No ATV use in wetlands?????

[EBass]

First you want to start with Gasoline

I saw your name and wanted to give you some dump - I have no ATV so I can't tell ya.

Later Granny!

[Granny]

Ebass,
I have been gasoline free for almost 3 weeks now j/k.

I don't have an ATV either but if this is true it may I want to know more about it.

Granny

[This message has been edited by Granny (edited 10-01-2003).]

[Fisher Dave]

Granny .. thats a good question .. I wish I had the right answer for you.

I ride my atv's regularly for all purposes and am aware of several designated ATV trails that cross waterways(creeks) and continue on. The trail crossings are in rocky creek sections where the bottom will not get ripped up.

I guess for now until I know otherwise, I will continue to use the obvious *legal*(or previously?) crossings until my ATV grows wings.

[Granny]

I tried to find some information on this but no luck so its probably not true. There was actually a few guys sitting around talking about it but small town talk travels fast. I will try and get some more info and see if I can find a source to the info. Later, Granny

[hey__bob]

I read in the Mankato Free Press were this is the case. No riding on wetlands or dry river/creek beds. I wonder if the same is true of horseback riding. I have seen plenty of damage from these large footed animals. Will they be banned as well? I have an ATV and would like to sell it for lack of "Legal" riding areas but what would it be worth if there are no riding areas. It seems the more they work on this issue the worse it gets for the riders. I don't know how ANYBODY can tell me where to ride it on my own property, creekbed or no creekbed.

[Guest]

Ya there was a article about that in the Outdoor News last week. It said that a new law prohibits people from driving in old creek beds, in any lake/pond until ice up, on the dried up river banks, and in the cattails.
Im sure there is info on Minnesota DNR site too.

So whats next? ATV's BANNED? I hope not.

------------------
Fish ON!

[upnorth]

If it is true, the ATV folks can blame the bad apples that tear everything up out there.

Don't read into this post that I think all ATV riders are reckless ruin trails, creeks and such. There are a few that do and the are giving all ATVers a bad image. Too bad what a few do affect so many others

[This message has been edited by upnorth (edited 10-01-2003).]

[Granny]

I know there is an ATV section here but I don't know if it gets much attention so I will ask the question here. I was told by someone that you can not drive your wheeler through any wetlands including creeks and rivers now. This goes for PRIVATE and public land. Is there any truth to this? Can anyone post an article or give me some info on where I could find out more about this topic?

Thanks, Granny

[Dave]

Sad, but true. The new 2003-2004 OHV regulations are on the DNR HSOforum

http://files.dnr.state.mn.us/rlp/regulations/ohv/ohvregs03_04.pdf

Page 16:
Where You May Ride

You may operate an off-highway vehicle:
on your own land that is NOT a marsh, bog, pond, or unfrozen stream, lake or river.

[Granny]

This law must have came up because of "the few bad", but who is going to inforce this on private property? Please lets not get into the same arguments as "boat searches". I don't own a wheeler yet, but for those who own land that is locked by state swamp or "wetlands" may have a tough time walking to thier hunting lands. Mostly I am thinking about the older folks who pretty much depend on other modes of transportation than walking. Anyone else think this law is a big-ol-pile of b.s.?

My vent, Granny

[Dave]

This law is very dumb, IMO.

I heard the DNR state at a Task Force meeting last year that any intention of theirs, in regards to OHV travel, is to not burden owners access to their land, if they have to travel state lands to get there.

I would hope/think some "permit" would be available to allow such access to such private lands.

There was even discussion for having "permits" for such use as berry pickers who use ATVs; to allow access to trails that are closed to OHVs.

[upnorth]

I don't agree that this is a dumb law. sometimes the only way to keep the "few bad apples" from going to far is to take it away from everybody.

Is that fair? No! But seems that no one is able to stop the few troublemakers who ride ATVs, so everyone suffers. And no I am not against ATVs, I have been seriously thinking of buying one myself. But with this last law coming out I don't think I will be getting one any time soon, can't take the thing out anywhere.

The people who do ride responsibly should done something other than turn a blind eye and deaf ear to the problem riders a long time ago. If they would have done more to help law enforcement curb this, instead of worry about losing their "right to drive ATVs" where they want, the restrictions would probably not have come, or at least not this severe.

Turn them in when you see them screwing around where they shouldn't be

[Dave]

upnorth, reread what you wrote and input any other recreation, since every one of them has huge problems in the eye of someone. Now, add telling someone what to do on their own private land!

[upnorth]

Dave,

The water in a creek or river is never private land. Marshes and other wetlands I am not too sure about.

This not about ruining anyones access their land or ruining anyones fun. This about protecting fish and wildlife habitat. You run an ATV though a trout stream and all that mud and other dump gets stirred up and can ruin spawning habitat.

You fish, do you want spawning habitat on your favorite lake ruined? I doubt it.

You go to some lakes and they have posted no wake zones to protect delicate habitat and people are expected to obey that, no one complains. What is wrong with protecting this habitat?

And yes I realize that there are bad apples in any recreational sport. And I stand by the statement that if you see someone doing things wrong you need to turn them in or at least try and educate them that is is illegal. That goes for everyone of those rec sports.

[This message has been edited by upnorth (edited 10-06-2003).]

[King Canada]

The problem with ATVs is not using them as transportation. The problem results from yahoos using them as dirt jetskis. With the low water on the Minnesota this year these fools have been all over the sandbars until the are nothing but solid tracks. These are critical habitat areas for egg laying Leatherback Turtles and countless insects and invertabrates that need to be left alone by motorized fools. I use one for for a variety of activities but I've never thought I had the inherent right to drive the thing absolutely anywhere. Unfortunatly unless the DNR aggressively enforces this law the abuse by the few will continue

[Dave]

upnorth,
We're on the same page in general but as an example I think the marsh and wetland part on private land is going a little "overboard".

Maybe an example. If my favorite lake is a small one and enough people complain about destructive boaters, would that constitute closing the lake to all boaters, in order to save the "habitat".

Or, just as an example, if there's a "marsh" on MY land, I can't ride through it since it may ruin some habitat for say, ducks. What if I care less about ducks and that wasn't my purpose for buying the land.

It just seems to be too broad for private land owners.

[upnorth]

Dave,

I had mentioned in an earlier post that I thought it was severe, I still think that it is. But if you look around ATVs do a lot of damage, and it seems that nothing else has worked very well to date to keep them out of the areas they shouldn't be in. I do believe that most of the problem riders are kids and the parents are not aware what they are doing. But what are you gonna do?.

I am not trying to be sarcastic here but hey, if you or anyone else has a realistic way to keep the "bad apples" from turning wetland and marshes into mudding pits, I think the lawmakers in the state would be glad to hear from youse

And when it comes private land, we gotta be realistic here, we don't really have full control of what we do with our own private land. There are sort of laws prohibiting what you can do with private land. Look at building laws, septic and well laws and restrictions.

We don't really own all the rights to it, only what the government says we have rights to do with it

[honker23]

I think this law is a poor one. I think it makes it easy for the dnr by making a blanket law to effect, basically all atv users. They effectively banned using atvs for what they were invented for. The only use will be on a track in some competition.

Because of poachers, are we going to eliminate hunting and fishing?
Because of reckless car operators are they going to ban cars?

[upnorth]

Honker,

That is why I decided to put off buying one.

Blame the Bad Apples, not the lawmakers.

Yes there are poachers etc, but they are not typically so blatant in what they do. They are least sneaky about it