New to Ice fishing, need help prioritizing needed equip. (Michigan)

[AJPeacock]

Howdy all,

I have been fishing my entire life (40 years) for everything from Brookies in the rockies, bass in the desert and Salmon in the great lakes.

With the exception of a few afternoons over the years, I've never REALLY ice fished.

I have zero ice fishing equip and need to pick some brains w/re to equip.

Here is my current thinking, please give me input, as I'm a total newbie w/re to ice fishing.

I live in Lapeer Michigan, plenty of smaller lakes 20-100acres (Bluegills, Perch,Crappie, Walleye, Pike etc.). I plan on going up north a couple times this winter as well (don't know where though). I'd like to purchase equip. that can do double duty for the various species.

I read the In-Fisherman "Ice Fishing Secrets" book and am confident I can learn ice fishing. My current thinking w/re to equip. is as follows

1) Vexilar FL18(Where is the cheapest place to find these?) or Marcum Lx-3. From what I've read, these are the top of the line flasher. If I end up with the Vex, what xducer and case to get? Opinions please.

2) Auger, Although I'd really like a "Tim Allen, more power" Power auger. I think I'll stick with a hand auger for now. Later, it will work as a good backup to the power auger What is the best hand auger? I've used a chisel and it seems to take a while and is VERY noisy, thoughts? From what I've read, a lot of holes are needed to "find the fish", how tough are the hand augers to use? Do they really tire you out?

3) Obviously I need some poles, I was thinking 4-6 various weights/lengths with spinning reels. thoughts? recommendations? My 2 kids will go with me from time to time, so keep that in mind.

4) Line, leaders. thoughts? Other terminal tackle needed?

5) Tip-ups, there is a dizzying variety of these babies. They all seem pretty much the same (functionally), some are round and fit well in a bucket, some are wooden, some are plastic etc. they range in price from $10-$30, Probably only need 3 of these or so. thoughts?

5) 2 buckets (one to sit on) one for the fishfinder to sit on? (maybe a chair instead of a bucket to sit on)

6) Lures, I am lost here. There is such an assortment. I was hoping to find someone with experience to help me gear up.

7) Shanty, Although I'd like to go out and buy one right away, Its either the flasher or shanty, and I think the flasher will be more useful overall? I will be getting one later in the year though, I am struggling between the Clam 5600 and fish traps (one or two seater model). Everything I've read says "mobility, mobility, mobility", but my inner voice keeps saying "size,size,size". I don't have an ATV or snowmobile, so weight is a constraint. Since the majority of my fishing will be on smaller lakes, I don't expect to be fishing more than a mile or 2 from the truck, so the extra weight may/may not be important. Thoughts? Is the Clam 5600 to ungainly if I fish alone for a weekend?

Until I get a shanty, I'll probably use my kids plastic toboggan to pile everything on. "mobility,mobility,mobility"

Thanks in advance for any input you can provide.

Don

[This message has been edited by AJPeacock (edited 11-27-2003).]

[Ray Esboldt]

Don,

First, welcome to FM.com. Be warned, this place is addictive (and overwhelmly informative).

I'll give you my opinions in the order you asked. I know others will chime in as well. Hopefully we can all lead you down the path of ice fishing bliss.

1) You are correct the LX-3 and FL-18 are the cadilacs of ice fishing depthfinders. However, if you're looking to save a few bucks and still be fully functional, I would suggest the Marcum LX-1 or an FL-8. They don't have all the extras, but they will get the job done, no question, for quite a bit less dough.

2) If you can't pony up for a power auger, I'd look at a 6 or 7 inch Strikemaster Lazer hand auger or a 6 inch Nils Master hand auger. They cut a quick hole even through 18" of ice and you don't die in the process.

3) Rods are a tough call. I always say whatever feels good. I like rods with cork handles, no reel seat (you tape the reel to the rod handle), and 4 or more guides. You'll need reels as well. Go with a reel that doesn't overpower the rod with its bulk. The combo needs to balance. A 300 series spinning reel is a bit much on 24" panfish setup.

4) Line depends on what your fishing for. I usually stick with 2lb for panfish and 4 to 6 pound for walleyes. Braided line has its applications as well. But keep it simple when you're starting out.

5) I like the tipups that completely cover the hole. They usually keep things from freezing up. However, if you're strictly tipup fishing, it's not a big deal to skim the ice out of a hole every 10 minutes or so.

6) FM.com sells a couple of lure packs that will get you through the whole winter with panfish and walleyes: http://tacklecity.com/kitsjj.html
http://tacklecity.com/angel-eye-spoons.html
I've used them and they work. If you don't like them, heck, I'll buy them from you.

7) As far as houses go, I'd push you torwards the flip top (trap-style, if you will). Setup is a matter of grabbing a bar and pulling. They're light meaning you can throw them in an out of your truck with ease. They hold all your gear. A small propane heater keeps things plenty warm (unless you just moved here from the tropics). And, all the big name brands (Otter, USL, Frabil, Eskimo) are durable. You say you'll be fishing within a mile or two of your truck! I think I'd rather listen to Barbara Striesand's political soliloquies than dragging a big Clam type portable two miles.

Hope this helps. The other guys will fill in the holes. And, if you have more questions, feel free to ask.

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Ray Esboldt
www.marcum.com

[This message has been edited by Ray Esboldt (edited 11-27-2003).]

[Guest]

Don:
Welcome abord the forums all the info ypu need is a searh away here.
Good Luck and I hope that you enjoy hardwater fishing

1) Vexilar FL18(Where is the cheapest place to find these?) or Marcum Lx-3. From what I've read, these are the top of the line flasher. If I end up with the Vex, what xducer and case to get? Opinions please.

Lets start with the basics and work up.
The vex is about 5 steps away.
First clothing is a must! If you are not warm nothing is going to be worse.
Carhartt's or the Gortex line are a good way to go.

2) Auger, Although I'd really like a "Tim Allen, more power" Power auger. I think I'll stick with a hand auger for now. Later, it will work as a good backup to the power auger What is the best hand auger? I've used a chisel and it seems to take a while and is VERY noisy, thoughts? From what I've read, a lot of holes are needed to "find the fish", how tough are the hand augers to use? Do they really tire you out?

StrikeMaster Mora is a good choice then later move to the more power AHHH AHHH AHHH

3) Obviously I need some poles, I was thinking 4-6 various weights/lengths with spinning reels. thoughts? recommendations? My 2 kids will go with me from time to time, so keep that in mind.

For the kids? A good spinning reel and med/light pole is good start at Walmart and then if you really get the fever a Thorne Bros. would be good & Berkely makes some good ones so does bad dog.

4) Line, leaders. thoughts? Other terminal tackle needed?

I dont use leaders, As for line I use Yo-Zuri Exclusively. I usually tie direct or use the quick change snaps.

I dont use them often but I do prefer the wood type Cheap is cheap in this game but stay in your budget.

5) 2 buckets (one to sit on) one for the fishfinder to sit on? (maybe a chair instead of a bucket to sit on)

Bucket for the flasher and a folding nylon chair with the carring bag for the shoulder

6) Lures, I am lost here. There is such an assortment. I was hoping to find someone with experience to help me gear up.

www.tacklecity.com

7) Shanty, Although I'd like to go out and buy one right away, Its either the flasher or shanty, and I think the flasher will be more useful overall? I will be getting one later in the year though, I am struggling between the Clam 5600 and fish traps (one or two seater model). Everything I've read says "mobility, mobility, mobility", but my inner voice keeps saying "size,size,size". I don't have an ATV or snowmobile, so weight is a constraint. Since the majority of my fishing will be on smaller lakes, I don't expect to be fishing more than a mile or 2 from the truck, so the extra weight may/may not be important. Thoughts? Is the Clam 5600 to ungainly if I fish alone for a weekend?

Flasher or shanty? Shanty for sure!
The flip types are usually heavier but can carry all the gear.
I use the Frabilll XL Twin A little more to set up, but at 35 lbs it pulls easy even with gear and the auger on top $199.00 You can always upgrade to a flip later.

Now you are ready to go buy that vex and have some fun.

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I don't drive fast, I fly low.

[This message has been edited by frozenminnow (edited 11-27-2003).]

[Northlander]

I agree with the above but for 1 thing. Get a flip style at least 2 man shelter. You will be glad you did. The extra room is nice and if you dont get one you will wish ya did. Nothing worse than pulling a suitecase style in snow with gear strapped on top and falling off every 20 steps. The flip style with tub solves this prob and they pull nicely by hand. They arent that much more and why by 2 shelters? Save the $ and do it right the 1st time. I may have a 1 man flip style for sale after the ice expo. Ill post it to ya if I do. Good luck and take it slow. Ice fishing used to be cheap and simple until the " Bug" bit me and now I got it in a bad way.

[AJPeacock]

Thanks for the responses guys. After I posted, I found the search utility and have found tons of information, this is a great site!

1) I think I'm gonna go with the Marcum LX3.

2) I am torn between the 6" and 7" lazer and auger. Probably go with the 6", so I can pop more holes searching for the fish. And then tell the wife I need a power auger for BIGGER holes (Tim Allen would be proud, ahh ahh ahh).

3) Rods, I'll probably stick to some medium $$ rods. Then build some custom ones once I learn more about ice fishing/requirements.
I've built several fly-rods etc. in the past, it looks like ice rods will be a piece of cake.

4) Thanks for the info on the line weights.

5) ...

6) Thanks for the links to the tackle, I have some small spoons from jigging for largemouth in Arizona (Kastmasters etc.), I'll order the panfish/crappie kits to prime the new tackle box.

7) Shanty, Probably wait until I figure out what lakes I'll be fishing and how far the walk will be. I am leaning toward the Fish trap Voyager (2 or 3 seat). I'm a pretty big guy and like the extra width.

As far as clothes, I have tons of warm clothes/goretex etc. from Whitetail hunting in Nov/Dec here in Michigan.

Thanks for all the tips. I'm glad I found the site.

don

[Paul Waldowski]

AJ,

You have made some great choices. Definately sounds like you are on the right track.

Welcome to FishingMinnesota.com. We're glad you found us also. There is a ton of great info to be had here. All you have to do is ask. Soemone always seems to come thru.

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Paul
[email protected]
Marcum
Otter Outdoors

[Daveo]

may i ask what w/re means?

[Paul Waldowski]

Dave,

wih regards. So the sentence should read with regards to ice fishing. Net speak per say.

Did you get the e-mail I sent you about the pic's?

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Paul
[email protected]
Marcum
Otter Outdoors

[This message has been edited by Paul Waldowski (edited 11-27-2003).]

[AJPeacock]

Ray,

With regard to the spoon kits you pointed me too, what weight spoons should I be looking at? Typical small walleye lakes around here are 30' deep or less.

Thanks,
Don "AJ" Peacock

[Paul Waldowski]

A.J.,

With regards to the spoons. I would go with the Angel Eye Jr., and or the Glow devils in the 1/16th oz size, this way you are dialed in.

Use the Angel eyes for more neutral fish, they are meant to be fished slower. Let the spoon flutter down and literally hang in the face of the fish. I usually tip the AE with just the head of a minnow.

The glow devils are great for locating active fish. Fish them quick, with these I usually use just the head also.

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Paul
[email protected]
Marcum
Otter Outdoors

[Steve Foss]

This advice all sounds good to me.

I'd opt for the 7 inch instead of 6 inch auger. It takes little extra effort to drill 7-inch holes, and that extra inch means it takes your holes longer to ice up and make it hard to get fish through, although with a shelter that's not as much an issue.

But if you hook a 15 pound pike it's tough to pull 'er through a 6-inch hole.

My Mora 8-inch hand auger is a great backup for the power auger.

And for walleyes, there are to other important jigging spoons. Swedish pimples have an action all their own, and many guys I know go to them before any other spoon. I also really like the Northland Tackle Rattle Buckshot Spoons in glow colors. They rattle in fish from a long ways away, and if your second rod is a bobber/minnow or deadstick/minnow, the fish often come in on the rattle spoon but aren't feeling frisky enough to hit it. So they see that minnow wiggling a couple feet away and smack it. I have both the other Scenic Tackle spoons mentioned above (Angel Eye and Glow Devils), and they are excellent spoons. I especially like the slow wide sideways wobble of the Angel Eye on the fall. Deadly.

You should also, as money allows, pick up a selection of jigging Rapalas and Nils Master Jiggers. The smaller sizes are great for pannies (I've caught lots of perch and crappies on them), and the #7 and #9 jigging raps are standard for walleyes. For pannies, a waxworm or maggot on the center treble is great. For walleyes, a minnow head.

But most importantly, have a blast at one of the best games on the planet. You're about to start out on one of life's great obsessions.

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"Worry less, fish more."
Steve Foss
[email protected]

[AJPeacock]

Guys,

Thanks for all the great info. I feel kinda selfish asking more questions (but I'll get over it )

What are your favorite colors for the jigging rapalas?

Thanks,

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Don "AJ" Peacock

[Ray Esboldt]

AJ,

I agree 100 percent with Paul. The Angel Eye Jr.s tipped with a minnow head was my most consistent producer of walleyes last year. They are light baits, but that seemed to be their sell point. A so-so fish would sit and look at the thing flutter up and down a couple times, then I'd put it in quiver-mode, and I mean moving the rod tip in millimetets yet rapidly, and they would just crush it. Nice feeling!

When things get slow, I go to a plain hook with a live fathead or small shiner (clip the top of the tail to slow them down). It's is hard to beat when time are tough.

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Ray Esboldt
www.marcum.com

[Ray Esboldt]

Oh, jigging Raps. I really like silver and black. But, I don't like them for walleyes that much, unless I've got a deadstick line (minnow, hook and bobber) close by. I really like the smallest sized Raps for crappies. I gob a bunch of Euros on the treble and keep her moving. Just slow it down when a fish gets on your bait. You will not believe a crappie can hit a bait so hard.

OK, now I'm stoked for ice fishing. I might even have to can pheasant hunting for the year, maybe...

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Ray Esboldt
www.marcum.com

[Paul Waldowski]

Ray,

Sounds like you and I run the same kind of deadstick. I like to clip the tail or the fin and let the bait flounder a little. When fishing is really tough run this bait in-conjuntion with a AE Jr. or Glow Devil and watch the fish roll in.

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Paul
[email protected]
Marcum
Otter Outdoors

[Guest]

AJ, Welcome to Fishing Minnesota!

I just got back from a nice little feeding frenzy with the family (turkey day ) and I'm ready for a little ice fishing. Sounds like all of you are setting AJ up with what he needs.

LX-3 is a great flasher, you will like this one.

With the auger, a 6 inch is a good way to go if you are drilling by hand. You'll be surprised how fast it will cut through the ice.

Rods...there are so many. Here's a link to a previous discussion...

http://fishingminnesota.com/ubb/Forum30/HTML/003034.html

That should give you a lot of info on rods and such. The Genz Rods are priced alright and I really like them.

Line...Berkley Micro Ice, Berkley Vanish, P-Line, Fireline...there are so many choices. For panfish I like 2-3 pound test line. For perch I'll usually go with 4 pound test. Walleyes I stick with 4-8 pound test depending on the situation. Pike I'll go with 8-12 pound test. Tip-ups can be rigged with several different lines. Braided line is great, there are also many other plastic coated lines and even mono works.

Tip-ups...HT Enterprises makes a few, Frabill makes some, Beaver Dam, Berkley, plus more. Frabill makes a Thermal tip-up that works pretty good, or else the wood tip-ups by most brands are great. Most tip-ups will get the job done just depends how cold it is, or how often you are going to check the tip-up.

Lures...hmmmmm, this category is huge. Depends on what you are fishing for. Tackle City makes nice jigs for panfish. As does Systems Tackle, Custom Jigs n Spins, Northland...the list goes on and on. If you want any info on specific fish as far as lures/jigs are concerned then that would narrow it down a bit. There is a ton of jigging spoons out there. Angel Eyes and Glow Devils are awesome, they really do catch fish. Swimming lures like the rapalas are another option for gamefish.

Shanty...A flip over model is the way to go in my opinion. There are a lot of models out there and all of them are nice. I fish out of a Fish Trap Pro or a Fish Trap Guide. I've also fished out of Otter and they are awesome as well. Eskimo, Frabill, Nordic, Polar Sport...the list goes on. A lot ot choose from.

I used a plastic sled for a couple years when I started ice fishing. Just pile all the gear on and go. Got a little cold at times but you forget about the cold when you are catching fish

Feel free to ask any questions, everyone is always willing to help out. Take care.

Good Fishin,
Matt

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[email protected]
Catch-N Tackle and Bio Bait
MarCum

[willowcat]

I just want to add that all of the equipment listed above is great. If I were to recomend any thing it would be warm waterproff cloathing,gloves,and a good pair of boots. Because you can have all the greatest equipment in the world but if you're not comfortable and warm,you wont stay on the ice long.

[Steve Foss]

With the Raps, I like black/gold or orange/gold in stained water and natural perch or black/silver in clear. I tend to stay away from wildly-colored patterns for walleyes, because I haven't had that much luck with them.

This next tip may not be agreed on by everyone. I use a wirecutter to nip off the fore and aft single hooks on all my Jigging Raps, Nils Master JIggers and Master JIgger Shads. All the fish I caught on those raps before I nipped the hooks had at least the bottom treble and one of the end hooks in their mouths. In other words, I never reeled in a fish hooked just on one of the single hooks.

But I lost a LOT of fish at the last second because those darn end hooks kept getting caugh on the bottom edge of the hole and the fish would shake loose.

OFF they came, and I haven't noticed any decrease in hooking the last two years since I started doing that.

I also replace the treble with a bigger one, especially on medium-sized and smaller raps. Those little buggers they come with aren't up to the job.

I also use a deadstick or a bobber rod for my second line, preferring the slip bobber, split shot and natural hook presentation. For walleyes, about 50 percent come on the rap, 50 on the minnow.

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"Worry less, fish more."
Steve Foss
[email protected]

[This message has been edited by stfcatfish (edited 11-28-2003).]

[AJPeacock]

Thanks for all the help.

I ordered the lure kits that where recommended, so I should have a good start on lures.

I just got back from Cabelas (what a madhouse!). Anyway, I'm rigged and ready.

I played with the Vex FL18 and the Marcum LX-3, I like the ultra FL18 setup, better than the Marcum Cordura covered setup. I like the Marcum electronics better though (thin line, higher power). So I decided until I was able to get the Marcum without a kit so I could put the blue ice box on it, I'd go without electronics. I decided I'd rather be warm and fishing, than back in the house with nice electronics. So I got the Fish Trap Voyager and will worry about electronics later. Cabelas is running a promotion until Dec 14th, for $400 spent on a shelter, they give you $40 gift card to use on another purchase. (smaller cards for smaller shelters).

I got a 6" Strikemaster Lazer auger. Decided for most of the fishing I'll do, 6" will be big enough. I have a spud if I go somewhere that bigger is needed.

Spent a lot of time comparing rods/reel combos. Decided on two of the St Croix 24" Ultra Lights (PIR 24UL) and two of the St Croix 28" Med Light (PIR 28ML). Figured they would work for everything but large Walleye and Pike. Many of the other nice poles had real clunky guides (and not enough of them). These St Croix rods just felt good and sensitive to me. They each have a St Croix PS250 spinning reel on them.

I got 2lb test Trilene micro-ice line for the ultra light rods. 4lb Yo-Zuri Hybrid Fluorocarbon for the Med Light rods. (figured I might as well compare).

Ended up getting 2 of the Frabill 10" pro thermal tip-ups (here in Michigan, you can use 2 lines only, hand held or tip up).

Anyway, thought I'd let you all know how I fared. I sure am glad the Fish Trap sets up easy, as I may be sleeping in it for a while :-) since I don't have a doghouse.

Later,

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Don "AJ" Peacock

Lapeer, Michigan

[Steve Foss]

Don:

Sounds like you've made some thoughtful choices there. You asked advice, got a ton of it, took some of it and discarded some as it suited you. That's exactly how FM is supposed to work.

I'll chime in on line, and others may follow.

I don't mean to get into a contest over "who's got the best line," so down, down all you line dogs.

Spooling a whole spool of fluorocarbon is not only expensive, but fluoro is stiff and has a lot of memory, so it'll come off the reel in coils. Compare that to a soft limp line like Trilene XL, and the XL is much limper and easier to use when it's cold out.

Since I use Trilene XL on most of my summer reels, and I use only my summer reels on ice rods for ice fishing, I just tie on a ball-bearing swivel and a few feet of fluoro for a clear leader on heavier lines (10 to 14), or tie both lines together with a blood knot (I know there are better knots for this, but I've been tying this sucker for this purpose a long time) with smaller lines.

That way, my small spools of Berkley Vanish in 6, 10 and 14 lb have lasted four years and counting, and I still get the "invisbility" of a fluorocarbon leader.

Just food for thought.

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"Worry less, fish more."
Steve Foss
[email protected]

[This message has been edited by stfcatfish (edited 11-28-2003).]

[AJPeacock]

Strcatfish,

I had a tough time choosing between the 6" and 7" Auger. The differentiator ended up being the fact that I have a bad shoulder (dislocated/torn Rot Cuff) and figured saving the extra "little" bit of effort (26% less) might pay me big benefits over the course of the winter. If it really bothers my shoulder, I'll just get a power auger !

I looked at the Otters, Frabills, Eskimos, Schappels, Fish Traps. We spent over an hour sitting moving etc. I eliminated the Otter due to weight and price (but its a sweet setup). It came down to the Frabill and the Fish trap. I liked the tent/frame on the Frabill (being black can only help out on the ice), but didn't like the seat setup (I have long legs and can slide the seat back on the Fish Trap to gain room) and the way it balanced. Thats why I chose the Fish Trap.

I've used Flourocarbon before (Fly Fishing Lees Ferry in Arizona) and realize that it has memory and is stiff in the cold. Figured I'd use it as a leader, just like you described with Trilene XL (I use both XL and XT in the summer, depends for what fish).

Thanks again for the advice,

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Don "AJ" Peacock

Lapeer, Michigan

[This message has been edited by AJPeacock (edited 11-28-2003).]

[Steve Foss]

Hey, I'll never argue with anyone who chooses a Fish Trap, since that's what I've got.

Have fun out there, and tell us how you do.

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"Worry less, fish more."
Steve Foss
[email protected]