______ing circles

[gunderson21]

I know this has been talked about before but i am looking for alittle advice. I lost 6 runs in about an hour in a half 2 nights ago. I tried giving them 5-10seconds and start reeling. I tried giving them 30-45 seconds and just applying a tight line philosophy and letting them sit in it. I have tried many ways and still lose 99% of the runs I have been getting. Anyone have any ideas to up the hookup percentages???? thanks

[gunderson21]

Also I fish from shore around the Kato area..

[Shack]

After the bite, the load up is a key point. It takes practice, but after a multitude of missed fish, one tends to start to figure out why.

After fish thumps your rod, pick up the rod and ease back "slowly". It is easier said than done, but let the fish hook its self. Real in a little if there is slack and pull a load on rod. I learned a little by watching ocean fisherman setting the hook. They use circle hooks most of the time. You never see them "swing and then miss" any thing. If the fish starts to thump, thump harder and pulls a little, feed him rod tip (try not to let line slack much), but keep a little pressure on rod. Once the fish is thumping and bouncing, ease back again and start to bring him in.

Some of your bites, might just be a fish that will never take the bait right or is too small.

Practice makes perfect.

Good luck!

[ec30_06]

I had been doing very well with circles until last night. I have had the best luck with leaving the clicker off and the rod in the holder until the fish hooks itself. A softer rod is helpful when using superline. Last night I could not get a single fish out of about 10 good hits to hook up. Must have been small fish or non-aggresive ones.

[crazyice]

I have recently gone to circle hooks for my cutbait, and I have seen my hookup percentage go way up. I do use the clicker and when one runs or thumps the rod, I reel up to it and wait to feel the fish thump it again and then I gently swing the rod to the side, I have only missed a couple of fish this way. I am using 6/0 gammies with cut sucker. I don't know if that plays into anything or not.

[gunderson21]

when you guys are talking about the load up are you stopping the fish from the initial run or letting the run go all the way through and then tightening the line up? also after letting the line tighten or reeling up alittle how long are you guys letting the fish sit and thump on you r rod. also does the side sweep then take place??? I am going to try these techniques if the rain will let up this evening. thanks

[Shack]

You have to learn how to judge a thump, thump, pull, thump if it will lead to fish being on line.

I like the idea of the side swip. I will have to try this one

[DTro]

I have three scenarios using circle hooks and use them exclusively for channels with cutbait, however I always end up catching a bunch of flats the same way (using cutbait).

1. Fish hits it and rus like a bat out of heII and basically hooks itself in the rod holder. This happens alot, especially when not using any type of bait alarm or clicker.

Pull rod out and reel fish in. Doesn't get much easier.

2. Tap, tap, peck, peck. I don't even bother with these. I just let it go, or even try to move my bait away. I know that it probably is a small fish, turtle, or different species.

3. A couple of good thumps followed by a SLOW loading. 99% of these bites are going to be flatheads. I usually can detect the thumps and can have the pole in my hand before it loads up. That way, when the fish starts moving off and loads up the pole, I give equal resistance the opposite direction in hopes of the hook doing it's job. More times than not it works great.

Now with live bait, I think circles are a no no. I've used them in the past, but after much evaluation, it's not worth the chances of the hook turning back into the bait, which happens quite a bit.

My favorite size and brand of circle is a 6/0 Gamakatsu with a cut sucker or chub about 2 square inches or bigger in size.

BTW, I almost always use the "side sweep".

[hanson]

Circles hooks are your friend with cutbait and a tightline.

I won't use them with live bait.

If you are really struggling to catch fish on them, switch back to a J-hook. It's not worth missing 10 runs in one night because the hooks aren't working right.

[DTro]

Another thing I'd like to add is that all circle hooks are not created equal. I like circle hooks that have a larger gap and also a slight offset in the body while also maintaining a lighter wire.

I see some of these monster large wire diameter, small gap circles and wonder about the effectiveness of them.

[crazyice]

I agree, the 6/0 gammies seem to have a large enough gap to allow for great penetration into the lip area. I actually tend to use two chunks of cut though, about equal in size just to give the bait a little more body. I found that cutting one large chunk was a little more difficult to hook without exposing a large piece of it without the hook in it. This way by using two pieces that are equally a little smaller, if they pick up the bait they should always have the hook in their mouth and not just the part of the bait that couldn't fit on the hook.

[Blue Kayak]

I agree with Dtro and Hanson about circle hooks and cut bait. One time when I was getting a bunch of pecks on fairly large cutbait I switched to a piece of night crawler and a smaller traditional hook. This is a good way to win the booby prize for the smallest fish.

Some carp fisherman use a "hair rig" with circle hooks. I have been experimenting with that for some cats and it may have potential. A hair rig has a fine line off the back of the hook, and the bait is attached to the fine line. This leaves the circle hook completely free, with the gap totally exposed.

I also met an catfish angler at the Carver landing. He liked using cirle hooks with live bait for flats. He said you can fish in the snags and are much less likely to get a snag. He even gave me one of the hooks he uses. It is a large (thick diameter), red, with no offset. I want to match it up before using it in case it really does work.

I think hooks and hook setting have a lot to do with your confidence and experience in using a particular style of hook. I remember fishing with my dad one time and we were getting lots of bites, but couldn't hook anything. We switched to kahle hooks and started hooking nearly everything that bit. Since that time, I've been much more confident using kahle hooks, but never duplicated that experience.

[traveler]

I've fished circles with large live baits in saltwater, with very good sucess. A few key points; baits are always "bridled" (tied) to the hook, thus allowing the hook to swing freely and do it's thing. Hooking bait directly on the hook is going to make it tougher to get a good bite in the corner of the mouth. Approprite size hooks are important, by look and not size # as there is a lot of variance between manufacturers. NO offsets, might as well be useing j-hooks. Fish must be swimming away from you before you come tight. I don't fish cats, but I can imagine a fish grabbing a bait face first from under a cut or a log and just sitting there, facing the fisherman. Not good...wait for it to move away, then just let the line come tight and engage the reel. I think the most important of all this is keeping the hook gap open. Do a google for "bridle rigs", for big baits, it's a great way to rig a bait.

[rushing]

There is a greater learning curve with figuring out how to make a circle hook work for you and with the gear you are using. I admit they don't work in every situation but about 90% of my flatheading is done with an 8/0 circle and with much success. How you hook your live bait has a lot to do with how effective they are. When hooking live bait in the back try going at more of a perpendicular angle across your baits back than directly across. It will increase your hook ups and it will decrease your chance of foul hooking your bait. I prefer to use circle hooks because it lessens the chance of gut hooking a fish. Good luck!

[fish4cats]

I have been using circle hooks for cats for about 5 years now, and I have found that when a fish runs I engage the reel as I take it out of the rod holder and let the fish load the rod. I have a very high hooking percentage by going this route. It works for me, not saying that it works for everybody. Another method that works awesome with circle hooks is using it under a float in shallow water, now that is fun catching cats under a float. All I can say is trial and error, thats what I did.

[gunderson21]

I generally use larger baits be creek chubs, suckers or bullheads and will have to try the lock them up on the run way that some of you talk of. thanks for the comments guys I appreciate it. I am spending alot of time on the water these days and locking for that 50lb pluser thanks

[dps]

Circles can work good on live or cut bait. Its usually due more to the aggressiveness of a fish, or user error on just how effective they are.

Rushing had some very relavent points on hooking your live bait, its critical on using a circle hook. I find myself hooking into the lower jaw of bullies, and snout hooking just about any other type of bait with circles. I get very little for issues with the hook turning back into the bait this way... and its easier to cast without throwing your bait off. Hooking a live bait with a circle is much more cumbersome if your trying to hook into the back of your bait. Hooking strait through is easy, but you will hook back into the bait most of the time. Hooking towards the head at a 45% angle will reduce the hook going back into the bait, but its diffiicult to accomplish without injuring your bait, and keeping a clean incision(helps to keep bait on hook).

When using circles.. cut or live bait... turn the cicker off. Let the fish try to rip the rod out of the holder if it desires. As dtro said, 95% of the time when flathead hits you will get a thump, and the rod will slowly load up(sometimes just sit there). This is tre with cut or live bait. A hookset it often neccessary to hook up. Its very improtant to have some load on the line before using a sweeping hookset. If you have substancial load on the line, the hookpoint has made contact somewhere on that fish, and you will hve to bury that hook past the barb. If he fish bend the rod over in the holder.. its already hooked, reel the fish in.The fish will NEVER hook themselves if the clicker is on... using a clicker is defeating the purpose of using a circle hook.

Many runs in a night, especially if they are fast runs is likely channel cats. Most of the time when fihing larger live baits and circles, the channels will avoid getting hooked. Flatheads on the other hand eat their food on the spot and go looking for more.

As for a response to another users post.. I am curious about tying a bait to the line and having the circle hang free.. that sounds interesting, and might be very effective if the hook doesnt get snagged up every other cast when the bullheads go looking for cover.

[Blue Kayak]

DPS -- If you search for "carp hair rig" you'll see what a hair rig is. If you search for "catfish hair rig," you might find this quote about the Wels catfish. "The most common bait to be used on most commercial fisheries at the moment is the Halibut pellet. The pellets come in various sizes and are best fished with a few large pellets on a hair rig over a bed of smaller pellets."

What I have been doing is tying a safety pin to a short, fine line off the back of the hook. I tried it once with a sucker which quickly bent the safety pin and got away. Since then I've only used it on cut bait. What I am doing now is hooking the cut bait in the normal way, and then attaching the safety pin. If you look at the pictures of a hair rig, this is not they way they are traditionally used. I have been using it to help keep the hook on the bait. I don't have enough experience to know if it really helps; I'm just experimenting.

[hanson]

I'm on the verge of fishing strictly Gamakatsu Octopus J-hooks on the Minnesota for all cats.

I've lost/missed too many fish this year that just haven't committed to the dang bait and I've had to "help" with the "hookset".

I got extremely frustrated the other weekend fishing tight, tight, tight to wood in which the fish would not run anywhere, just sat there with the bait (cut sucker). Why does he need to run? He's already where he wants to be.

I don't know, the last month has been a tad trying. Even my channels on cutbait haven't been rockin' and slammin' the circles like they should. And Dave is right, for a circle to be super effective, the cats have to be very aggressive. So in order to hook these fish, you have to apply a slow, solid pressure the other way which usually works 50/50. When they are hitting good, its 100% hookup IMO.

So I'm not saying circles aren't great, because they are! They do a dang good job at what they were designed to do, they just don't work good all the time. In spots where fish are notorious for running at the boat, ditch the circles. You need to figure out when the best applications are for circles, and use them then. I seriously think you are limiting yourself if you are going to use circles 100% of the time.

[Shack]

I am with Hanson and others.

The spring time bite seemed to be great for the circle/octi, but as the fish’s aggressiveness slowed down during summer it seemed to leave a big hole.

I have thought of switching to the tried and true J-hook of years past, but have given this the year to the octi circle hook. The J hooks seemed to set up much quicker and stay in fish’s mouths in years past. I have used circle hooks all season and have hundreds of tags with no connects. Others years, I would of have had at least a couple of twenties by now with the old J-hook. I got a great deal on a bunch of 7/0 oci Gamakatsu circle hooks and that is what I have been using. The two thing I give the circle Octi Gamakatsu is, first it works great with the runners. If they take it, they are on. The other is, Mississippi North channels. They seem to hook them selves. I have had more of a great hook set ratio this year up here, more than others using Gama Octi circle hooks. This is all I will give them!

Set backs of the Gamakatsu Octi circle hooks are:

Less hook up ration in real action situations.

Hard to learn curve when setting hook.

They do cost more than other hooks.

P.S.

The few fish I have gotten on the oci-circle have been either on and running or had to finesse them to a point of “It sucks”

It took Hanson's post for me to confess this!

[hanson]

Quote:

---

It took Hanson's post for me to confess this!

---

Ha! Ha!

I fish circles A LOT! I have confidence in them, they work well, but when they don't work well... I start asking questions. Why? What if? Why now? What the? Would a?

I would say nearly 100% of my catfishing on the Red River is with circle hooks. Those cats "usually" hit with reckless abandon and it is a blast. Wait until the rod is about ready to get ripped out of the holder and crank it it. Done deal! Hook is always right in the corner of the mouth.

Its when they aren't hitting like this when it gets difficult to get a hook into them. Its possible, I've sort of perfected the art of "setting" a circle hook, and it is an art.

There are just soooooo many aspects of catfishing and circle hooks- Channels vs Flatheads. Live Bait vs Cutbait. Shore vs. Boat. And maybe the most important aspect is gear that is balanced (rod + line combination) to effectively work a circle. I would discuss each of those scenarios differently as circles definitely behave better in some of those situations. So it is difficult to lump all catfishing scenarios into one heading of "circle hooks suck" or "circle hooks are great".

I hope I'm making sense.

[Shack]

That is it, I am, I am done with circle hooks!

I will go down tomorrow and buy J-hooks. They have worked great in years past and I will not sacrifice another trip to the circle.

I have had one to many thump, thump, load, thumps than one man can handle in this season.

Something is wrong!

Back to the J-hook, this is something my fishing group has talked about since early July.

No more finesse, set the hook and reel! Old school!

I will keep circle for Miss. North, but that is all!

[Shack]

Retraction:

I will keep my circle hooks for Miss. North and for spring time flats! That is all!

[DTro]

careful guys you'll get paralysis by over analysis.

Do whatever gives you the warm fuzzies, but circle hooks work and they work well.

[Flaco651]

Quote:

---

circle hooks work and they work well.

---

I agree.