getting in to muzzleloader

[northspear]

i work all summer and fall out of town/state and dont get much time to bow hunt and rifle it starts just as fast as it ends so i need to make my season longer.

just wanting to know what a good gun would be at a good price around $200 250. my gun range would be in the 200yd and less range.

Thanks for any help.

[RainbowBait]

Is that just the money you would be spending on a gun? or is that rings, scope, gun?

[96trigger]

If he is extending his season, he won't be able to put the scope rings etc... on they will be illegal during ML season, assuming he doesn't have a special license allowing him those extras.

TC just came out with a new gun in that range, the Impact. I don't know anything about it. But TC is probably the leader in ML's. I have a remington Genesis and really like it. It was made by Traditions. You get a nice Traditions buckstalker or CVA wolf for what you are willing to spend. You need to look at what kind of bells and whistles you want for that money. Do some research on the different models in your price range. Go to the belas HSOforum and read the customer reviews of the guns in your price range, find 3 you like, then do some research on those 3 guns. When you have it narrowed down, go to the store and get a feel for it, if it doesn't feel right, go to the next on your list and so on. Probably not much help, but you might not get much on here at this time aside from the usual, "get one that fits you" advice. This forum is much more active in the fall.

[Trapper J]

northspear i bought a cva wolf muzzleloader a couple of yrs ago for about 170$. came with everything to shoot except powder.its pretty simple and shoots good. its 50 cal.shoots group of 3 at 100yds.in 3" the hardware on the rear sight is cheap but easy to replace just a machine screw and nut.recoil isnt bad about like a 20 ga.singleshot thats using 100 grs. of powder.for a introductory gun,im pretty happy with it.

[Code-Man]

I don't care which brand you buy but spend 50-70 bucks more and get stainless! TC Bone Collector looks awesome but more then your budget. IF your not looking to exchange barrels get a Omega or something along that lines, I wouldn't waste your money on an Encore or something like that. 209 primers are a lot easier then Caps FYI

[96trigger]

I second the stainless, its what I meant about bells and whistles, you can buy a bottom of the line TC for what you are looking at spending, or you can get some nice accesories like stainless barrel, better sights, etc.... if you go down to the traditions or CVA lines. Most of these companies offer guns in your price range, some will come with a starter kit, others might come with a scope and rings. It all depends on what you want to buy. One thing to note though, expect to spend another $75 give or take $20 bucks just on powder, primers, bullets, cleaners, etc.... That stuff adds up fast.

[northspear]

well thanks for all the advice im sure more will roll in as it gets closer. and i dont know what i want yet as far a stainless or not. i should so it last longer and so i only have to buy one. and i wont be putting a scope on it. as far as bell and whistles that will all come with time. adding new sites and what not. but i cant wait to get into it. not a lot of people do it so ill be coming on here for a lot of advice. Thanks Luke

[fr0sty]

I bought the thompson Omega z5 (blue back). I think it was around $280 or so? I am happy with it.

[RainbowBait]

If you use it during slug season for deer can't you use a scope? How are you going to shoot 200 accurate with no scope?

[96trigger]

Rainbow, yes you can use the scope during the firarm season, but it sounds like he already rifle hunts and just wants to put more time in during the ML season, where scopes would be illegal. Some people, myself excluded, think a 150 yard shot with open sights is not that hard, but thats a whole new can of worms.

[vister]

I bought my fiancé a cva optima pro. Camo thumbhole stock, stainless fluted barrel by bergara, which is advertised as the leading ML barrel in the industry. Very accurate gun, very nice looking rig, breechloading which is a must I believe, VERY comfortable and natural feeling. Im jealous it hers and not mine!! I believe it was 279 at that mountain store! A little more than what ur thinking, but definetly check it out

with the exception of one buddy, everyone I know uses cva. For the money you won't be disappointed!

[flipper]

What do you mean it is breechloading?

I agree that the CVA with the bergara barrel would be a good choice but I feel the way a gun fits the shooter is of utmost importance. Nearly any gun on the shelf will shoot better than you can hold it once you find the right load. Go to your favorite store and shoulder a few guns to see what fits you comfortably. Some of the modern guns are designed to be more comfortable with a scope and it is uncomfortable to get down to shooting open sights.

I feel that muzzleloading season in Minnesota is a 100 yard or less ball game. Even if you qualify to use a 1X scope anything over 100 yards is pretty iffy.

[RainbowBait]

how do you know what barrel comes on the CVA's. I just looked at them on cabelas and it doesn't say bergara on there. Just wondering if its differant or not... Thanks.

[RainbowBait]

Just looked at the CVA Accura and that does say bergara barrel.

[vister]

TC's may be good guns, with a scope, but the feel of a CVA using opensights cant be beat. by breachloading, i mean breach action!! sorry!! much easier to clean and unload, however unloading any ML is done the easiest by shooting it! the way the cheek and comb on the stock of CVA feels is a perfect setup for opensights. not sure of a scope, but even if we were able to use scopes on ML's during smoker season, i'd still go open sights. keep in mind, most guns made today are capable of shooting well beyond our abilities. just like anything else, buy what you like. we're just here to give you advice!!

[vister]

my fiance's gun wasnt advertised as having a bergara barrel. looking at the guns in person was the only way to find out. its stamped with other info on the barrel. ya know, the info that tells ya stuff like .50 caliber, 1:28" twist, so on and so forth

[lakevet]

Practice,practice,practice,practice,practice,practice,practice,practice,practice,practice!!!

Virtually any decent muzzleloader you get will outperform todays hunter's ability to shoot IN HUNTING SITUATIONS.

If you can, ask around to see if anyone will let you shoot their muzzleloader. Pick their brains about their guns faults. Less likely to have buyers remorse if you test drive a few different guns. Also muzzy success was the lowest of any season both in % successful (I believe about 13%) and total deer harvested. If regs change so apr's and no cross-tagging bucks the success will likely be lower. Not to discourage you, just be realistic about your expectations. I have heard guys talking about selling their muzzleloaders lately due to poor success/didn't enjoy the muzzy season. Ask around and you may be able to pickup a lightly used gun that originally cost more than your budget. Just be sure to check it out because if they didn't maintain it the barrel could easily be rusted/pitted.

Don't forget to look at rifles like Lyman's Great Plains rifle and other more traditional models. A little more work, but alot more fun. And they look great on the wall, and in your hunting pictures.

Have fun, it is a great way to hunt.

Lakevet

[lakevet]

If you use it during slug season for deer can't you use a scope? How are you going to shoot 200 accurate with no scope?

We routinely shoot deer out to 100 yards offhand standing open sights, BUT we practice alot at that range in that position and have been at the muzzleloading game for years with the same guns that we know very well. Farther shots are possible with a rest. Ultimately you need to have the ethics to know your personal limits.

[lakevet]

well thanks for all the advice im sure more will roll in as it gets closer. and i dont know what i want yet as far a stainless or not. i should so it last longer and so i only have to buy one.

Our group has guns ranging from 2 years old to one over 40 years old. Only one is stainless (the 2 yr old gun). The 40+ year old gun is like new, due to very good maintenance by the original owner and now his son. If you are good about maintenance, stainless isn't necessary. If you are not great about maintenance, stainless will rust, but not quite as easily. I personally would not get stainless.

lakevet

p.s. the 40+ yr old open sighted gun is good to 150 yds with a good rest with its present owner pulling the trigger.

[vister]

If regs change so apr's and no cross-tagging bucks the success will likely be lower. Not to discourage you, just be realistic about your expectations. I have heard guys talking about selling their muzzleloaders lately due to poor success/didn't enjoy the muzzy season.

thats a shame, isnt it?? people wanting to sell their muzzleloaders because they werent successful. they must be the same people i hear unloading their clips opening morning of firearms season. that one shot thing must bother them!! because deer have been pressured so much by the time ML season rolls around, we usually concentrate our hunting on making small drives in groves and patches of willows. its a teriffic time! our motto is "everyone has to unload their gun in this drive!" nothing better than knowing deer are fewer in numbers and still seeing a members big puff of smoke, followed by the sound of a gunshot. multiple shots, and you know multiple people are seeing the deer.

by the way, muzzleloaders require the most maintenence of any of your hunting gear!!!! buying a used one at a dealer will usually result in being the same price as a new one, because the amount of time a gunsmith spent cleaning that gun to get it ready for the rack. if buying a muzzleloader, you almost have to buy new. unless you know where to look for crud when buying used, you could be buying something that will really be a headache.

[flipper]

Very good advice Lakevet.

I have a Lyman GPR and that is one fun rifle to shoot roundballs out of.

I appreciate the practice, practice, practice remark. Too few people practice with their muzzie enough before season.

[walleyemaniac]

Whatever you buy, get it early so you can shoot it alot. I mean experiment with a bunch of differant loads and find out what your ML shoots best. I think alot of people make opinions without experimenting first, each gun shoots differant. Try differant amounts of powder with differant bullets till you find what your gun groups best. Keep your barrel clean while you do this so you don't loose accuracy. And like the other guys said find one that fits and is comfortable for you to shoot. You can always up-grade. Good luck finding a gun and remember shoot alot, get use to how it shoots, you've only got one!

[96trigger]

ML is a different animal than Firearm. Maybe that should also be mentioned. Maybe those that didn't like it thought it would be like firearm, and found out that it is not, it can be bitterly cold, you only have one shot, and might have to put in twice as much time to see deer. The upkeep on your ML as vistor said, is 2x that of a normal firearm. If this is not for you, don't buy a ML. Last year I bowhunted during ML as it was the only option. Man, it was frigid. Point being, I love to hunt whitetails above all else, doesn't matter the method or weather, i this isn't you, you might want ot reconsider. Keep that in mind.

Used ML are not the easiest to find, I know some places won't even take them in on trade. Too much work and not enough resale value.

[Musky Buck]

Buy one I guess that can fit a scope as MDHA is supporting a bill to allow a 4x scope is that accurate ? My Black Mountain Magnum Thompson Center well looks like I'll be scopeless. A scope for me would be a huge advantage as the nocturnal deer, the few I see tend to be in the last minutes of shooting light and I can't tell if it's a shootable buck often times so I don't fire. With a scope I could whistle them to stop, analyze quick and take that shot, with my binoculars there's a lot of movement and then finding the deer again and realize oh there's 3-4 deer which one is the buck etc. So then I scheme how I can ground hunt that trail and not jump the deer to get closer so the last minutes I can maybe get a shot the next night, lol, hasn't happened yet, usually get busted by a doe or fawn. I end up never getting a shot and I've been at it since the 1st year of the all-season tag, but muzzy hunting is supposed to offer a different challenge isn't it? Give me a scope and I'll be basically rifle hunting the muzzy season, could sell my muzzy but it goes against what I think the muzzy hunt should be. Dilemma

[trolloni]

They are called muzzeloading rifles arent they?I think they need a scope to be efficiant !If youre gettin a new one ,get one with a hammer 99.9 percent of the time itll go off!