Installing a shower

[fishermatt]

First time installing a shower in our 2nd bathroom, got a 3 piece 36"er. The directions talk about putting cement or something on the subfloor to support the entire shower floor. What's the best thing to use and best way to do this? Thanks.

[IFallsRon]

Are you installing over joists or cement floor?

[fishermatt]

I'm actually doing one of each, but the first one is over joists with crawl space below.

[sparcebag]

I did'nt know a kit had to have a bed anymore? Arent there support ribs or fins on the bottom? If not and ya need a bed,there made from mortor mix,mixed fairly dry.I take it theres a slope on the floor to the drain and no underneeth support??

If it calls for a bed then its lacking support and no matter where its installed,concrete,or subfloor,finished floor Mortor is a moldable bed.

[fishermatt]

Maybe there is fins. I honestly haven't looked that close at the bottom yet! I'm about as green as a basswood leaf in June on this one. :-) Will have to look tonight. I read through the percedures book and thought it said something about a bed, but I better read it agin. I learn quick if I have an installed one to look at, but on a shower the parts you need to see get covered up!

You're saying the bottom might just rest on the fins?

I got this shower at Menards.

[sparcebag]

It could have support but if the instructions call for a bed DO IT its easy! Just get some premixed mortor mix,make sure you have enough before ya start,you can do this by just dumping it dry and setting the shower base on it,PLUG THE DRAIN! look for base inprint on dry mix if its a good imprint,move it into something to mix,mix it so its like clay, lay it in get the plumbing connected,pressure it down so edges meet floor level.and its true to the floor LEVEL as the floor is,If it has flanges to screw to wall studs do it now to hold it in place.tomorrow finish install.If its on wood floor put down a piece of plastic to protect floor,then the mortor.

[backlash 1]

IMHO Whenever you buy a shower unit from a box store you should be using a bed underneath. Why do you think they sell them so cheap? Cuz there is'nt enough material there to support an adult, and the constant flexing is going to compromise the drain.

Just play it safe and mix up some "sand mix" Sacrete. Mix it thick enough so it won't all run down the hole, but loose enough so you can wiggle the base down into the sand mix until it rests on the subfloor. Then resist the urge to stand on it until the mix is completly dry. Good luck.

[fishermatt]

Here's a couple pics to help clarify.

It looks like I'll need some kind of support under the middle

[sparcebag]

Looks as though you'll want to do a bed under all but the legs.My GUESS?? is 2 bags.Its better too much than not enough.

[fishermatt]

Thanks! Like I said before, I'm greener than an Irishman the day after St. Patricks. What should the order of steps be?

Does this sound close?

1. put shower inside of framing to make sure it matches up and is level.

2. mark hole for drain

3. remove shower, cut drain hole, then plug the hole with something that can be removed after the mortar is in.

4. place plastic sheet on floor

5. mix mortar and place on floor

6. place shower base (bottom of 3 pieces) on top of mortar mix, making sure the legs and front are touching the floor and the base is level. allow to dry.

7. plumb in water lines, shower head, and drain, then add top 2 pieces of shower

If I'm wayenafug off, please let me know.

[sparcebag]

sounds good,make sure the drain hole is a bit oversize 4"x4" or so,gives ya plenty of room.

[Surface Tension]

Needs a bed for sure. Nothing under the legs but shims if necessary. The front lip shouldn't be bearing much weight but you can shim it to level and remove the shims after it set in the bed.

[fishermatt]

Can't a guy just brace it up with some treated plywood? I spose the mortar makes it really solid when you stand in it?

[Redlantern]

I think you should measure how far it is from the subfloor to the bottom of the shower base. When you put your sand mix down, make sure your piles are a few inches higher. You don't need to cover the entire shower base area. Just a few well placed piles. When you set the shower in place, it'll squish it down. That said, I would also install the drain before you put the shower in place for the last time. Dry fitting everything a first time is a great idea. As far as installing the drain, I typically use a clear silicone but many plumbers use putty. I prefer silicone because, despite what the tub of putty says, it dries out. When I put the silicone on, I apply it to the flange of the drain, don't get cheap with it. After I tighten the drain, I take some fiberglass insulation and wipe off the excess silicone. The drain should come with a rubber gasket and a cardboard gasket. The rubber goes up against the shower and the carboard goes between the rubber gasket and the plastic nut. The cardboard allows you to tighten the drain without the rubber binding up. Also, I use screws when installing the shower instead of nails. Nails tend to work there way back out over time and will pop the drywall. Since I'm a plumber and not a carpenter, I tend to miss nails with a hammer and that doesn't look so good on a fiberglass shower. Also, if you have to remove the shower, unscrewing the screws is much easier than pulling nails. Hope this helps.

[Steve Bakken]

O.K. after reading this I'm getting up the courage to tackle replacing our worn out shower. But let me throw this out at ya. Let's say the shower is in the basement on the cement. The cement has a floor drain in it, but no drain plumbing to reach from the cement up to the floor of the shower. The water just spills down through the drain hole in the shower base and runs into the drain in the floor. (It is semi-contained by the 2x4 base that the shower sits on).

[Surface Tension]

 Originally Posted By: fishermatt

Can't a guy just brace it up with some treated plywood? I spose the mortar makes it really solid when you stand in it?

No, the irregular shape of the base would make it very difficult to get good contact in all areas. One high spot and you'll crack the base or pop the finish off. The bed will conform to the base.

[Surface Tension]

Steve, I'm not positive what you got. Dead air between the shower base and floor drain?

Since your drain is fixed your not going to find a base that'll work unless you take up the floor and make a connection to your old plumbing.

You can make a shower pan, sloping to where the drain is now. You'll at least need to get a new drain cover on.

You can use a pedestal and buy a base, that'll give you room to make that connection from base to drain pipe.

I think what ever route you go it'll mean cutting out the floor to get a connection. Which isn't a big deal.

[fishermatt]

Thanks to all for the replies and especially RedLantern for the details. It helps so much for a guy's confidence going into a project to have some details on the how-to. You guys are the best, and this site rocks!

[backlash 1]

Steve,

The right way to correct that and make it look on purpose would be to jack hammer up about a foot square area around the floor drain. You will then need to cut off the cast iron floor drain. Once you have your new shower base, just do some careful measuring as to the exact center so you can locate the p-trap accordingly. If the old piping is cast iron, you will need to use a rubber fernco to attach the p-trap to the old piping.

Then just follow red lanterns steps for installation of base. Good luck.

P.S. If the old floor drain is plastic let me know, there may be an easier way to handle this.

[Steve Bakken]

thanks, guys