Possibly our new camper

[chad austin]

So, what do you all think? Any comments from Keystone owners would be appreciated. Is keystone a reputable brand or are they like vehicles and just brand preference?

After many of years tent camping, my wife and I are looking at campers for most of our future camping trips. We were originally looking for a fifth wheel so we could pull our canoe trailer behind BUT we've recently come across a very good deal on a travel trailer that our sons - friends - parents have. It's a 2007 Keystone Springdale which is 28' overall with 1 slide (I think the slide is 16'). Tonight was the first time we had went to look at it and it is in very great shape considering it's almost 8 years old (it looks brand new with a couple exceptions).

It's a rear lounge model with 2 swivel chairs in the rear, couch and dinette in the slide out, and across from the slide out is the kitchen and bath. The bedroom is up front with it's separate entrance/exit door to the outside.

The good:

Other than it being in great shape the sink, toilet and shower have never been used along with the black and grey water tanks. It has an upgraded mattress on the queen bed. Everything works well and no leaks in the roof or in the plumbing.

The bad: The vinyl floor is cracked but will be replaced by me with laminate flooring. The mini-blinds need to be replaced and 2 window screens. There is currently no T.V. in the camper but I'm not too concerned about that, if we decide we want one we'll get a small flat screen.

The trailer was used outside a business for a year (they used the businesses bathroom) and then was pulled to their home where it has been sitting ever since. It's not on the market to be sold as they are waiting to see if we want it or not. I do know that it will probably need new tires. They are asking 8K for the trailer and weight distributing hitch.

Also what would you guys use for a tow vehicle if you had this particular trailer? I am currently looking for a truck too, probably a new one. Weight of the trailer empty is approx. 6,235 lbs. according to Keystone's webpage.

[upnorth]

I know 2 couples that have Keystone Cougar trailers, on an 5th wheel and another a travel trailer. Both are happy with them. 1 uses it for mostly going to field trials and the other spends the winter down south.

I would check around clist for comparable prices. Travel trailers are normally cheaper than 5th wheels so if you have been mostly looking at 5th wheel prices the price of a travel trailer would seem like a bargain even if it isn't.

[Schubie]

Chad

We have a keystone bullet travel trailer. We like it. Pulls light. Think 6,500 dry weight. It is quiet and so far no big concerns. The biggest thing I don't like are the twist off drain caps for water tanks or low points. But that is not a deal breaker in my opinion.

If you have questions please feel free to ask.

Schubie

[chad austin]

We've compared prices on craigs list and at a few of the local dealers and from what I can tell this is a good dealby a cosiderable amount. Schubie, what do you have for a tow vehicle?

[chad austin]

Maybe a better question would be what do you guys that are pulling 28'-30' travel trailers using? 1/2 ton 3/4 ton?

[leech~~]

If it is a used trailer go over all the roof seal areas on the inside, mainly the very front and back corners to make sure there was no leaks. Bring a flash light and check the ceiling in every cabinet and around all floor edges mainly under each window. Look for repair work like new paint and replaced paneling as well. Good luck and have fun with it!

[upnorth]

Towing is a totally separate thing. I would base the tow vehicle off the loaded weight of the trailer. When they list empty they mean empty. You start adding water, a generator, fuel, wood and another item you take with you it all adds up..

Here is a basic tow rating list for 2011 and it has a link to 2010 too. It will at least give an idea of tow capabilities.

tow ratings

[Schubie]

Chad,

I pull with a ford f150 half ton. Have pulled it with the 5.0 and now a Eco. Very easy. Actual length is probably 32 feet. I agree with leech with any used camper check what he mentioned. I would also add check plumbing and valves.

I also think there are campers with better quality fit and finish as well as worse quality fit and finish. For us our keystone works as we need it to.

Schubie

[highlife4me]

For tow vehicle it depends on how often and where you will be towing it. If you are staying mostly in Mn and only towing maybe a 1000 miles or so a year and using the truck for a daily driver a 1/2 ton with a heavy duty tow package will work just fine but if you plan on towing across the country or in any mountains a 3/4 or 1 ton diesel would be my choice, not for the payload but a diesel has much more lugging power than any gas motor. I personally tow a 25' 5th wheel with my F150 and usually tow my 17' boat also and it does just fine.

[leech~~]

For tow vehicle it depends on how often and where you will be towing it. If you are staying mostly in Mn and only towing maybe a 1000 miles or so a year and using the truck for a daily driver a 1/2 ton with a heavy duty tow package will work just fine but if you plan on towing across the country or in any mountains a 3/4 or 1 ton diesel would be my choice, not for the payload but a diesel has much more lugging power than any gas motor. I personally tow a 25' 5th wheel with my F150 and usually tow my 17' boat also and it does just fine.

highlife4me, do you have to get a special license to tow a tandem trailer-boat rig like that?

[chad austin]

Thanks for the info guys. Duluth will probably be the furthest we will tow it as of now anyways. Leech, you do not need a permit to tow tandem. I will be out looking for a truck after August 20th and if a 3/4 ton is in my budget I plan to get one. I also plan on looking at the Ram 1500 Diesel.

[Powerstroke]

Each state has different rules, but MN does NOT require any special license to double tow. There are a few laws regarding the trailers and the total length allowed, but otherwise anyone can do it. first trailer has to be a 5th wheel or gooseneck hitch and the total length cannot exceed 70.5 feet (I think). Fairly easy info to find.

As far as a tow veh, I would get something that is rated for 8000 pounds or higher. Check out the GVWR on the camper, that is the number you should be looking at, not dry weight. 1/2 ton truck property equipped should be fine. Most of the V8 SUVs are not up to snuff.

[upnorth]

Another thing to think of is if you are towing a load over the rating of your vehicle and get into an accident there may be some penalties. Ins may balk, not sure if the law would fine you but it may and if you smack into someone else there may some legal krap like getting sued.

So even tho the vehicle may actually handle the load, there other things to consider.

[Powerstroke]

Absolutely make sure all of your load ratings are within spec. If you get in an accident and someone gets hurt or killed, they will check everything and you will be fined or worse get charged criminally. Also insurance may not back you up.

Since you said you'll likely be buying a tow vehicle to match, I'll offer some advice. Again, find out what the MAX rating is on the camper. The empty weight is exactly that, empty from the factory. Empty means no battery, no water, no propane, no dishes, no upgraded appliances or options, no bedding, clothes, games, chairs, grill, firewood etc. SO, start with the GVWR on the trailer and assume you will likely get close to that. Chances are you will. You can find that number on their HSOforum too.

Once you have that number you will need a tow vehicle with a tow rating that matches, plus ~10% safety rating. Its not required, but you will be happier you did. There are half-ton trucks that are rated for that, but only a few. SOme are rated for it, but don't have the power to drive comfortably. Don't assume a 3/4 will be better, look at the whole package. There is tons of info about this out there.

Just make sure you plan for the loaded down situation, not the easy trip with a light load and no guests, kids or dogs or whatever. All of those things figure into the load of the truck and trailer. Once you know your weights and ratings, its very simple. The numbers don't lie.