Wirehaired Pointing Griffon

[196thDLR]

I am looking at getting another hunting dog. My current hunting companion is almost 14. She is a ESS, and is the most energetic hunting dog I have ever followed around in the field. Harley just NEVER gives up. I would get another ESS but the truth is, it is my body that needs a resprite.

I need a dog that points, retrieves, and is a good family dog. My research has led me to a Wirehaired Pointing Griffon. Do any of my fellow Forum Members use this breed of dog, or do you know anyone who does? Any information will be greatly appreciated. Thank you.

[196thDLR]

Thanks everyone.

[Big Dave2]

Just be patient. You only posted this yesterday. I know for a fact that there are a couple of guys on here that have Griffs and will be happy to share info with you.

In the mean time do a search for "griffon" and I know you will find a few things because I have done it plus I have posted about griffs before, so I know there is some stuff in the archives.

[onlyspringers]

Look in the dogs for sale form just below this one. There you will find a post about griffons, it's about the sixth one down. The post is by a member that lives around Duluth.

[196thDLR]

Perhaps I asked the question in the wrong manner. I have hunted behind dogs for 48 years. I have hunted behind Labs of all colors, Goldens, GSP's, Springers and Setters. This is likely my last hunting dog. I am allowed to shoot from my wheeler or car, but I choose not to. There is nothing like following a good gun dog in the field.

I hunt alone a great deal so the dog becomes the the friend that I hunt with. I also know that good breeding and training are the most important factors for a good gun dog and field companion. I did look back into the archives and only found one reference to the Griffon's other than puppies for sale and what I found did not give me the information I wanted or felt I needed. Dave I rechecked the Archives to see if I missed something and found only what I found in my original search.

What is this dog like in the field?

Is the breed hard to train?

Does the breed typically retrieve well?

Can they be used as a once in a while water dog?

There is nothing like a testimonial from other hunters about a breed. That is what I thought I was asking.

[SportFishin']

196thDLR

What is this dog like in the field?

A hunting machine! The grace of a deer bounding over cover. Can range close or far out depends on our style & how you train them. Mine currently works closer, but I would like him to get out a little bit more for his NAVHDA tests. Spring training is just around the corner.

Is the breed hard to train?

Really easy to train I have a male & he is not hard headed at all. Very smart dogs all they want to do is please you. They are addicted to your praise.

Does the breed typically retrieve well?

Natural retrievers in cover & water.

Can they be used as a once in a while water dog?

They can be used all the time in the water! Right up until ice. Mine is a water nut, I don't think there are enough ducks in the world for this dog.

As my signature states "The SUV of Gun Dogs" You can't go wrong. These are family indoor dogs though they really need human interaction all the time.

Contact Mark in the puppies for sale forum he might have few left? I have one of his pups from his first whelping.

Sorry I didn't post earlier been out Ice'n fish.

Chris

[196thDLR]

Thanks, SportFishin'. Those are the answers I was looking for. Griffons seem to be a breed worth serious consideration. Every once in a while when I am out in the field bird hunting, I practice a conservation method called "Shoot and Release." My current gun dog gives me the look of, "You have to be kidding, shoot like that again and you can hunt by yourself." Do Griffons react the same way?

[Saw557]

A friend and I have Griffs....same sire as Sportfishing.We train East of hibbing most of the summer if you want come take a look. So far I am happy with mine...you get out of them what you put into it. They have alot of energy but he calms down pretty good in the house. Mine loves to retrieve and swims like a fish. One thing to keep in mind they are a semi rare breed of dog and you may have to get on a waiting list for an available litter also they aren't cheap expect to pay $800 give or take and alot of the breeders require you to test in NAVHDA which isn't such a bad thing. If you do a search on the net you should be able to come up with a few E-mail if you can't find any I might be able give you a hand.

Scott

(real dogs have whiskers!!!)

[2 DA GILLS]

I have a 2 year old Griffon and I have been very pleased with my decision to go with a Griffon.

How is he in the field?

- A pleasure to hunt with. In his second season I saw him hunt very very hard. At times I think he needs to figure out how to hunt smarter, but I love the drive. His cooperation in the field is better than I had anticipated. I rarely use any commands with him in the field, we just hunt silently as a team.

Is the breed hard to train?

- Not in my opinion. This is the first hunting dog I have trained and it was mostly about exposure to birds and situations. A lot of it came naturally and he just knew what to do.

Does the breed typcially retrieve well?

- He loves to retrieve, but we had a few issues in the first season. Controlled situations in training are so different compared to the field. I went the force fetch route this summer and it paid off this fall.

Can they be used as a once in a while water dog?

- Definitley. Mine also loves the water. He will do water retrieves for hours on end. I have not hunted many ducks the past 2 seasons, so we have limited work in hunting situations. He has done very well in training situations. He will dive after winged ducks that dive.

He hunts close to mid range for the most part, but he does range based on the cover type. I have hunted pheasants more days in the past 2 season than I have in the previous 20 seasons combine. This is simply because of him, it is such a joy to get out working birds with him.

[goman]

Another breed you might want to consider is a verein Deutsch Drahthaar (true german wirehair) very much like a Griffon.I have had one for just over a year now and I Love it.These dogs are not registered with the AKC,but with a group in Germany.There are hoever several breeders in the states.Check out verein deutsch drahthaar/group north america.com

[MNOutdoorsman]

I was happy to see your post. I am looking at German Wirehaired Pointers, Drahthaars, and German Wirehaired Griffons. They are hard to tell apart.

I think the difference between a GWP and a Drahthaar is their closeness to the German breeding but I haven't been able to figure out the difference in the Griffs?

From looking at pictures, it looks like the GWPs have shorter hair. I like that. I don't know if I'm ready for the fluffy hair look.

I am replacing a German Shorthair Pointer that I had to put down last fall. Thinking a wirehair might handle cold water better than the shorthair but will still be able to point in the upland.

Any help with the differences would be appreciated.

Ready to take the plunge (again)

[2 DA GILLS]

I hate to say too much about the differences, because I know some will disagree with the generalizations that I have heard and read about. Also I am no expert, but I did a considerable amount of research when deciding what breed to go with. I thought very hard about the German Wirehairs or Drahthaars.

Regarding the length of hair, it really varies with in a litter from what I have seen. The litter that my Griffon came from had pups from short / tight coats to curly and fluffy coats. Mine is medium length coat, but thick and harsh. I have seen the same with German Wirehairs from short to fluffy.

The point that sold me on a Griffon was the general disposition of being more playful. I know there are many German Wirehairs and Drahthaars that are friendly dogs, but from what I have read and heard they can be more aloof and not good always with strangers and other dogs. With 2 young children and living in town I could not take a chance.

Griffons tend to hunt closer and more deliberate compared to German Wirehairs as well. From what I read and witnessed German Wirehairs and Drahthaars are excellent dogs in the field and in general have strong game drive.

For the record, my next dog could very well be German Wirehair or Drahthaar (if it is not another Griffon). So I am not knocking the breeds, I think they are excellent dogs. At this time in my family life I needed to go with a breed known to have a friendly disposition as a general rule.

[Big Dave2]

2 Da Gills,

I know that I have discussed Griffons a little with you before, so please forgive me if you have already answered this question.

Does your Griff shed? It is said that they shed little to no hair. Do you strip the coat? If so, how often?

Thanks

[2 DA GILLS]

The amount of shedding depends on two factors. The time of the year and how well I have kept up with grooming. If I keep up with brushing and combing a couple times a week, he has very little shedding. However, my Griffon spends most his time outdoors. He does come in the house some, but he has more of an outdoor coat. This may contribute to his shedding. His shedding is lose wire hairs that have fallen out.

I read about stripping the coats when I was looking at getting a Griffon, but I am not 100% sure how to do it. I have a comb, detangler (removes a lot of loose hair) and mit with rubber numbs on it. Using a combination of those 3 grooming tools I am able to keep his coat healthy. There are cases where I will use my fingers to remove excess dry looking wire hairs that may be what they are referring to with the stripping.

[MNOutdoorsman]

Thank you for the information. I'm going to look at some Drahthaars this weekend in Dexter,MN. The Stud has a fairly short coat and the Dam is pretty shaggy. I will have to see what my wife thinks. I still love German Shorthairs and may still go that route. Does anyone know of any Griffs in the Rochester area? I would like to meet one.

[2 DA GILLS]

I purchased my Griffon from a breeder in Rochester. So yes, I know of some Griffons in Rochester. If coat variety is what you want to see, he has 3 females with very different coat types. There is the SE MN NAVHDA group that would give you an opportunity to see a lot of different breeds, but I am guessing there are no training days at this time of the year.

Send me an e-mail, I will get in touch with the breeder and get you some information. [email protected]

[SportFishin']

Big Dave & others,

Stripping is easy. What your doing is removing the Wirehair because they don't shed those hairs. Plus it promotes the growth of the new wirehairs. You never want to cut the wireharis with scissors because they ar hollow & will create a fuzzy split end hair. That is why they need to be stripped.

You can strip as often as you like. The process is really easy you just grab the hair between your thumb & forefinger & pull quickly in the direction of the hair growth. I don't strip him in the winter but I will do a full stripping of his body in the spring & heat of the summer. It takes 8 weeks for his hair to grow back, so I strip him in Aug. so it is regrown for protection come pheasant season. During the winter I will just sporatically pull hairs from all over his body. A full stripping takes about 1hr sitting outside. You also don't want to pull their furnishings on their head as this doesn't grow back the same.

Photo of Rudy after being stripped & some hair has grown back:

Photo of Rudy at 5mo. before stripping he is more silver with his wirehair.

Just for reference you were asking about coats. I have heard NAVHDA guys say that Rudy is called a Flat Coated Griff. It is all in the preference of the coat you like.

Regards,

Chris

[2 DA GILLS]

I have been amazed at how much my Griffon's coat has changed with time. He had a fair amount of facial furnishings up until his first hunting season. Then he wore them off and they never came back. He has also lost most of his silver hair with time.

Here he is at 9 months just prior to his first hunting season.

Here he is last summer, minus a lot of facial furnishings.

[Blaze]

gils - "minus the furnishings" - you trim up his face, I take it? He looks completely different!

MNO - as a current drahthaar(DD) owner and previous GWP and GSP owner, I will say I like the DD coat the best for maximum versatility with minimum maintenance. I strip Jake roughly once a month, but I don't need to during hunting season - the woods and fields keep him stripped nicely, as it is supposed to. There is variation in coat within each litter, but generally speaking, I would expect a longer coat in a Griff compared the the DD/GWP. If you're looking for a short coated DD/GWP, there are breeders who purposely breed for that.

To give more insight on the Griff/GWP/DD relationship:

* Griffons were used in the development of the drahthaar in Germany, along with GSP, Pudelpointers, and Stichelhaars.

* DDs are German registered (through VDD) and have to be tested and meet coat/conformation requirements to breed - this is the key arguement between DD and GWP camps

* DDs were brought over to the US and registered with the AKC as GWPs and later with NAVHDA. They have no required performance or coat/conformation testing to breed - for some this is a bonus, for others it's a drawback

Also, shoot me a note at mrdba2u AT yahoo DOT com if you want to see a good sampling of DDs this weekend - it won't be too far from your area.

Here's a couple pics of Jake

Good luck in your search.

Blaze

[2 DA GILLS]

Blaze,

I have never trimmed his furnishings. He had the facial furnishings as a pup and after his first hunting season they were pretty much gone. They have never come back the same. I kind of wish they would have, but during the hunting season I am glad he does not have much. When hunting some areas the cockle-burs can really collect under his chin.

[MNOutdoorsman]

Thanks for all of the info. I'm going to look at 3 Drahthaars and 3 Griffs over the next 2 days. By Monday I should be totally confused.

[Big Dave2]

Does anyone have any experience with Griffs and alergies?

What I mean is human alergies to dogs. I am slightly allergic to most dogs if I touch them and then touch my eyes or nose without washing my hands thoroughly.

Griffs are said to be somewhat less likely to cause the allergic reactions plus the fact that there is less shedding means that there would be less dog dander lying around the house.