3 way rig

[ryanmitchell]

With a 3 ounce dropper on say 20 inches of line, do you guys still let out 100 ft of line to get it away from the boat or with that size weight, is that more of a vertical presentation?

What is typical leader length off the back? 40inches for a rapala floater or thunderstick type bait?

Thanks, just bought a line counter reel.

[Jim Almquist]

Ryan with 3oz of weight you are going to be pretty much vertical with your line so then it is just a matter of your leader length and anywhere from 4' to 7' as long as you have a log enough rod to get your fish into the net. I guess I am kinda surprised that you are mentioning plugs when most times that type of setup is for some type of spinners so you can stay as vertical as possible. If you want to get plugs down deep they make inline weights that will give you 10' per oz. You just put them in between your main line and your leader usually at your snap-swivel. They are made in 1,2 and 3oz weights. You would then tie on a deep diving plug that would get you down to 25' and if you added 1oz you should get down to 35' which is about as deep as I would fish for Walleyes. If you fish any deeper you risk having there blatter come up and then there is no chance to release the big one's.

[walleyemaniac]

If this is right or wrong I don't know but this is how I use them and it works for me. I run 3-ways kinda like I do bottom bouncers. No more then a 45 degree angle in the line and just out far enough to be ticking the bottom. Weight size varies with conditions. Dropper length will vary to if they're suspended off the bottom a little. Usually run a 4' to 5' leader with the sticks. Trying to keep them up off the bottom a little bit. This is just what has worked for me when I've used this method, not a real expert in the 3-ways, kind of learn as I go. If you run back to far you might have problems with your lines tangling, try and stay as verticle as possible, thats the purpose of the 3-way (as far as I know) is so you can adjust (with your dropper line) how far off the bottom you want your presentation to run. Hope this helps.

[Northlander]

I run 3 ways when I want less line out due to bottom coming up and down or a lot of snags. I then want 45 degree angle or less. I use a 4-7' lead. I usually use sticks not cranks then.

[PerchJerker]

Agree ----- with a 3-way you want to shoot for a 45 degree angle or less from your rod tip to the weight on the bottom. Don't drag the weight, let it ride just above the bottom and drop your rod tip back occasionally to make sure you can still make contact with the bottom. If going slow enough and in no-to-low current you can almost fish a 3-way right under your boat.

3-ways are a great way to run stick baits near the bottom in deep (or deeper) water, but remember that the crank will run a bit lower than the swivel --- the longer your dropper the longer leader you can use, but the shorter the dropper the shorter the leader you need to use. An 18" dropper and a 4' leader is a good starting point .......

[ryanmitchell]

Thanks for the tips guys. Great stuff. Is 3oz too much?

I would ideally like to have a 2 hook spinner or one hook spinner off a bottom bouncer (2 or 3oz). Have that with a little line out,and then drop the floating rapala below the boat on the 3oz. bell sinker.

Buddy would then have another spinner off the other side of the boat.

Speed becomes an issue then, as in my young trolling career, i try and troll cranks at 2.5 mph, and spinners at than higher 1.5.

I would think the stickbaits might be ok at 1.5, and the standards cranks like shad raps and hot/tots better at the 2.5 mph range. ??

[tweedlap]

rm,

From now until the water starts to cool don't be afraid to run faster.

3.5 is about my average until then.

I know of a few guys, in SD, that pull up to 5.0 mph.

Sure is a bone jarring experience at those speeds !

tweed

[tacklejunkie]

Thanks for the tips guys. Great stuff. Is 3oz too much?

I would ideally like to have a 2 hook spinner or one hook spinner off a bottom bouncer (2 or 3oz). Have that with a little line out,and then drop the floating rapala below the boat on the 3oz. bell sinker.

Buddy would then have another spinner off the other side of the boat.

Speed becomes an issue then, as in my young trolling career, i try and troll cranks at 2.5 mph, and spinners at than higher 1.5.

I would think the stickbaits might be ok at 1.5, and the standards cranks like shad raps and hot/tots better at the 2.5 mph range. ??

Nope.

Three oz is not too much.

Your crank speed and spinner speed are fine.

The jointed rapalas are great for trolling at those slower speeds. And the walleyes love that enticing wiggle of the tails. Just like you young guys do when watching the young females

[tacklejunkie]

rm,

From now until the water starts to cool don't be afraid to run faster.

3.5 is about my average until then.

I know of a few guys, in SD, that pull up to 5.0 mph.

Sure is a bone jarring experience at those speeds !

tweed

I'm assuming you mean cranks at those speeds?

[ryanmitchell]

I'm almost 34, is that still young? I hope so! Tackle junkie you like Rush, so you must be cool. Rush is great on the boat.

I am still trying to figure out the lady thing. I like spending time with them, but I love to fish and am a sponge for all things fishing.

I just bought a buttload of cranks yesterday, not one of them jointed. Looks like i need to make a trip by the store on the way to bros to pick up the boat and get a few jointed cranks.

Which jointed lures you like best besides shad raps? Going to Mille Lacs if I have not mentioned that.

[solbes]

Getting to the right depth is probably #1, which you will control with a 3 way. Speed also seems to be critical. Vary it up or down at the proper depth. Sometimes the 'eyes like it 1.7 mph, and sometimes it's 3.5 or 4. Depends on their mood I guess.

[Jim Almquist]

Which jointed lures you like best besides shad raps? Going to Mille Lacs if I have not mentioned that.

I like to use silver or perch pattern because they match the prey in the lake.

Lots of Shiners and Perch in Mille Lacs

[tacklejunkie]

I'm almost 34, is that still young? I hope so! Tackle junkie you like Rush, so you must be cool. Rush is great on the boat.

I am still trying to figure out the lady thing. I like spending time with them, but I love to fish and am a sponge for all things fishing.

I just bought a buttload of cranks yesterday, not one of them jointed. Looks like i need to make a trip by the store on the way to bros to pick up the boat and get a few jointed cranks.

Which jointed lures you like best besides shad raps? Going to Mille Lacs if I have not mentioned that.

I'm almost (yuck) 50 years old so you're young to me.

I liked Rush since listening to them in the 1970's. Still do. My tagline is a Ayn Rand thing. Alot of their early work was full of Ayn Rand themes.

Anyways, I'm rambling. I think the slower speeds that you troll with the floating jointed raps are better in the fall.

But....it can be something different you throw at them in the summer. I have caught some beauties in July on jointed raps.

J-5 to J-11's in perch, purple, or firetiger. Then you're set

[rattleL]

rm,

From now until the water starts to cool don't be afraid to run faster.

3.5 is about my average until then.

I know of a few guys, in SD, that pull up to 5.0 mph.

Sure is a bone jarring experience at those speeds !

tweed

You have not wake them SD eyes up when I am out at school and on the river out thier we start at 3 and go up, ive run spinners at 2 before and hammered fish all about the bite you are experiencing i fished the croix the other day and ran threeways at 2.2-2.5mph that seemed to be the magic window. always different every day

[ryanmitchell]

We just got back from Mille Lacs. We did not catching a single walleye. WE tried rigs, spinners, cranks(not enough), and some slips. Tops of flats, breaks, rocks, mud. Caught a few dink perch, but no takers.

I was disappointed, but I think I might go back up in a couple weeks to try with my brother? Is there another lake around there or close that is a great walleye lake? Little pine by Ottertail was mentioned to me by a work friend.

As far as the three way. I rigged it up and was moving around 2.2, it felt like with the 3ounce dropper that it was still not deep enough. Talked to a guide before we hit the water and he said i could attach 2 3oz weights with a snap and run almost 6 ounces for the cranks. I have a lot of stickbaits that I wanted to try, but we did more live bait rigging.

I bought a line counter reel and spooled it with 10lb XT. I ran out 125 feet of line with an SR-9 shar rap and i felt like that too was not getting deep enough. The third pole had a 600 reef runner with 2 heavy split shots 3 feet up the line and that certainly did nto feel deep enough.

I have not tried lead core yet and that could be next, ut i would like to do so without leadcore.

[TruthWalleyes]

Fish bite all the time on Mille Lacs...you don't need to go anywhere else to catch walleyes. I personally would never run XT on a line counter reel- the idea is to get 100-200 feet of line out, and think about all the stretch you will have with that much mono line. Run a leader of mono on your line counter with fireline or some kind of braid as your main line. This will allow you to feel your crankbaits vibrations.

I haven't tried 3-way rigging cranks, but will be trying that soon.

Did you do any night fishing on Mille Lacs? or Early AM fishing?

[ryanmitchell]

I was talking with a gome at Bass Pro and he said that braided line would snatch the bait away from the fish if they were attempting to bite, so I bought the mono instead of the braid. I have like a 1000 feet of line on it now. It is very stretchy!

We did not fish a lot at night or morning. I would do that next time. Should have? We huddled up to a group of boats bobber fishing and I caught a rock bass in 9-10 feet. Not what i was looking for.

I know we were close. We were marking fish all around the flats and tops of them. Should have cranked more i think. Gonna get some inline weights for the next trip.

[ryanmitchell]

Things i learned from that trip

1. Dont drag bottom bouncer,roach weight,bell sinker. Drop it down, feel the bottom, crank once or twice and roll on from there. Dragging kicks up mud.

2. Smaller hooks and blades are better on Mille lacs. I came in with 2 and 4 sized hooks and 4-5-6 sized blades. Although switching to 3 sized blades and 7 sized hooks did not produce,I felt more confident. I actually caught a dink perch on a little #3 indiana blade with blue white and silver beads.

3. How to understand my 898 Humminbird better and the subtle adjustments I need to make with bow trolling motor for contour trolling.The lakemaster chip for those units is totally awesome.

Things I still need to work on

1. Crank bait trolling - linecounter,3 way,inline weights,speed

2. Adjustments with the walters. Only techniques I have used so far are jigging,roach lindy(right on the bottom) , bottom bouncer. I think I might try a bullet weight and gumball floater,or an inline weight with 50 feet of line out for suspended fish on a spinner. I have only pictured spinners right off the bottom. With the right weight, say 2 oz. I can just let a certain amount of line out and run the spinner where it is. Put that one in the rod holder and work the 3 ounce bottom bouncer in my hand, just off the bottom.

3. Fish the tops of the flats more. Ideally, make a lap or two on the eges with lindys and spinners, then snap on some cranks and pass over the top for a coupe passes, move to the next flat. Maybe a minnow on a spinner instead of only a crawler. Best minnows on Mille Lacs? (i heard rainbows work)

4. Fish more at night and early morn.

5. Fish more for smallies. Such a fun fish to catch, and there are big ones out there.

6. Utlilize the imaging features of the 898 more to identify choice spots.

[Jim Almquist]

Ryan when you hit Mille Lacs again and you are marking fishing on the top or along the edges you really should give rigging a try. 6lb test wit a 1/4oz sliding sinker and a 6' to 8' leader with a size 6 or 8 hook with either a leech or a crawler with a shot of air and a orange bead next to the hook. You can always change to a colored hook and you can use a nickel colored and keep changing the bead to see if a different color gets more bites. If you really have to troll cranks in the day time you would be better served to go to the west side and find some weeds to troll close to rather then sand or rock.

[ryanmitchell]

Thanks Jim. Few questions.

I cannot seem to wrap my mind around that tiny of a hook. The barb is barely exposed!! I think the hooks one guy in the marina gave me were 7s and they looked tiny. They were chart. Does any one color hook work better out there? I would think with a hook so small,like you sid the bead choice would be top bill. Guy also use 2 smallchart beads, instead of one, say orange bead.

1. If you pinch a worm in half does that eliminate the effectiveness of the worm blower, blow? Must be a total crawler,with maybe the tail pinched off? On a 6 sized hook, only the very head of the crawler would be hooked. I would think that would call for a free sppol, let em munch and then set hookset also right?

2. What is the advantage of the slip sinker over a roach weight or lindy weight? You still have to have a swivel to separate weight from the hook right??

Thank you

[Jim Almquist]

I hardly ever go to a bigger hook like a #2 unless I am using minnows like a Creek or Redtail Chub and for Shiners and Rainbows a #4 is usually good enough. I like the idea of having as much of my hook hidden in the bait and when a Walleye clamps down on it and you set the hook it will get him right in the side of his mouth. If you find that you are hooking them to far back in the throat you can always start using a circle hook. I have always used my crawler whole when I am adding air but if you want to skip the air or put them on a jig a half will work great. I really don't have a favorite sliding sinker but I do have most all styles in my tackle box. I have found myself using the egg style a lot more and the only reason it seems to cause less line twist when I am pulling Leech's. I always have a swivel on just because I hate line twist and Leech's are the worst at causing twist.

[PerchJerker]

If you're trolling cranks you want a superline, not a braid, unless you're trolling in open water with planer boards and then the 10 lb XT line is great way to go. You can add a flouro or mono leader to your superline if you want.

Jim makes a good point, rig the top and bottom edges of the mud flats if you're marking fish there ---- same for if they're scattered across the top of the flat. You could use spinners instead of rigging too. The key is that they are slower presentations that will keep your boat and your bait in front of the fish in high percentage, defined areas.

I do lot of mid summer open water trolling on mille lacs -- get away from the flats, use my electronics to look for bugs, bait and fish (usually suspended), and go after them. Mille Lacs walleyes will come quite a ways to hit a bait, so I usually am at least 3-4 feet above the bottom, and sometimes MUCH higher up in the water column ---- it depends on how many lines we can have out and what we're seeing on our electronics. I don't run spinners in open water like that very often but you can do it if you want.

[ryanmitchell]

Thanks for the info gents. I really appreciate it. I need more working locating bugs then too. We would see pods of something on the Humminbird, and they would be in the middle of the water column. I assumed they were bait fish but i could not be certain.

I did get better and differentiating between hard and soft bottom.

It seemed like all the baits i talked about with anglers around there, all the cranks a smaller too, like sr-5 raps or little reef runners.

What cranks have you had success with on Mille lacs?

[PerchJerker]

What cranks have you had success with on Mille lacs?

It differs at different times of the year. Right now, in the peak of summer, I like Reef Runners and Tail Dancers, and if I run leadcore I like Glass Shad Raps and Jointed Shad Raps. Minnow Raps are good too and can be run on lead or on unweighted line, depending on where the fish are in the water column.

[ryanmitchell]

600 or 800 reef runners? Talked to a guide that said the angle of the 800 reef runner, how the nose is tipped down is not as appealing as a short lipped bait that runs straighter.

Does that make sense?