Hard Starting Strikemaster

[theoilman]

Link correction:

AMSOIL Saber Professional

This link includes my dealer reference so I get credit for it, and as a Fishing Minnesota sponsor (equipment/expert forum) I do appreciate your business. If you use a link that doesn't include a dealer reference number, please enter mine when checking out: 52257

[SP180]

Sorry theoilman i just bought some locally here in a store. But i will write this stuff down since i will be buying more soon and i will buy it online to get you credit.

Thanks for the info.

[SP180]

Just added the amsoil and adjusted the governor a little and it is starting easily. I will let it sit over night and try again.

[BIG DS]

Once you get all that oil burned out of the motor and muffler you will be pleasantly surprised how nice your auger runs. It makes a big difference.

[bturck]

Hanson: Could you elaborate just a bit about DO NOT use the Strikemaster oil? My neighbor sells Amzoil so my supplier would be close. Just wondering what your reason is for not using the Strikemaster oil. Thanks, Bill

[SP180]

bturck,

What i learned today is that with using conventional oil you need to have a stronger mix and that can cause for clogging both the carberator and the exhaust virtually suffocating you motor.

[bturck]

SJP180:

Thanks, I'm going to talk with my neighbor tommorrow and give the amzoil a try. Bill

[evinrude19]

has anyone had a problam with there o-ring on the gas vent? i just bot mine the other day and took it out today and the o-ring broke

[deadeye]

I have had a little trouble with that gas cap o-ring. I have replaced it at least 3 times. (1st gen lazer). I just don't crank it down as hard anymore.

I also have to say that my auger has run since new (2000) with the strikemaster oil. I was in d-rock picking up a new recoil and I asked about amsoil. The guy running the place took me in back and showed me about 25 augers that were in for a overhaul cause of the amsoil lean mixture. I was told that if i run premium (non oxygenated) gas, and the right mixture, that I would not have a problem. I also choke the auger and hit the gas to kill the motor (more lube in the cylinder and a quick start) and it fired up on the 2nd pull this fall. It has yet to let me down. I think it is finnaly getting tired (after a million holes im tired too!!!) but it still wants to go like a champ. Just make sure that you do what strikemaster and their mechanics tell you and you will be fine.

[bturck]

Get in touch with Strikemaster regarding the o ring. They have a new gas cap now that eliminates the o ring. I went through the same thing with mine. They sent me a 1/2 doz of them. I was at the service center one day and mentioned this mickey mouse patent to Cy and he gave me a new cap. I've never had a problem with it since then, over three years now. Good luck and hang on. Bill

[hanson]

Quote:

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Just wondering what your reason is for not using the Strikemaster oil.

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You can use the Strikemaster oil and your auger will run fairly well on it but I believe there are far superior options in oil for these little engines, such as Amsoil.

The one very noticeable thing the Strikemaster oil does is build up a black goo in the exhaust. When you set the auger down, it'll slowly drip out of the exhaust. When you are cutting holes in a fish house, the exhaust will spit this goo onto your fish house walls and/or your clothing if you aren't careful.

This is my 2nd year running Amsoil Saber Professional mixed 100:1 in my Strikemaster Lazer Xpress and there is definitely a difference.

- The auger starts easier, typically 4 pulls w/ full choke and she is running. With the Strikemaster oil it was 6-7 pulls w/ full choke. This has been a very consistant observation I've made.

- No oil residue in the exhaust with Amsoil. None. Like I said before, noticeable and bad with Strikemaster oil.

- It also seams like I don't have to let the auger warm up as much with Amsoil. If I tried to cut a hole too early when using Strikemaster oil, the auger would kill on me. I still have to let it warm up with my current fuel/oil mixture but definitely not as much.

Before I switched to Amsoil, I had some premixed (50:1) Klotz Techniplate Synthetic in a spare gas can that I was running in one of my old snowmobiles. I used this all year in my auger 3 winters ago and it showed the same results as Amsoil, although for those who run Klotz oil, you know how strong the exhaust odor can be. This was a big issue in my permanent shack as it took a long time to clear the smell and exhaust cloud out after cutting the holes.

My Strikemaster (which is a good 5 years old now) has never had the plug changed, never been "summerized", and never had any other kind of maintenance done to it. I put fresh gas in this year, she started in 7 pulls after sitting the entire summer and started and ran great all day yesterday on the ice.

[eurolarva]

Quote:

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I was in d-rock picking up a new recoil and I asked about amsoil. The guy running the place took me in back and showed me about 25 augers that were in for a overhaul cause of the amsoil lean mixture. I was told that if i run premium (non oxygenated) gas, and the right mixture, that I would not have a problem. I also choke the auger and hit the gas to kill the motor (more lube in the cylinder and a quick start) and it fired up on the 2nd pull this fall. It has yet to let me down. I think it is finnaly getting tired (after a million holes im tired too!!!) but it still wants to go like a champ. Just make sure that you do what strikemaster and their mechanics tell you and you will be fine.

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I would be interested in what the Oilman has to say about this. My understanding is that if the oil is used correctly amsoil will fix any damage caused by the oil. I just ordered another batch of the saber so I hope the mechanic is wrong. I agree with his statement about non oxygenated fuel and maybe he made it about using premium because that is the only non oxygenated fuel available however two strokes should be run with 87 octane. Premium fuels will not burn correctly and tend to cause more problems with carbon build up. Ethonal is something we are going to have to live with. The best solution is to buy the same gas all the time. Dont mix holiday gas with BP gas. They use different additives which can turn to goo when mixed.

[SP180]

Well, the switch to amsoil and adjustment to the carb was all that i needed to do to get it to start on the 3rd pull this morning.

[theoilman]

There is a different problem that has been addressed in a couple of other threads, I don't remember which forum.

Today's EPA emissions requirements require the leanest possible fuel to air mixture ratios, and most newer machines have sealed settings, or just used fixed jets with no adjustment. However this causes a different problem with augers - the settings are based on a +75 deg ambient temperature, and with an auger you are a long way from that. Even in a "warm" fish house at +25 deg you are 50 degrees from the base idle mixture temperature, far enough to cause a very lean fuel-to-air ratio. Some machines it is not enough to cause problems, but some it is. The proper repair is to have your mechanic, or better yet, the place you bought the machine make sure it is set to idle mixture properly in the colder weather.

A too lean fuel mixture is a very different problem from a too lean oil mixture.

If there are "25 waiting in the corner", if they have not been disassembled and inspected internally no one knows what caused the failures! I don't know anyone who would reassemble it 'failed' just to set it aside. If they have been properly inspected I would think each would be 'stored' in a box, the auger would not still be on it.

Since I'm in Florida, I do not see this with an ice auger, however I do see a similar problem with my chain saw. If I have it idle adjusted for summer use (95 deg) and then use it in the winter at over 50 degrees colder I have a lot of problems getting it warmed up. If I think about it, I richen the idle setting and it runs great.

Note SP180's post "and adjust the carburetor".

I have a feeling that some brands of augers take the engines and modify the idle jets for cold weather when they assemble the machines, and some brands use the engine standard off the shelf with no proper setting for the colder ambient temperatures.

As to lubricant warranty, Warranty Statement Link, simply stated: if you use the product the way AMSOIL said use it and you have a lubricant related failure AMSOIL will fix or replace it. (AMSOIL Inc Tech Services: 1-715-399-8324)

NOTE: a lean fuel mixture because the manufacturer didn't set the idle properly for the way you use the machine is not a lubricant failure.

[hanson]

Quote:

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However this causes a different problem with augers - the settings are based on a +75 deg ambient temperature, and with an auger you are a long way from that.

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I was thinking about this the other day. I've never really known that these engines were tuned to run at 75 degrees until this year. Is this an EPA standard that our auger manufacturer's need to meet in order to sell equipment that is designed to operate in temperatures under 32 degrees Fahrenheit?

If this is indeed the case, the fuel/air mixture screws are definitely going to need to be adjusted on augers, and/or jetting changes if possible.

There are 2 types of "lean" conditions like Oilman mentioned:

1- Fuel/Oil Mixture. Too little oil and you are "lean"

2- Air/Fuel Mixture. Too little fuel and you are "lean"

The first "lean" condition is caused by the user, either mixing regular dino oil to lean, or forgetting to mix oil, or a failure with an oil injection system. Result is an engine that will overheat resulting in some kind of top end failure.

The 2nd lean condition is a major, major cause of engine failures. You can run your auger on factory oil at a factory specified mixture and the 2nd "lean" condition will still burn you down. Dirty carburetors are probably the #1 culprit in this case, as well as carburetors that are out of adjustment or running the wrong jets.

Something to remember is that both air temperature and altitude will affect your fuel/air mixture. In the winter, an ice auger may experience an operating air temperature from -20 to 50. It will perform slightly differently across that temp range.

[BIG DS]

A couple of things, when switching to the 100:1 mix, run a tank of gas through the auger with out drilling any holes. This will give the engine a chance to clear out the oil and the new mix a chance to "treat" the metal. Once you have done that, you will need to open up both the high and low speed mixture screws about a quarter of a turn each. Then go to the lake and drill 20 to 30 holes with out pushing on the auger at all. It is kind of like breaking the engine in all over again. Once those procedures have been gone through, you are ready to fish! I do this with my customers augers that request changing them over to the 100:1 mix. I have a lake in the front yard so it is a lot easier for me to do it for them. I have seen some very old augers really come back to life after all that oil slop is out of the engine. It usually takes a couple of tanks of gas to get it all out. The thing to remember is it takes a smidge more fuel with the 100:1 mix. I bought a new Jiffy 2hp 8" STX last year and broke it in on a 100:1 mix. It runs awesome. I got lazy last spring and left some fuel in the tank and did not prepare it for storage. I took it out the other day, dumped out the old fuel, put in some new, 5 pulls and we were fishin'. If there are any augers sitting in s shop because of 100:1 mix it is because of a lean FUEL/AIR mixture and lack of proper break in time with the new fuel.

As for the o-rings, check with your local small engine repair shop, and ask them if they have a o-ring assortment. They are usually in a red box and have many different sizes. Grab one that is the same size as the screw on the cap, strech it over and you are good to go. Most places will probably just give it to you. When tightening the vent screw, it just needs to contact the rubber to seal.

[evinrude19]

where can i get this new cap for the o-ring problem

[rocki]

there are 2 screws to open on the auger for the new mixture....is open clockwise or counter clockwise?

[SP180]

When i looked under the carb, there was a standard screw driver head that the throttle closed on. This is the governer. the govener did not close all the way to the screw and this is also where my problem was. There was not enough gas flowing at idle to keep things running. I adjusted it so that it maintained enough flow to keep it running. I adjusted it as it ran to make sure that i was not idling at to high an rpm. Make sense? I write like a 5th grader sometimes.

[eurolarva]

Quote:

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there are 2 screws to open on the auger for the new mixture....is open clockwise or counter clockwise?

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If you are sure the screws are the mixture adjustments then turning counterclockwise will open the screw to make it richer. Clockwise closes the opening and restricts the amount of fuel so it makes it leaner.

I believe the other adjustment is a throttle linkage adjustment not a governor adjustment. Most governors are not adjustable. They are spring loaded and sense the amount of RPM required for the torque the motor is putting out. The governors job is to maintain RPM during drilling and to raise taxes.

[SP180]

Per the operating manual for that motor, it was the governer screw. Other then that the only other screw that is available is the throttle linkage that comes out towards the throttle handle.

[theoilman]

Concerning the 75 deg (F) low idle design - I have not seen it in writing, but I have been led to believe that it is an EPA standard for 2-cycle engines. I think this affects the engine manufacturers, however whether or not it affects the auger manufacturer from resetting it I don't know. Then when you operate it at 50 degrees or more colder, you have potential lean fuel/air ratio problems that in some cases causes burned pistons and more. Many of the newer engines use fixed jets with no adjustment screw or have turn limiters on the screw that you can't turn it more than 1/2 turn. Any good 2-cycle mechanic should be able to rejet or insure that the mixture is right for colder climate use. As to EPA violations for doing this I have no idea.

[GSP2007]

Had similar problem years past- super hard to start on ice great in the shop. Madison Lake guru asked about gas- winter formula has a different flash point. Replaced the fall purchased gas with off road/no alcohol winter purchased gas and the problem ceased.