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Man Cave Freeze Up…...No Water.


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This is in today's Strib. Curious to know whether any pro thinks the explanation about why pipe's burst makes sense.

http://www.startribune.com/lifestyle/homegarden/240162101.html?page=2&c=y

I am not a pro. I have had pipes burst in situations that directly contradict their explanation, that is in pipes in the cabin after the water system was drained and disconnected at the pump, so every single piece of pipe was at zero pressure. Unfortunately I forgot to open the faucets in the shower once and so a couple of pipes still had water in them. In the spring there were cracks... in the half inch copper pipe.

The explanation of why a trickle stops the pipe from bursting also seems a little strange. My take was it keeps the pipe from freezing in the first place.

As I said, not a pro.

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don't know how to get that underground pipe unfrozen but:

I had frozen pipes right before Christmas at our cabin. Luckily pump was unplugged but until the plumber came out and heated things up the pump was basically frozen. Once he heated it up it worked. I had opened up a faucet and drained the water in the lines but some always stays in low spots and our basement shower head got blown off because water was in that line that runs down angle to the shower head.

Just to add, once pipe is unfrozen either from your efforts or Spring expect some potential collateral damage in a few spots, hopefully not major just quick fix items.

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Regarding the Strib article: You can conduct your own experiment to test the answer man's theory, but you have to clean up the mess. Fill a 5 gallon plastic bucket with water and let it sit outdoors for a couple of cold days & nights or (if you're impatient) fill a glass quart jar with water and set it (unopened) in the freezer overnight. Both containers have 0 pressure at the surface so the water should just overflow the top of the container if answer man is correct. I guarantee your bucket and/or your jar will be useless after the water freezes throughout.

Pipes burst because of the miracle of water. It is one of only a few substances and the only substance common in nature that expands as it gets close to freezing. From 37 degrees to 32 degrees water defies the laws of physics and expands as it gets colder. It's density gets less than that water which is why ice floats. In your bucket or jar or any water line of normal size, the water at the edges or ends of the cold spot will freeze first forming a capsule with a liquid center. As the liquid center cools further it expands but is encased by the capsule. The expansion takes place until the liquid center finds some relief...usually by bursting the pipe. Plastic water lines can expand some so they are more forgiving than copper or galvanized pipe lines and some frozen plastic lines will have a permanent bulge after they thaw.

As to the effects of the pressurized side of a water line causing freeze-up, the answer man evidently does not remember that increased pressure raises the boiling point and lowers the freezing point of a liquid. The depressurized side of the line will actually freeze harder than the pressurized side will.

Pushbutton, I've thawed many a water line and septic line by doing just what you're going to do...spraying 60 degree ground water on the ice plug. It can be messy. If you have a 1" water line, make your flushing line small...like 1/4 or 3/8 inch. I've taken a piece of tire tube and made a hole for a quarter inch flush line and shoved a piece of larger tubing through the rubber for a drain line to the floor drain. Clamp the tubing over the water line with a hose clamp and you can direct MOST of the discharge water out to the floor drain.

The miracle of water keeps our lakes and river from freezing solid from the bottom up each and every winter. The fact that 70% of the earth is covered by water and that water defies the laws of physics - thus permitting aquatic life to flourish year around - was the greatest factor in turning me from an atheist to one who (personally) had to accept a divine hand in the creation of nature.

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Well, still no water. Did not even bother to try as the frost is starting to get crazy deep. Lots of older houses and buildings in St Cloud starting to go down the last few weeks. My old building downtown crapped out yesterday. Frost must be over 9 ft deep under the street. Did not heed the local publicized warnings to run water at night. No matter where you live, with this next cold snap...might be a good idea wink

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I agree completely.Mom just called her utility(Austin),she was told that they knew of about 100 froze up.We've been without for 8 days & there has to be at least 100-200 more here in town.The morning paper (Mason City)we get has been having articles about it almost everyday for a month. eek

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A alternative to pumping water down the line if to blow hot air down there. Use a shop vac and small tubing to suck out all the water you can. Hook up hair dryer to tube and blow hot air down there. I would suck out the water as it thaws and keep moving the tube down the line. Not nearly as fast as steam or hot water but it will get the jib done. Took about 4hrs using this method at a buddies house.

Make sure and run water after this or your just wasting your time. Then again not sure about constant running of water on a septic system. Might have issues with freezing or flooding that.

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