Non-resident youth question

[MJ1657]

I want to take a non-resident youth firearm deer hunting that is 11 years old. I called a co and he said that they would have to buy a $140 nr tag. I looked in the regulation book today and it listed a nr tag for ages 12-17 as $13 with nothing listed for 10-11 year old hunters.

I emailed the dnr to check if the $140 fee I was told was correct and their response was that "There is no option for non-residents under the age of 12 to deer hunt".

I have asked the dnr questions in the past and got different answers from different people on questions I have asked. It does not seem like they could discriminate based on the age of a person kind of like if they said that nr hunters over the age of 65 cannot hunt here.

Anyone had any experience with this?

[Monkster]

If I am thinking about this correctly, if you are a resident older than 18 years of age, you should be able to take that kid hunting. I am not sure about the resident thing, but I took my 11 yeard old hunting a couple years ago. He hunted with me, under my license. As long as I stay with him and assist him, he can shoot under my license. I am not sure also about firearms safety, my son had it because I wanted him to, but I don't think it is required.

[Powerstroke]

By regulating the age of hunters they are not discriminating. States have the right to regulate at what age a hunter is allowed to hunt.

IN MN resident youth can get a free license to hunt at age 10. It is free.

However you are asking about non-residents and non-res are not allowed to hunt in MN until they are 12yrs old and must have a valid firearms safety card. This is the law. It is not anymore discriminating than telling kids they can't buy alcohol until they are 21.

Here is the chart about buying licenses. It lists the ages.

http://files.dnr.state.mn.us/rlp/regulations/hunting/2010/full_regs.pdf

[MJ1657]

Here is the issue I am having. I was told by a co that it is legal for a 10 year old nr to deer hunt with me as long as I have immediate control of the muzzle.

I emailed St. Paul to verify the fee for the license and they told me there are no options for a 10-11 year old. I emailed them back questioning it and they told me to check statute 97A.475. I have read that statute and it does not say anywhere that 10-11 year olds cannot hunt deer. It states that non residents under the age of 18 is a $13 license.

I am not a DNR basher but I went through something similar to this last year.

I asked about nr youth that are not my kids fishing with me (i'm a resident) and I received answers: They could not fish at all because I was not their parent or guardian, They had to buy a nr license to fish, There are no restrictions on them.

After many calls, emails, and a trip to my local DNR office we finally found out the answer is that they can have their own lines but we can only take my limit. As a side note if they bought nr licenses they could keep their own limit.

After going through that I learned to not just take what someones interpretation of the rules are to actually finding out. I have already received two completely different answers to this question.

Take a look at that statute and let me know if I am reading it correctly.

[TooTallTom]

MJ1675, your interpretation of the law seems to be correct. But, like you said, it would pay to actually find out. The question is, when are you "actually" finding out? (Talking to a C.O. or emailling the DNR or going into the office or something else...)

[Powerstroke]

Looks like my link went to the whole book. Page 12 lists the licenses. It describes a NR youth as age 12-17.

So, what is "immediate control of the muzzle"? A youth can hunt "with you" at any age. These are things that need to be cleared up. You need to talk with a CO, preferably the one working in the zone where you plan to hunt because once you get your answer it would be prudent to hang on the that answer and know who gave it to you.

As clear as I can tell, a NR youth under age 12 cannot buy his/her own license to hunt deer in MN.

Also, the 10-11yr old hunting provision in MN is very new and I suppose the regs have not caught up to allow NR's of the same age to do the same. The regs clearly list a NR youth deer license as for ages 12-17.

[MJ1657]

MJ1675, your interpretation of the law seems to be correct. But, like you said, it would pay to actually find out. The question is, when are you "actually" finding out? (Talking to a C.O. or emailling the DNR or going into the office or something else...)

I have talked to two co's one on the phone and one in person and i've been emailing a guy in St. Paul. My next step is to call and visit the office if necessary.

[MJ1657]

I was going to add something last night but my computer had issues.

Powerstroke you are correct on the regs not being caught up quite yet. The issue lies in the fact that there are statutes that lists it as "persons" age 10-11 without breaking down resident or nonresident.

Its coming down to an individuals interpretation of the law. At this point I have received 3 interpretations from the dnr. One says they can't, one says if it does not specifically say they can't they can and one says they can. I just have to do some more homework and possibly pay the office a visit.

Just so everyone knows I have made it perfectly clear to the dnr that I am willing to pay the $140 non resident tag for this youth to hunt. I am not looking for something for nothing I just want a correct answer and not someones personal opinion.

[Powerstroke]

I applaud you for seeking out the answer rather than winging it and hoping for the best.

[MJ1657]

Thanks Powerstroke.

I finally got somewhere with it today. I spoke to the head of enforcement and she read the statutes and said that it does say under 18 and does not exclude 10-11 year olds. She thinks that my 11 year old should be able to hunt. She spoke to the head of licensing and he agreed. The problem is that it is not set up in the system to accept a 10-11 year old nr.

She explained that her and the licensing guy are not able to change that. They passed the information up the line to the people that can make the decision. She said the good thing is that they have not wrote the programs yet for 2011 deer licenses. It will take some time before I get an answer so she told me to call back in about a month.

Hats off to Pat Watts at the DNR for helping me with this.

[Archerysniper]

Glad to see it's getting fix I would hate to see molly upset come deer season.

[MJ1657]

Me too. It is not a for sure thing yet.

[Archerysniper]

That short youth 20 gauge is still here for her, shoots slugs really well and great for turkeys

[Powerstroke]

Great comments. Its great to get some answers and it sounds like you got a great person to deal with.