to learn how to fish deeper water. when i am fishing in northern minnesota in the summer i do fairly well in the early morning. but as fish move to the deeper weed lines (cabbage 8-15 ft) my fishing kinda sucks. it is definatly an area i need to work on.

i was fishing Leech this last summer and it was totally different there. apparently (according to the guy i was fishing with) the bass stay shallow almost all the time. because of the high population of big muskies in leech the bass stay out of the cabbage. rumor has it that the bass and muskies have an agreement, the bass stay out of the cabbage and the muskies won't eat them!

[TurnUpTheFishing]

Im like sami, most my bass fishing is done shallow because thats what Im better/more comfortable with. When I do fish deeper about the only thing I use is crankbaits. I have tried using carolina rigs and texas rigs deeper but its frustrating going hours without a bite then returning to the shallows and start catching fish.

[Granny]

Hi....my name is Granny and I used to be a slop fisherman

I started into this wonderful sport of bass'n a couple years ago and I only fished slop and almost always fished topwater. Then this last year after plenty of help from the FM bass crew I began tossing cranks, spinnerbaits, tubes, & Magic Stiks (senko type) on deeper weedlines. It really changes the bass'n game when you can be versatile.

Spring/fall, morning/evening, and clowdy/windy days are my times to hit shallow water. Shade seems to be the key to shallow bass. If there is a day when you know the bass are biting, make yourself fish deeper. Put on a crank or soft plastic and cast parallel with the weedline. Or cast into open pockets in the weeds. It may take time and you may have to fish slooooooow but once you pick up the basics of fishing deeper water, you will catch more fish.

Good luck,

Granny

[Deitz Dittrich]

Flip- This is really going to depend on a lake to lake and also a season element. I pride myself in being able to fish both. I think you are more able to find fish year round in the shallows. So, many anglers get stuck fishing shallow becuase that is where they have success. But you seldom can hit the mother load of fish in a small area fishing shallow. the truth of the fact is, when you are on deep fish, you are often pulling more than one fish from an area. I have been on Lake Minnetonka and caught 20 bass from a spot in 19 feet of water and had an ancher down. The biggest thing I can tell someone that is new to fishing deep is this... You are still casting to a very small area. I think when people start fishing deep they grab a crankbait and start fancasting. NOT A GOOD PLAN!!! I still fish Jig-n-pig and lures like that, but do it out deep. It takes some time, but once you get rewarded, its well worth the extra effort to find deep fish.

Flip- Yes I did win a tournament on big marine, and those fish did come from 20 feet of water.. they were about 15 feet outside the deepest weeds. I caught all my fish(3 over 4 lbs one was 4.8 and was big fish for the event as well) all in an area that was no bigger than a 30 yard stretch.

Flip- I know you fish Chisago quite a bit, if you are not fishing in 6+ feet of water out there, you are missing out on some great bass fishing! WBL is another great deep water fishery!!!

Also for those who are trying to learn to fish deep... An underwater camera is HUGE!!!!!!... knowing that there are bass on a spot and finding a way to catch them can really help with your confidence!... why fish an area if there just aren't any there!

[Deitz Dittrich]

Its also my intension to do a few Hot Bite Fishing videos on deep water bass fishing... hopefully you will be able to pick up a few tips from them...

[Forestlaker]

I have fished as an amatuer in about a dozen pro-am tournaments in Minnesota. Other than the Mississippi or Leech Lake the pros I fished with fished deeper than 6+ feet about 80% of the time. Not many of them would fish down an entire weedline. They had key areas on weedlines they went right too. The spot on the spot. Plastics or jigs were by far the baits of choice. When they did fish shallow it was mostly docks. I would agree with Dietz if you want to catch a number of bass quickly find yourself some good deep weedline spots. The shallow bite is not as consistent as its much more effected by daylight and weather. Deep weedlines can be good anytime of the day.

[carlcmc]

Without having a camera unit, what do bass look like on sonar when they are in deep water? I have had my sonar unit for one summer and still think i have a lot to learn

Some times i see arches on the drop offs but never know if thats bass or what?

[Wayne Ek]

Flip, I think the type of lake I'm on during the summer period has alot to do with the decision to target deep structure of shallow. I live and guide in the Alex. area, up here I have my choice of deep clear lakes or shallow green dish-pan lakes. On the Chain, it is not uncommon to be sitting in 28 feet of water flipping a cabbage edge, ending in 22 feet of water. To fish deep you need good electronics and confidence. Take Deitz suggestion to heart and use a camera... I have one in the boat with me almost every time I'm out, guide trip or not. I have learned however that some of my clients get so caught up in TV viewing that they forget its a fishing trip. Now for the dirty little secret, even though we have large numbers of clear deep lakes in my area, I'll take the dirty,shallow,pea soup green lakes, day in and day out for numbers and size, when it comes to largemouth... smallies well that another story.

[Wayne Ek]

Carlcmc, it's rare that I mark fish in a deep caggabe or coontail break, I'm looking for the break and any small points that jut out 3 or 4 feet more than the normal cabbage line. With coontail I look for the clumps in deeper water, then fish around them. I see alot of people fishing right down the break, which will hold fish. But going up into the break will catch you alot more fish. Think of the caggage break as a farm grove, you will see deer along the edge of the grove, but you know that there are deer up in the grove. Hope that helps...

[sami0115]

Deitz...

when you are looking for a deep water spot, what are you looking for? how do you know to stop on that particular 30 yard stretch and not another one near it?

Andy

[Deitz Dittrich]

Wow, great question Sami...

Often times its the same stuff you are looking for in shallow water, you just cant see it with your eyes...

*points comming off the weedline, or any change in the weedline. A straigh weedline will not hold the concentrations of fish that one with a good point that sticks out.. that point may only stick out 10 feet from the main weedline.. but that may be a pot of gold.

*inside turns in weedline.. exact opp of point but just as great if you find one.

*ROCKS... bass love rocks, I have a lot of spots on different lakes that are great walleye spots, but can be just as good a bass spot during the day if the eyes are not there. Walleye and bass are not the best at getting along in my opinion.

*Humps/points.. any bottom rise can hold bass as long as it tps out at a good depth. All dont have to have weeds, but it sure can help.

***OK, HERES THE BIGGIE*** Weed Transition!.. If you can find a deep weedline and find an area where the weeds change from onekind to another, you have usually done well!!!The weeds have usually changed because so has the bottom content, IE sand to Rock, muck to rock...ECT...

For Example, there is a spot on lake Minnetonka that is a hump, weedline ends in about 18 feet of water(clear side of the lake) anyway this hump is surrounded by rocks the size of your fist. However on one side only about the size of a full size pick up truck there are rocks the size of basketballs...I have watched with my Aqua-Vu bass fight over who can be on these larger rocks...

[TNFL]

I fish in a league and i go shallow all year for bass. I will admit I could probably do better on some clear lakes i.e. Maple, Pleasant if I went deep. However, without prefishing I don't feel I have time to try and find the fish. But, not all shallow areas work well, the spots I fish are ones with structure on structure. For example, a dock with weeds and access to deep water. I've also noticed bass relate more to weeds in the spring and docks in the summer.

What time of year (mid june early july) or water temp would you suggest to start looking for schools of bass deeper?

[Deitz Dittrich]

TNFL-Although I do my best deep water fishing in the summer months, I have had the chance to fish deep pre-spawn fish in WI... But I would say, once the spawn is done there will be some fish deep, however, late june threw July are the best deep water months in my opinion.. once the weeds are up to their peek.

[FlipR70]

OK Deitz, a few more questions (I'm thinkning of largemouth here) ...

- You go to new water and look at a map, what is the first place you look at to fish deep

- Do you fish finesse deep or do you fish jig -n- pig C-rigs, & T-rigs (generally)

- Do you find that fish bite all day and through fronts better deep or do you notice the same effects that you'd notice shallow-water fishing

- Do you mark structure and fish it or do you wait until you find fish & mark that location (either by a buoy or on GPS)

- Is there general trends you've noticed (and are willing to share) such as best weeds, spots on spots, cover - structure combo's

I'll have more ????'s shortly,

Thanks,

FlipR70

[FlipR70]

Sorry ...

A few more ???'s

- How do you find the correct depth to fish at in the most efficient way possible

- Do you notice, as Bill Dance states, that the active bass will not readily change depth

Thanks again,

FlipR70

[Deitz Dittrich]

O.k... wow, brain oveload.. great questions.. and I will do my best to try and answer them.. anybody else wants to chime in on this please do...

-1)Points and humps in about the same depth that the weedline ends..once you have found the point and hump look for smaller pieces of structure on that to pinpoint an area...

-2)yes I will usually start small(tube or 4" straight tail worm rigged on a mushroom head)aka jig worm. If I have a problem with bluegill bites I will up-size to a jig.(ONE HUGE TELL is, if you see a lot of bluegill s near the surface in 20 feet of water.. SOMETHING is putting them up there)

-3) The deeper the fish the less they are affected by weather fronts!!! thats a fact!

-4)yes... I know you asked 2 questions, however, it depends. Generally I will fish an area that looks good, I may graph it first, I may trust a map if its a good one... If I catch a fish I throw a bouy(Or mark a GPS spot) if its a tournament I deffinatly throw a bouy(bouy rule that another boat can not come near)if for fun weekend angling I will often just go GPS to not draw a fan club...

-5) Transition areas, weeds to rock, weeds to a different kind of weed...as stated earlier in my earlier post, find a small point on a point, a bend in a point, a transition from one weed to another.. For instance, Northern Milfoil(different that Eurasion Millfoil)will grow pretty deep, but not as deep as Coontail will grow. so even tho you may find an area that the depth does not change you may find a point of coontail poking into deeper water.(GOOD SPOT)

[grab the net]

My partner and I spend most of our time shallow and feel that is our best chance of catching big fish,(over 4's). I believe shallow fish would always beat deep fish if everybody did not have to share them. Numbers come from deep water, with quality fish mixed in. But again, finding that spot on the spot can be time consuming and intimidating for the guy who has not had much sucess out deep. It is also important to get that mental picture of what exactly your fishing, rather than the visual of reeds, or pads or slop. The same little cuts and pockets are down there in 15 plus feet you just have to visualize and recognize them on your electronics or camera.

So I think it pays to be versatile and have a shallow bite to go to early and try and get that big bite, kicker fish. Then have some deep spots to fall back on. Finding that deep spot for the first time though is fun, catching 15 plus fish off one little spot will make a believer out of you. Then make sure you mark it with a GPS so you can find it back.

The other thing about deep fish is you can depend on them, they ususally don't stray very far if at all. If you can keep the spot to yourself, they will be there all summer. But there aren't many secrets these days, especially on lake that hold a lot of T's, everbody is always watching and checking out spots they see other boats on. Right or wrong, everybody is watching.

Good luck with your search for deep fish, perseverance is the key, allow yourself a little time each trip to explore the deep weedline on your favorite lake, that way if you get frustrated you can always go back shallow and regain the confidence, catch a few fish and talk yourself into going back out there.

[Deitz Dittrich]

Ok.. post and questions #2.. I couldnt remember so I had to have a second post as well...

-Finding the correct depth is the hard part.. because on different areas of the lake it will be in different depths. Each piece of cover is different. I generally will find a deep weedline and start fishing about 10-15 feet inside the weeds and then work my way to beyond the weedline. This is more difficult on a new area to yourself. Learning to fish deep can be VERY difficult, yet very rewarding! An UNDERWATER CAMERA is not a must.. but I can not tell you enough how much they can help for learning to fish deep. Just knowing that theya re there is a huge confidence boost. Otherwise you really start second guessing... a camera will also tell if there are rocks beyond the weedline or anything else.

-I am kinda stumped by the bill dance question... an active fish will have a much larger "strike zone" and will move further than an inactive fish. This can include chasing a crankbait up and out of its depth.. So I am not totally sure I understand what mr dance is talking about.

My fave deep water lure is something I call a "Stupid Rig" its name is quite explanitory.

Usually its a tub or 4" worm or any hunk of plastic.. a short 5-10 inch leader with a crimp on Bull shot sinker.. so not technically a carolina rig(shorter leader and pegged sinker) and not a texas rig(sinker not near lure and pegged) however the rig is fished nearer to a carolina rig. Drag---pause.

[Forestlaker]

To find deep weedline spots you have to go look for them. The lake map will give you a place to start but rarely will put you on the spot on the spot. Start by locating irregular contours on the map at about the weedline depth. Get out some marker bouys and set the GPS on track. Setup your boat on the outside weed edge and follow right along it. Cast straight out ahead of the boat with a jig. As you follow the weedline drop a bouy whenever you notice a change in direction of the boat. After you go a ways the track on the gps will start to show the outline of the weededge. The marker bouys behind you will show you possible inside turns or small points along the weedline. The jig will also tell where the weedlines turn. If your cast straight ahead of the boat and hit thick weeds the weed line is turning out to deeper water. If you hit nothing with the jig the weedline is starting to turn in toward shallow water. Basically, any change in the weedline direction or weed type can be a spot bass will school. If you catch a fish cast right back to the same spot if you get more than one try to figure out why the fish would be holding there. There usually is a reason. I use the jig as a search bait because you can cast shallower into the weeds or out past the weedline to see how the bass are relating to the weededge. Also, throw a crankbait out deep as you go once and a while you will find bass holding on a hump or hard bottom spot off the weedline.

If you have a underwater camera it would speed up the search I don’t so it takes longer.

If you spend a summer morning on a good bass lake following a outside weedline with a jig you will catch some fish and probably find some

spots you can keep coming back to.

[delmuts]

do you folks have any tips on fishing a carolina rig ? i seldom fish one due to not being able to tell when a fish picks up the lure. i usually stay with jigs/cranks/ or spinnerbaits that i can tell when i get bit. i usually use a braided line for senitivity and hooks sets. i do use a mono leader if i try a C rig.

[Deitz Dittrich]

Del-A bite on a c-rig feels much like any other plastic hit.. or sometime the fish will grab and run and almost set the hook its self! OR, when you go to pull the lure you will feel it pull back... thats when you set the hook!

If I have a tip for anybody... I think often times people use too heavy a weight and will fish it too fast.. use a smaller weight and slow down!!!

[Wayne Ek]

Del, Deitz is correct, most people use to heavy a weight, go a little lighter. I've changed to tungsten weights on both my c-rights and worm rigs. Also, is I have a client thats having problems when we are using c-rigs, I will take them to a shallow rock shore and let them cast to the rocks so they get to feel what rocks feel like , then to a sand shore. Finally I will take them to the shallows where small bass and pan-fish are a dime a dozen and we will catch a punch of smaller fish, a 1/2 pound bass moves the line just like a 3 pounder. Hope this helps...

Wayne

[Stratosman]

Wow what a question!

There has been some great insight and info posted so far.

It's nice to talkin bass in the middle of January man. Deep or shallow huh? My question is why limit yourself to one or the other? The most succesful anglers will be able to fish both and be able to recognize when weather conditions and other factors will may play a role in the patterns, seasonal changes also are a factor. Every lake has bass that hold shallow and bass that hold on deeper structure, however, what you need to do is determine a pattern for each lake you are fishing and do this each time you are out, as it can change. And one pattern on one lake may not hold true to a different body of water within even relatively close proximity. The key is to search, eliminate unproductive water if you will.

Deep fish and outside weed line fish during summer and fall seasons have a tendancy to school, so I like a search bait when fishing this pattern, such as a crankbait or spinnerbait. When I contact a what I believe may be a school of bass, I then slow down with a worm rig, jig worm, ect. Then study the area, why are the fish holding on this particular spot, what is the weed type, bottom content, wind direction, anything you can take not of. Now try to duplicate it. It seems I have the best luck deep when the fish are in their summer patterns, late june to fall, cold front conditions usually finds me deep also.

However, I love shallow fish, early season finds me fishing areas adjacent to spawing bays, typically the first major structure outside these areas can hold numbers of quality schooling fish for a period of time before they re-locate to thier summer residences, points, bars, sunken islands, humps, you get the picture. However, my favorite early to mid summer patterns is a dock pattern, it is such a visual experience, and I usually get some of my biggest fish of the year off docks in during the first week of June before the weedbeds and deeper weedlines are fully established. But again, the weather conditions dictate the pattern to a degree, bright sunny skies are the best for dock fishng, overcast days the bass have a tendancy to scatter. Shallow fishing is more of a guerilla style fishing, shallow fish are less likely to be found in schools, so therefore I do not waste alot of time in one spot, covering water is the best policy. One exception to this rule is when slop fishing, then a surgical, methodical approach is the key, but this is typically a mid-summer method, for me at least.

Last memorial day weekend on Gull Lake, I found fish on docks, I found fish still on beds, found them scattered on weed flats. Even found a school of spawned out females in a 20 foot hole just outside a spawning bay, probably pulled 15 bass from there in 20 casts on a texas rigged worm. All quality fish. If I would have stuck to just one approach, I would have missed out on some great fish.

Don't limit yourself to either deep or shallow, try to learn something new each time, if you're a shallow guy, why not spend some time learning the ins and outs of deep water bassin, and vice versa for deep water guys, who knows, it could make a tournament for you if your "normal" patterns aren't producing.

But each lake has it's own story, don't get hung up on a pattern just because it worked for you last week.

I could go on and on but I'll spare you the boredom.

[Lunker]

This is a lot of good info. I have had the same problems in my bass fishing, and again it is because I just don't feel as secure fishing deeper bass. When I force myself to adjust, I am quick to abandon it because there were't any bites, when I would spend much more time fishing shallow without one. I always seem to manage a good amount of fish from the shallows, but I know my problem with the deeper fish, and after reading this post I am vowing to hit that deep water this season! Lots of good info guys, thanks. One question I will pose for some more thourough thoughts are if you hit a lake on a day when the bass aren't shallow, example hot sunny day, what would be the first area you would try to probe and how. And don't just give us "that weedline spot on a spot",what would you be looking for and with what? Thanks all and after reading in this forum my skn is beginning to itch...Bass withdrawl i'm afraid.