Smokeless Powder Ban - DNR - Savage Muzzleloader

[ScoutII]

lawdog: I think the point herdog was making is that smokeless powder has been in use for over a century. Whereas black-powder substitutes have only been on the market for 5-10 years.

Seems pretty coincidental that substitute powders come out about the same time as the Savage.

[herdog]

Lawdog, I was not trying to mislead anybody about anything. Its just interesting facts. You seem to be opposed to us using Smokeless Powder in our Savages. Would you mind saying why? From what you said you are shooting about the most advanced Muzzleloader/Powder combination possible.

ScoutII or Whoaru: Do you know much about other Muzzleloaders that shoot Smokeless?

[lawdog]

I am not extremely opposed to it, but I see no reason for allowing it either which has been the point I made since the beginning, if you want to change the law to allow it, you need to say why its needed so bad (oh and "because my gun will do it" is not really a reason either, so don't try to pursuade me with that...). For me, the big puff of smoke from the black powder or its substitutes is a big part of the muzzleloader shooting for me. I like my Omega, but I don't kill anymore or any better than I did with my old smokepole... Fact of the matter is, I haven't even shot a deer with the muzzleloader since I bought the Omega.

[herdog]

Lawdog, Thanks for the comeback. I would fully like to adress the finer points but I am off to the desert early tomorrow to learn more about terrorists and such. For you to say we need to prove why an existing law needs to be overturned when the law came from no where with no input or justification is b.s. Your muzzleloader shoots just as well and actually has advantages over my Savage. Why should mine be banned and not yours?

[herdog]

Lawdog, It's just another Muzzleloader that needs each shot handloaded in the field. Incidently, If the Omega with Triple 7 is not a big improvement over the old smokepole, the old smokepole is not very old or something.

[ScoutII]

lawdog: Biggest point I was trying to get accross was that the use of the powder was not a problem with over 8 years of use and now it can not be used. When the ban was passed no one seems to know where it came from. We were able to use it before. Why not now? Oh and to who has the REAL addvantage in performance, wouldn't you have to say it would be an OLD smoke-pole? You must admit that the modern muzzle-loader takes all the FUN out of hunting? Nuts and Bolts wise you get what you pay for.

[Volare]

The bill in the House has been passed by the committee and is now included in the omnibus Fish and Game bill.

The bill in the Senate is still in committee. The committee is scheduled to meet tomorrow. Since the Chair and Vice-Chair of the committee are two of the four sponsors, I would say it is likely to be approved and added into the Senate's Fish and Game bill.

[Whoaru99]

Maybe I missed the hoopla, or perhaps there wasn't any; regardless, I see the smokeless ban has been repealed.

[ScoutII]

Hoping the legislators have bigger fish to fry for a while, use of smokeless powder in a quality muzzleloader, at the small charges levels the manufacturers recommended, should never have been an issue. Pretty much the same ballistics as as the new blackpowder substitutes are operating at, without the need to clean the rifle at the end of every day. Use of the noncorrosive powder will extend the life of the firearm without giving the user any advantage over the blackpowder user when it comes to ballistics.

[Jameson]

Quote:

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...without the need to clean the rifle at the end of every day. Use of the noncorrosive powder will extend the life of the firearm without giving the user any advantage over the blackpowder user when it comes to ballistics.

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What about 2nd shots in the field? Do the clean burning smokeless powder guns produce a ballistically more accurate 2nd shot than an old dirty burning smoke-filled powder's 2nd shot? I have no experience with the smokeless powder, but my dirty powder sure does leave my barrel dirty. I would think that the 2nd shot on the smokeless powder guns is more accurate than my dirty barrel's 2nd shot. Is their blackpowder that will burn as clean as smokeless-powder?

And before anyone says it never happens, last year was my first year MLing, and I had a chance for a 2nd shot at a 2nd deer.

[ScoutII]

Doing a spit patch between shots gets the bullet down the barrel easier. Do be careful and do not reload too soon after first shot as the powder residue from your first shot may contain a glowing ember. Possible powder flash when you dump in the next powder charge. Otherwise barrel fouling from the sabot's plastic is about the same. The smokeless powder residue is non-corrosive, so cleaning at the end of the day is not necessary, if you want to spend the time processing your deer, and clean your rifle the next day.