DEER BAITING

[Eskimoman]

"Making it legal will no longer give the illegal baiters the upper hand."

So then shining and shooting them out of season should be to? And whet do you mean by the upper hand. Deer hunting is not a game. You are not going against anyone to kill the most or biggest deer. You should be out there for the fun, getting some meat for the freezer and a chance at the trophy buck. That is what hunting is.

[caseymcq]

Are food plots baiting?

From page 71 of the 2008 MN Hunting Regs in the section on Hunting Method Restrictions under the subsection Bait or Feed:

This restriction does not apply to foods resulting from normal or accepted farming, forest management, wildlife food plantings, orchard management, or similar land management activities.

It would seem to me that this is saying it is ok to hunt over food plots.

I really don't know so I am in all scincerity posing the question, how much difference is there in the effectiveness or the possibility of transmitting disease of a salt lick or mineral block than "bait"? (Is a pile of corn, oats, apples, etc. more enticing than a salt lick or mineral block and is that pile of "bait" more likely to contribute to the transmission of disease than the salt or mineral?)

[MUSKY18]

While I don't bait per say, I do throw out some mineral blocks and salt blocks in the spring time. Guess some might consider this baiting, not sure if it is or not. I like to do it because in the spring time the bucks needs all the minerals they can get to help with antler growth. We have a couple of spots where there have been salt blocks down for quite a few years and the deer have cleared a 4 foot circle around it. They have also got it dug down about a foot or so to get the minerals out of the ground. As for putting out apples, corn, etc. if they legalize it, more the better for everyone, if not, then I won't do it. We hunt public land and have always been able to get deer, except for the late 90's when there were some pretty lean years. Would baiting have helped? Dunno, as there just weren't that many deer around.

[Fishinguy40]

I agree with others in this post that baiting should be legalized, with strict regulations.

Years ago I lived in Michigan, where baiting is legal. There is nothing more enjoyable than watching the deer right below you. As said earlier in this post, I believe it allows a hunter to be more selective. Last time I hunted in Michigan 3 years ago I had five deer under my stand, does and yearlings but didn't shoot any of them. I just watched.

This year I am returning to Michigan again. They have implemented STRICT rules because CWD was found in a single deer in a domestic herd. All feeding and baiting has been banned in the lower penninsula. Baiting is still allowed in the UP but is limited to 2 gallons and must be spread out over a 10 yard area. I'm sure this was to prevent the "swapping of spit".

So is baiting legal? In Minnesota no but in some states yes. Is it ethical? That questions will never be answered just like abortion and other hot topic issues.

[Badger]

I am on the bandwagon to make it legal as well. Its a very safe way to hunt and it will free up the CO's so they can concentrate on bigger issues. Regarding the disease comment, this could be the case. However, you could legalize baiting but make it illegal to dunp it in a pile. Spread it out, its that simple. Also, by legalizing baiting, it levels the playing field for those of us that actually follow the law. Making it legal will no longer give the illegal baiters the upper hand. Of couse this is just my opinion, thats all. Not trying to ruffle an feathers!

Baiting is a HUGE issue for CO's, because "hunters" violate the 2 gallon rule (2 gallons of bait per 40 acres owned). We have a 40 in WI by county land. We have seen less deer every year because of baiting (and baiting violations). We never bait and are successful every year because we actually get out and hunt.

We're tired of 4wheelers as well, driving up and down logging roads & snowmobile trails only to set up on a pile of bait. A 4wheeler is a good tool to drag deer and for people that have a difficult time walking. If you're healthy, get off your a$$ and walk/hunt in the woods.

Article from the WI Outdoor News....

In asking for hunters to make this personal decision, Frank said in a press release, "While currently legal in areas outside of the CWD zone, we are asking all hunters and citizens this year to refrain from the baiting and feeding of deer throughout the state. TB has been identified in the Minnesota deer herd, and CWD was recently discovered in Michigan deer. Eliminating the baiting and feeding of deer is a cost-effective way to substantially reduce the risks of spreading disease in Wisconsin's deer herd.

"Baiting and feeding of deer threatens not only the health of our deer population, but our dairy industry and forest industry as well, increasing the risk of TB being transferred from deer to dairy cows. And an artificially high deer population threatens regeneration of our forests with the potential for negative impacts on our forest and wood products economy," Frank said.

Warnke said Frank's remarks about "artificially high" deer numbers stem from the belief that baiting and feeding provide more "fuel" for deer, resulting in higher fawn birth rates and better fawn survival.

"Baiting and feeding are likely supporting a higher winter survival rate and a greater recruitment of fawns in the spring. Unnaturally higher deer numbers result in negative impacts such as more deer/vehicle collisions, more crop damage for farmers, stunted forest regeneration, and more deer browsing, which hurts Wisconsin forests," Warnke said.

Wisconsin's deer herd was estimated to be between 1.5 and 1.7 million animals heading into the early archery season.

DNR veterinarian and land program manager Dr. Sarah Hurley said studies have concluded that CWD can be spread between deer through saliva and at contaminated sites such as baiting and feeding locations. Research conducted at Sandhill Wildlife Area concluded that even with limiting the quantity of bait placed, the potential for disease transmission continues.

DNR wildlife health officials say CWD and tuberculosis are transmitted through deer-to-deer contact like that found at bait and feeding stations. CWD also is transmitted through exposure to a contaminated environment, and tuberculosis is transmissible from contaminated food and feed sites.

"Baiting and feeding cause unnatural concentrations of deer and their activity increasing the risk of disease infection and spread," Hurley said. "Repeated use of feeding and baiting areas poses a long-term risk of disease transmission."

Warnke said 25 states have a complete ban on baiting for deer hunting, 12 states have partial baiting restrictions (including Wisconsin), and 13 states have no restrictions.

[Bear55]

I am not a fan of baiting and I am glad the DNR is cracking down on it, once a few guys lose their guns I don't think we will see the wide spread baiting that happens now.

If you really need bait to kill a deer you probably should spend some more times in the woods, its called hunting remember.

[Gary Crichton]

Am I correct that you can bait in the area close to your stand, but must remove it 10 days b-4 the season starts. Does it need to be removed all together or can you get away with spreading it out and cover it with leaves. It seems that rule could cause issues. What if not all the bait got removed, or the deer moved it away from the bait site a few yards or so.

G.C.

[SORNO]

Am I correct that you can bait in the area close to your stand, but must remove it 10 days b-4 the season starts. Does it need to be removed all together or can you get away with spreading it out and cover it with leaves. It seems that rule could cause issues. What if not all the bait got removed, or the deer moved it away from the bait site a few yards or so.

G.C.

total removal. If the CO's want to be sticklers they could get you for an apple skin in the wrong spot.

[primetime49]

we always get people sneeking in to hunt that have been on property and think that they can return at will

neetest thing happened as one guy went out in dark and cut his way up tree ,mounted his portable stand only to realize that when sun came up he was 30 feetaway from large truckload of apples dumped night before from local orchard and 200 pounds os salt

this is area on one of our farms known as safeland for critters

please call every time your going out and ask permission

[Gary Crichton]

So how do you handle that, when someone does not ask permission and sneaks on your land. If that person was on your "safeland for critters".

G.C.

[glenn57]

ok, so like anyone cares, but hear is my opinion. i am 100% in favor of baiting bear.i am not a pro bear guide or hunter but have done enough to consider myself knoweldgable and truely believe that unless you have mega time and luck biating is the only way you will get a bear. we have had the cabinfor 43 years and maybe seen only 6-7 bears in our travels. bird feeders in yard dont count. deer baiting i am 100% agianst. dont think it helps, i have never done it. discliamer. from articles i read from others doesnt pay. on the other hand i have been considering feeding the deer AFTER the season closes, but the desease thing scaress me. okay i will quit and everyone can beat me up now.

[bmc]

I agree glenn, comparing bear baiting to deer baiting is like comparing apples and oranges. In some areas where there is a lot of cropland, I don't think a person would have to bait bears as they'd be coming to the crop (corn). Around this area, in the big woods, good luck even seeing a bear while hunting w/o bait.

I just feel that baiting deer is a lazy person's way to hunt. Get out, do some scouting, do some armchair reading in the off season and you should learn enough to be able to shoot a deer w/o baiting. I also don't think you can compare a couple acre food plot to a bait pile. Granted they both attract deer, but a food plot doesn't guarantee you a deer, where a bait pile more than likely does.

Brian

[archerystud]

In talking to hunters in Michigan and Wisconsin where deer baiting is legal, many of them told me that you don't want to legalize baiting.

The biggest complaints that I heard were that everyone was trying to outdo the other. One guy does a bucket load of corn, then next guy does a dump truck load of sweet potatoes, etc etc.

They complained that the deer only had to move at night since they had a smorgasboard on every piece of property around.

[Fishinguy40]

I have to disagree with you bmc. I don't feel that baiting deer is a lazy person's way to hunt and it doesn't guarantee a deer either. I have shot more deer in Minnesota where it is illegal to bait (and I haven't) than I have in Michigan where it is legal (and I have baited).

Not all of us have the luxury of owning private land,living close to public land or a "food plot" or the time and resources to drive several hours just to scout an area. I live in the cities. It's at least a two hour drive to get to any decent public land. I'm fortunate in that I have hunted the same area for several years so I am now familiar with the land.

I think in some or most cases baiting would be more of a challenge than hunting a food plot. My image of hunting over a food plot is what is seen on some of those "hunting shows". Yeah 10 deer come in every day to feed like clock work. Sit in a blind and pick the best one. That's a challenge.

[Fishinguy40]

That's why you need strict regulations on how it is done.

Will some people still dump truck loads of bait? You bet. But I guarantee they will even if baiting is outlawed all together. There will always be people that are going to ignore the rules, no matter what they are.

[Musky Buck]

I think in our high speed, everything should come easy internet world, that is why people want to bait. I rarely hear someone ever mention I want to bait deer because I want to feed my family. If you do stop hunting and put your dollars into beef at the grocery store, deer hunting isn't cheap. They want the easy way out. It sickens me to watch hunting shows where they blast deer under or very near these feeders.Why can't we bait waterfowl, because we would slaughter them right. Those shows should be called harvesting shows, that is not hunting, we already get to hunt during the rut here in MN. Free Fast and Easy is what a lot of newcomers think everything should be. I can thankfully say all 23 bucks I've taken have been within shooting hours, no early or late shots, no bait, no short cuts, no using the wifes tag while she sleeps, they all get registered and not butchered first so I can go take another buck, I just put in all the time I can and I don't shoot 1 1/2 year olds. I found bait piles also, I hunt a farm where the farmer allows bow hunting, I stumbled across huge corn piles in the swamp, now will I be at risk of being ticketed ? Should I tell the farmer ? The worst part is this guy and sons are well respected in our town and they are seen as great bowhunters. Little do the people know, I have been told they have taken 11 deer so far. Baiting deer is for the joker who can't beat the deer at their own game. If you don't like our laws, move to where you can lawfully bait them. If you are a baiter, you have little to no ethics. The laws are for us to all have a fair playing field, just because some cheat don't lower yourself. There are a lot of cheaters, shooting too early or late, baiting, people shooting deer the night before season is a problem, poaching is really bad right now, 1 rack might bring a guy a grand, you take a buck rifle hunting and sell the poached rack as the buck you claim to have shot that season, using the wifes and whoevers tag to save your buck tag, it's amazing how hard people work to skirt the law and bend the rules. These hunting shows are pathetic. What I've learned is if you have a thousand acres you can hunt the neckdown areas. If you have an outfitter/guide you'll probably get a shot, if you hunt elk in colorado the outfitters/guides have taken many public land bulls bowhunting and then they retreat to their ranches to finish guiding for the season just before you drive out for your rifle elk hunt. I have zero respect for the hunting shows anymore, all you here is it's a shooter or it's a 150 class buck, or he's too little. All I know is they seem to show up at private ranches, go sit in the guides stand and shoot, no real hunting going on, then it's off to the next state to do it over again and boy do they care if they can get it on film. These people it's their business, not hunting, we all could score on these very same deer if we could afford to hunt private ranch after private ranch, this is turning into a different thread, sorry about that and good luck to all of you that are ethical and hunt by the book, to those of you that cheat I hope your gun jams. Musky Buck

[Badger]

In talking to hunters in Michigan and Wisconsin where deer baiting is legal, many of them told me that you don't want to legalize baiting.

The biggest complaints that I heard were that everyone was trying to outdo the other. One guy does a bucket load of corn, then next guy does a dump truck load of sweet potatoes, etc etc.

They complained that the deer only had to move at night since they had a smorgasboard on every piece of property around.

This is exactly what's happening in the area we hunt. Like I said, our 40 acres is in Rusk County and we don't bait. The (illegal) baiting has gotten way out of hand on county land. Our party and others we know, are going to report these violations to the DNR this year. We are tired of it period! People are also leaving 20ft. ladder stands on county land thru the 9 day season. All portable stands must be removed every day. If you hunt in Rusk County, there will be several hunting parties that will turn in violaters this year. Shooting a big buck over 20 gallons of corn & apples, and going to a bar to brag about the "great hunter" you are is very sad! You might as well do a fenced in hunt at a game farm!

[Tipup101]

I just have to say I love this topic. I'm still on board with baiting. I don't think you will ever see it in southern MN due to the fact of all the crop land and area for food plots. If you want corn by your stand do what we do and pay the farmer to leave some stand for ya. Or next year we are gonna start planting apple and white oak trees.

[primetime49]

Gary,in the case of this guy he was so embarrsed that he has not come back.

we get so many tresspassings in a deer season it is rediculous

like the local warden says [you are number 17 on the list right now]lets talk when i can get there.

I would rather they take care of the older widow landowners that are scared of the orange strangers behind the grove .

season is too short to handle everything

safeland is usaually only a couple of acres in 160,this farm averages about 7 deer per bow ,slug season that we know about and that is not enough harvested.

went out last week before corn was combined and as usual noticed that deer coon squirrels wind had pretty much taken everything off 3 to 7 outside rows of corn.

i am sure renters would like to have that corn in bin not in critters guts

I usually write or talk about these persons on radio who violate the right to play and they quit doing it

[Gary Crichton]

Primetime I feel for ya. I would have a tough time with it also. Being # 17 on the list, so are sort of on your own. Not knowing your area, do you have a recourse to cut down the number of illegals. What can you do..?

G.C.

[Musky Buck]

Baiting- I like the it's like leaving corn in a field or a food plot. I say congrats to those of you who cleared tree's, worked the ground, bought the seed, sprayed the weeds,mowed it down, spent your hard earned dollars and obeyed the law to it's fullest in order to help all wildlife almost year round. Dumping 50 pound bags of corn from Fleet Go for a few weeks around hunting season only to stop once season is over. How can you compare the 2? The private landowners doing this also helps everyone else, we don't have 30 foot fences around these and carrying capacity of the land and the rut and deer travel,travel and travel. Do you want to hunt or slaughter, is it your ego and telling people by the water cooler I bagged MY deer, I hate that my deer saying, the deer owe us nothing, yep got my deer, is a bad saying, I got a deer is more correct. We aren't guaranteed nothing if you are then you aren't hunting. It's our laws, if we revoked hunting priviledges for baiting and guns/equipment, it would decline, it's like most of our laws, slap on the wrist, get caught enough and you are in trouble, but oh it's just a deer. Some of you in the cities say well I live so far away or whatever, get your resume together and move, I think america is still a free country so move just like I could move into the metro area if I chose to. Baiting deer is wrong or every state would gladly say OK to it. Remember it's you who has to look in the mirror, face the almighty one at your death, look at those illegally taken antlers on your wall, it's up to you, if you are that greedy and needy, go for it, remember we are all trying to take an animal that doesn't belong to any of us, good luck Saturday to all law abidding ethical hunters, keep your head up high if you are and thanks for making our State a better place, M.B

[jkcmj]

I do not consider legalized abortion, my law, I do not consider the upcoming gun restrictions likely to be proposed by Obama, My Laws, I do not consider many of the laws passed to be my laws. I am forced to live under the standards of society, but not all laws make sense or are morally justified. I will obey what I must, and make my own moral justification when it is necessary to ignore them.

[primetime49]

Gary,we just learn to live with it

these people are usually people we know as its a small area and they seem to get some braintick

we have had radiator shot out of running semi[renters truck]windshield form pheasant hunters,house hit from trapshooters etc.

its like the wild west,you can tell by the loud and aggressive truck noise which direction a deer is spotted[bless the cell phone]

where are our enforcement officers .Three years ago we saw 3 of their vehicles watching the outside of a section of land next to ours for half a day . When we asked them what they were concentraited on the response was [a monster buck and another nice one were bedded down on fenceline and they were all interested in watching as one of their hunting parties was hunting this the next weekend[these guys are human]

You meet the neatest people sitting and having them walk by you making up excuses for being where they are

i could go on and on but i wont as i am off subject

start another blog

[UdeLakeTom]

Welcome to FM...for your 2nd post, you made good sense.

Well said.

[Musky Buck]

Just a last thought- I am so happy for opening day tomorrow, I wouldn't be if baiting were legal. I'm glad I am not sitting here wondering if the deer have been eating my bait pile. I'm wondering what the weather might do to them, if I can sit by the ground scrapes all day in the wind, what fields they might be using the most, if any errant bullets at dark will come flying across my private land like last year, how many trespassers I'll kick off my land again, how many early or late poaching shots I'll here this year and thank our state for not allowing baiting to the lazy 9 days out of the year hunter. Let the deer live and eat as they always have. If you bought land that doesn't have the food sources available, put it for sale and buy some where you have that option. If you need to bait deer for the purpose of killing one you have some mental issues and need help. You were raised way wrong and probably have always bent the rules in regards to deer hunting. You also doubtfully need the meat, would any of us starve if they canceled the deer season I doubt it. If you would, go to the deer food shelf or drop a few out of season if it's life or death. My personal philosophy is if I get that buck this year great, if I don't great, do it for the sake of hunting, not for the taking, I know it's a long wait till next year but you'll appreciate it even more. If you hunt over bait tomorrow, I hope your apples, pumpkins,shell corn is rotten from the weather and actually creates an area deer don't want to be around, hope a mouse gets into your next bag and it spills all over your cabin. Please buy a shirt that reads " I am a deer baiter ! You would look so cool and feel so proud. To those of you who realize baiting is a classless way to take our state's most wanted game animal, best of luck and thanks for not being a cheater, M.B.