Musky Fishing and the Internet

[Musky Buck]

Boy did I miss the boat on what is this all about ? Guessing Tim caught a good fish, congratulations and from likely a stocked Minnesota lake. With 275,000 anglers seeking muskies and non-resident guides and non-residents pouring into MN each summer, getting off course here but is it that people figured it came off a certain lake and so that created more than would be pressure or something ? I better read up a bit. All I know is if someone boated the state record and I knew what lake it would change 0 about where I fish, I guess I didn't know that for real people flock to lakes they think are kicking out a lot of fish, that's very funny actually, need a muskie reality show, it's amazing, hilarious how worked up and jealous and lol over a fish that when we're 6 ft. under who's gonna care, lol. Sorry guys but this is great reading the emotions of flustered muskie anglers, love it.

[cbrooks]

I think I know what Tim is getting at. maybe I have been guilty of this myself but mentioning specific lakes can cause some problems. Sometimes I feel like I'm competing against other fisherman on these lakes.

I'm not one to read the internet and try to follow the hot bite. I'd rather pick a lake and learn it myself. Its too bad if what happen what I think happen to the particular lake that Tim caught that fish on. I really like the post and the story of catching the huge fish. If posting these fish stories is exposing his lakes maybe posting wouldn't be the best thing. I'm not putting any blame on anyone. I'm sorry if people disagree but if I was Tim on a hot bite and it got out where it happen that would be the end. Can't trust the internet. Tim, nice fish awesome story and sorry if your lake was indirectly mention, if that is what happen. I know what its like to put time in on the water. Its the only honest way.

[HugoBox]

I'm reading a bit more and still cracking up.

It was pretty cool to read about Tim's big fish story and post. I didn't look at it myself as much more than a cool story to be happy (and maybe a little jealous) about. I don't much care about the "where" or the "what" - I did ask a little about the "how" though, to which Tim gave an insightful reply. To be honest, stories like that are what gets my lazy arse off the couch at 11PM to hit the lake alone for an hour cause I think the moon is right or something crazy like that.

The part that cracks me up is why someone would run to a lake based on reports. I have made some good friends on this forum and we all fish many of the same lakes - often times we're out there at the same time and share info on what we're seeing, including direct real time info on specific spots and lures and speeds and colors and every other variable, the fact is sometimes one boat or boats may really be on them and some aren't - usually Redig is on them but I don't want his head to get big!

I guess the point is that while I don't disagree with the fact that people will chase a bite, I don't quite buy into the notion that going to the "hot lake" for muskies will pay off.

On the other hand, if I'm a guy who fishes 3 weekends a year and I see a few pics online or read in the paper about big fish coming from a known "big fish" lake and there's a full moon I'm probably going to pick that lake for the full moon weekend. Heck there were still 8-10 boats in the White Bear lot late on Sunday night (more so than I've seen on a week night in quite awhile). The constant clanking of big blades being tossed made it sound like a demolition derby out there. I suspected they were they for the full moon - I sure hope there hasn't been big fish reports coming from there lately cause that would sure be humbling...

[Tim_Anderson]

Not that any of these lakes are "MY" lakes - I really don't consider them to be anything of the such (but I do know what you meant cbrooks). I just do really enjoy a certain amount of solitude when I am fishing. Sort of torques me when things change so dramatically so fast. But like someone said here, there are other lakes to fish, and I will not stop trying no matter what.

I really don't know what I am going to do with the whole report and picture posting thing. Obviously this is something that I am struggling with personally - which is why I posted it in the first place. To vent a little, and to get some feedback.

Seriously you guys... thanks for the input. And thanks for keeping it civil, whether you agree with me or not. This subject would have been out and out war on another site I know of...

Now it's off to the water!

[MNdreaMN]

Fellas,

I must say I'm a bit confused with this topic. Some of the posters that complained of fishing pressure are the ones with the most posts! And is it to "share" a big fish story or "brag?" I love reading the big fish stories on here, but don't complain when you post them and people start asking questions. What are the first things people ask when a big fish story is told...where did you catch it? What were you using? What were the conditions? Etc.

I rarely post on here. I'm more of a lurker. I read the forums to hopefully learn a little. I appreciate the people that share some tips and are not posting [PoorWordUsage]. I also understand the pressure on certain lakes. I think it is more word of mouth than forum talk that gets the pressure going. You tell one person who tells two and the dominoes keep falling.

Good topic of discussion, though. My two pennies.

[DTro]

I've asked this question before elsewhere, but I'll do it again here.

Theoritically let's say that you were offered the hottest, biggest bite ever, but couldn't fish it, unless you were sworn to secrecy. You literally couldn't take a pic, share a story or even make mention to it.....to ANYONE. How much fun would that be? Seriously?

Sure it might be fun right away after the first 10 55" fish, but then what? Even if you were able to tell anyone, they wouldn't believe you.

Sharing with others, the good times and bad is what makes fishing so fun for me. Sometimes it's comraderie, and sometimes it's competition, but in the end you need to come to an understanding with yourself that all the stuff happening around you is out of your control. Internet or not.

[john skarie]

No problem here not telling people about 1 hot bite, lake etc.

I have a couple of friends that fish a few lakes up around the Ely area for trophy trout that "aren't supposed to be in there". Nobody knows, and that's just fine. We've never shared pics or stories with anyone.

Not ever talking about fishing period would be pretty lame, but it's really not that hard to enjoy success without telling the world.

Personally I fish because I love to be outdoors and it's just plain fun.

If I ever stumbled across a lake where we caught lots of big fish and nobody else knew about it, they never would from me.

JS

[kingfish689]

Tim does this mean we will not be seeing anymore 2 page adds of you in the dispatches outdoor publications either with your big catches. or are you just talking about the internet

[Tim_Anderson]

King,

Like I said, I'm not really sure what I am going to do? I feel like I have hit a sort of moral crossroads here. It has been bothering me for a long time, and seems to have finally come to a head. This is not something I am taking lightly. It's a big life decision/moral dilemma for me.

I hope you guys can appreciate that I laid this out here. A guy needs to be able to talk about something like this without having everybody jump all over him. This should be a safe place to do that. If it isn't, then people are either going to clam up, or they are going to go away. I like to think that deep down, most of us do not want that.

Big difference between the power of the newspaper and the power of the internet, I think. Magazines and newspapers are dying... slowly going away because of the internet. The Brainerd Dispatch filed bankruptcy once recently, I think. Then was bought out by a bigger conglomerate to make it go for along with a bunch of other papers. I think it's just a matter of time. That's sad, but a sign of the times. I will continue to do some writing for the dispatch. You won't likely be seeing any profiles about me on there soon. That whole thing was their idea.

I don't see the average newspaper reader being a hard core fisherman. More like my dad, who sits and reads the newspaper every day because he always has. Doesn't own a computer, nor has he ever been on the internet. Enjoys a good story, but never goes fishing. People read the newspaper on the computer now.

But yeah, this is all something to consider. I just need to keep processing all of this stuff, and will eventually come to a conclusion.

Yes, to a certain degree I do care what other people think. But ultimately, I'm the one who has to live with myself at the end of the day.

dtro, I like what you said. Couldn't agree more about the fun of the sharing and the comraderie with other guys who share the same passion. It is not as fun without that. Might have something to do with why Jason posted his two monster fish that he caught on back to back casts... I'm sure he was pretty giddy about it and wanted to share it with everybody. I can't blame him for that, and probably would have done the same thing. The dude is a fantastic musky stick, and people are going to follow him everywhere, probably more than any other guide that I know of. A friend and I were talking about that very thing last night, and I couldn't agree more.

I just think the internet complicates things big time when it comes to this, and guides or people in the limelight, me included, need to be careful with the influence (be it large or small) that we have. It is likely something that is always going to be there. Like Rick said... human nature.

[Cooter]

Intesting post, I almost wish I was the one catching big fish and turning a lake into a zoo. Tim, what do you ask of or tell a client when you take him/her to lake x and catch a couple piggies on lure x? Just curious. Or how do deal with someone who follows you around or blabs? I happened to be on lake x awhile back and saw you put in and knew where you were fishing - saw on your site pics of some big girls caught from then. Does a guy run online and say, hey I know where Tim got those fish? I wouldn't but can you blame someone if they choose to?

I see the point of getting upset when you're basically alone on a portion of a lake for a week and then after word leaks online it becomes bumper boats. Especially when you probably put your dues in and spent some fishless nights out there so you were there and ready when the fish turned on. Maybe the bite stays hot for a couple days or week and the followers cash in on what they technically didn't 'earn'. Then again is the north shore of ML after dark with the correct moon phase and a big DC much of a secret anymore?

It is double edged and don't know what I'd do in your shoes. You could catch a small amount of average fish such as myself and wouldn't have to worry.

Enough of my worthless mumbling. Hope you find a good solution to your dilemma Tim.

[cbrooks]

Tim, I remember you had a post last year about a fish your fishing partner caught. As usual you had a cool story that went with the beautiful pic and you also had some advice on how you dail in on big fish. Fishing the moon phases having a small network of friends that you share info with. You had some interesting theories on big fish group up in packs on this most recent thread. I really like hearing those ideas on fishing. I sure hope you keep posting your ideas on here that help you become so successful. Your ideas are solid even without the picture.

[FutbolGuru]

Overall, the internet is good for fishing. It allows us normal people (who don't get to fish all day everyday) a chance to enjoy our sport when we're stuck at home or at work.

Millelacs is no Muskie secret. People haven't been out there in great numbers as of late because of cooler water temps. All of the sudden we get an unusually warm summer - metabolisms are high, and people are getting bit.

When fish are active on Millelacs, crowds show up. Internet, or no internet.

[MN Musky]

What I find humorous (or "_____-holeish"). Is that the guide that posted the back to back monsters was rumored to be headed to the big V not mille lacs following his post. Thanks for hyping mille lacs after you left!

But I understand " a guides gotta eat too."

Ps. I live on Mille Lacs - alot of sporadic activity with some biters. Still a mean ole lake for muskies most of the time.

[kingfish689]

Tim I dont want to sound like I am jumping on you.I post alot on here myself I ask for info, I ask for help, I even give reports if I have some info that might help someone find a spot like the one I found. and last winter I even post gps cords where I had my best day on the big pond all winter.But once I do that I know that It may be a little harder to fish that spot next time. Or I just look at it like I found that spot I can find another. But a guy does not have to look to hard to find a pic. or a post or an article or add. by you or about you. So people are going to follow you on the water.I would hate to see your post stop as I value the info I get from everyone here. IMO I think this cat is out of the bag and not going back in anytime soon.

[propster]

MN Musky brings up a good point, one which I take the opposite view on. Why do you think it is that Jason called out Mille Lacs about his success and then left? Why leave what appears to us mere mortals to be a hot bite only to go elsewhere? You think he's worried about everyone else going to ML and camping on where they think he caught them, or that if they did that would affect his fishing? Not hardly. The fact is that he knows he can have, and has had, success on other lakes, and realizes it is not about just the spot. If it was why would anyone ever leave? You wouldn't. Many other lakes have similar potential, it's more about timing, conditions and everything else. Once people realize that hopefully you don't see the flock of sheep mentality quite as much.

[Brett Waldera]

I know a few muskie anglers who don't ever post what they catch, or where they caught them. It's not important to them if anyonme knows.

A few of these guys would certainly be called to the carpet and labeled "liars" if they were to chime in the hot bite or pattern.

I'm talking about stories like... 20 muskies in 11 hrs over 40"!!, three 50"+ muskies back to back to back, A 54" and 54.5" in the same day from two different lakes...No Way .

There is a reason every one of us have read this forum. I surely can't ask someone who posts a comment, or bite to apologize...what would I have to read on a Thursday night when I can't go fishing!!!

Good Fishing All!!

Brett Waldera

[nater]

I'd have to agree its a tough situation. I enjoy reading the stories and seeing the pictures of course like any other person who is a true fisherman. It gets our blood pumping and fuels our excitement to hit the water.

I guess I have shyed away from posting pictures on some sites because of just that, popularity and recognizing spots, etc, but I still post reports in some places to help or give confidence to friends and others.

The pressure is growing either way and whether its word of mouth or media people will naturally be drawn to a particular lake. I'm not too concerned about it since the hype of muskie fishing is only going to increase. I just hope we can get more lakes stocked to help with all this frustration!!

[cbrooks]

. I just hope we can get more lakes stocked to help with all this frustration!!

That would help with the overcrowding.

[kingfish689]

DNR only have plans for 8 more lakes over the next 10 years. and it takes about 10 years to get a lake off the ground with fish of any size

[cbrooks]

for the fisherman that are looking for secret muskie lakes become a member of muskie inc you get a monthly magazine that has a listing of where the big fish were caught and what it was caught on. It gives you a good idea what other lakes potential are.

[2000AlaskanDC]

I went back and read Hamernicks post, I dont see anywhere he said it was Mille Lacs, a bunch of other people did, but not him..........

I do need to know tho, did it bring back the "Pontoon Trollers" on the north end?? !!!!!!!!!!! those guys rock !!!!!

[brad coin]

Has far has Mile Lacs is concerned

I agree with Tim I didnt see any 'bite' thats happening??? we went up last weekend however it wasnt internet fueled it was because I know quite a few of the Minn guides and have a good network of people I can call and everybody "speculated" that with the temps so hot its shaping up like a "Mile Lacs year" I just couldnt find anybody who had tried more then once everybody was waiting for 'someone else' to be the explorer,,,If Mile Lacs was pumpimg them out you would see ALOT more pics on the internet. One guide is speculating that if there is a ciscoe die off from temps that a hot bite for muskies will follow,,Another well known Minnesota muskie person told me "well a ciscoe die off wont help a muskie bite if there has been a Muskie dieoff" quite a few people belive that hook mortality has taken a toll on Mile Lacs

we dont consider ourselfs pros but we know the lake fairly well and we saw 2 fish in 9hrs in pretty good conditions-warm,right in a moon period.

I think any hype on Mile Lacs is intended to bring biz back.

I belive Vermilion is the biggest victim of the internet,,I wont even go there with all the crowds its gone from a shield experience to a Mall of America experience.

[Tim_Anderson]

Cooter,

You asked a couple of pretty direct questions there, which I'll take a stab at answering.

I've been blessed and fortunate enough to be able to put a huge amount of time in on the water, either guiding, scouting for guiding, or just plain fishing with pals and getting to know the water better. I've been doing this for over 10 years, but have really amped up and have been fishing 40-80 hours per week depending on the week, time of month, gander schedule, etc. for about the past five years.

It may sound funny, but essentially when people hire me, they are really paying for a lot more than just the chance to catch a fish. I'm a teacher, and I typically educate them as much as I can about what I've learned about that particular body of water. So in my case (and a lot of guides I'm sure) is that we're really getting paid for information by guys who are into the sport but just don't have the time to figure it out on their own, sort of like a consultant gets paid. Fish are a bonus. And of course, there's the folks who come here on vacation and want to musky fish, or catch a first fish, but are without a boat. They pose very little threat.

So people are learning specific spots. Timing. Boat control. Lure presentation. Gear. The hot bite or current trend, and on and on. There's a certain risk to giving all of this up, but I'd have to say that for the most part, it really hasn't given me very much trouble. When I go fishing, I rarely see my past clients out on the water fishing the spots I showed them. And, I rarely see them talking about things on the internet. They may do so with their close circle of musky fishing comrades I think. But overall I think it's sort of an unspoken rule of respect.

Other thing is, I tend to give other musky boats a much wider space than the average guy. I wouldn't typically know if they were fishing the spots that I showed them, because I would never get close enough to recognize them anyway. I guess I do feel pressure, but I feel it from a distance. I feel it most when I try to do a milk run I had in mind, and there seems to be a boat on every spot. That doesn't happen very much, but for sure happens more on weekends and on specific lakes. Like Brad said, I will not go to Vermilion anymore unless it is during the week. It's one of my favorite lakes to go to, but I want to fish where I want to fish, and if I can't do that without playing musical boats, then I've got better places to be.

In a couple of cases, I have asked clients specifically to keep it mum about what I have told them or showed them. Usually it has to do with a smaller, more fragile body of water.

And I have never once had a client pull out a gps and ask to start marking spots.

Something I sometimes do is sort of try to put the client on "information overload." My thinking is that I tell them so much that they cannot possibly remember it all! And, if they happen to be a really sharp guy, well then, I guess they get their moneys worth.

And so far, I haven't really seen the whole thing where someone sees my rig at an access, or sees me catch a bunch of fish and then go and talks about it. Even if I report but more generalize when I do it, they seem to see that I didn't post the lake, so they just leave it be. Again, seems to be something the average guy does, which is cool.

Not too many people following me around. I have stripped most everything off of my rig, and for the most part try to keep a pretty low profile while traveling all over the northern half of the state. I typically don't stay anyplace too long, which does help.

And there's the perfect segway... headed now to points north for a few days. Good luck this weekend guys.

[fishermusk]

Wealthwood access is shallow, I was up there recently and wanted to fish north end. Ended up fishing somewhere else and raised a good one at noon on a flat calm day.

[HugoBox]

Hi Tim -

Not trying to beat a dead horse further but there is a great story in which a young man relates a story and photos of the fish of a lifetime - names the lake and the lure.

Gotta be honest, I think its a great story - the kind of thing that makes this whole internet message board thing pretty cool. Going back to your original post though, I'm sure there are some people on the lake who cringed when they read it. Not sure if this really helped, but I think it goes with your original post - great stories are fun to read but I wouldn't plan a trip based on what I read here or anywhere.

-erik