Bass and Live Bait

[RK]

Hiya -

A friend of mine and I had a fairly lively discussion about using live bait for bass a whle back, and since things are sort of quiet around here lately, I thought I'd see what folks here think. This will probably end up something like tossing a grenade in a room and shutting the door But that's not my intent. I really am sort of curious to see what others think on the subject. There's a very similar debate on the subject when it comes to using live bait for muskies...

My friend is a pretty hardcore bass angler, and he's adamantly opposed to using live bait for bass under any circumstances. Part of his argument is from a resource perspective - he doesn't want to see deep hooked fish that might not survive. Another part of his objection is that it isn't allowed in tournaments, and that it somehow makes things 'too easy.' He's dead set against using live bait for bass, to the point of considering it unethical.

I have less of a problem with using live bait for bass, provided it's done in a way that doesn't kill fish. There are times when a big leech either under a slip bobber or on a bullet sinker rig is far and away the best option for smallmouth, especially after a wicked cold front. Later in the fall, a redtail on a jighead (either a plain ball head or a jig and pig jig), on a single spin spinnerbait, or on a split shot rig can be an awesome LMB technique when things are tough and stuff like plastics or cranks aren't working consistently. My take is that live bait may be against the rules in tournaments, but if you aren't in a tourney, who cares?

Now, to be clear, I rarely fish live bait for bass, and usually when I wish I could, I don't have any with me. I'm using artificials 99% of the time. But at the same time, I'm not that self-satisfied with being a purist when the difference between artificals and live bait is 5:1 or more. If you can do it and not hook fish so they can't be released (either circle hooks or just paying attention) what's the difference? Especially when it's a live bait/artifical combo like a jig and redtail, which is incredibly effective on LMB in late fall... I'll agree completely with the argument that if it's gut hooking fish it's a bad idea, but that's more a matter of technique than anything. I can't see an ethical distinction between catching a bass on a redtail, or a crankbait.

Anyone have strong opinions?

Cheers,

Rob Kimm

[blakjack23]

I don't see anything unethical about it. I just think sitting watching a bobber is boring. I like to be proactive, moving around, casting for fish. There's nothing like feeling the strike and settting the hook on a fish. Seeing a bobber go down and then setting a hook is kinda lame in my opinion. Its all about the top-water explosion or strike for me. Although, I'm sure when I'm older and not as able to stand and cast all day that I will settle for sitting in a boat, tossing out a bobber, and reeling in whatever will bite.

[Deitz Dittrich]

I myself have nto used live bait for bass for quite a few years. I dont have a problem with it as long as its done in a way so that the fish can be released, if thats the intent. To be honest, people do fish for bass with the intent to harvest. And its their right to do so.. then the use of live bait is fine as well...

its a personal decision. I do feel that using live bait makes it harder to release the fish(deep hooked fish)... but now honesty comes out. I have killed a few fish this summer using plastics, fish that we deep hooked.. so just because you dont use live bait doesnt make it a for sure thing either.

[Fishin Beast]

In the south live bait is actually a main way of bass fishing. I have seen many people fish leeches under a bobber for largemouth, either off docks or from boats.

If you can catch them with artificials why use live bait? In the heat of the summer I would rather not worry about keeping bait alive.

[Ray Esboldt]

I am just too lazy to go through the hassle of live bait most of the year. However, I do make exceptions. As mentioned previously, a redtail is really fun to fish with for smallmouth, fall time in particular. I have had a few gut the hook. You either eat them or cut the line and hope things work out. I imagine their odds of survival are better with a hook in them than they are on the fillet board.

With that being said, I think baits like senkos and 4 inch worms are just as likely to gut hook a fish as livebait. If bass are picking them up off the bottom, you will get some deep in the throat. Cut the line and let them go. They can survive. Here's an example. I caught a fish in club tournament this year that had a senko with some line sticking out of its throat. The hook was there, but I couldn't see it. I put it in the livewell and five minutes later the senko and a 3/0 hook are laying in the bottom of the livewell. Makes you wonder why the fish didn't barf it out before. I guess he thought it was a meal.

[RK]

Hiya -

Ray, Dietz, you make a good point about plastics - especially stick baits like Senkos. They can really woof those things down... Both of you mentioning it reminded me of a technique I'd seen that actually works really well on gullet-hooked fish.

Not sure if this link will work or not. If not, there's a brief article on the technique, with illustrations, on the In-Fisherman HSOforum. Just search on 'hook removal.' It's worth a look.

The link: In-Fisherman Hook Removal Article

Cheers,

Rob Kimm

[Deitz Dittrich]

Rob on deep hooked fish. that is usually how I do it.. either that or cut the hook.. Not the line.. I usually try and cut as much hook off as I can.

[ikeslayer]

Rob you beat me to it. I remember the first time i gut hooked a fish and got to use what i read in that article and wow does it work awesome. But not to hijack the post. Live bait works period. i know alot of people that use it when their intent is to harvest, however when it is not i would recommend circle hooks. i have yet to see a fish gut a circle hook. that is my recomendation for people who want to use live bait and keep or catch and release. There is nothing worse then having that decision made for you with a pool of blood in the bottom of your boat. ike

[Ray Esboldt]

Yep, that's a good tip. I've done that on largemouth. It doesn't work as well for me on smallmouth. They seem to have a bit smaller of a gill opening.

[Boedigheimer]

There are many circumstances that would warrant using live-bait. If your dealing with youngsters, or inexperienced fisherman, tight-lipped fish, or really anytime you see fish that won't respond to an artificial.

If you review past records like master angler, or local publications you see a deinite trend towards live-bait and big fish,(although Mr.Raveling proved me wrong last Fall). Live bait is definitely the great equalizer. The problem with live-bait is you can't cover much water.

And you can't match the appeal of live-bait for several species at the same time. Put a healthy leech or a baby snake nightcralwer on a good weedline and you can catch everything.

As far as gut-hooking goes, I don't feed more than a few seconds of line to any fish no matter what I'm using, redtails included. I think I've killed more fish using GULP and Powerbait over the years than livebait, which is very few. Thats made with fish parts, whats the difference? But I don't want to open a can of 'worms'.

Holy Keilbasa! I just realized who posted the question! Mr. Kimm how are you? For a split-second I was fifteen again being thrown from a dock with a wedgy as tight as a violin string.

[Deitz Dittrich]

Quote:

---

For a split-second I was fifteen again being thrown from a dock with a wedgy as tight as a violin string.

---

Yikes, there is an immage that will take a while to get out of my head!

[jalberg]

That technique does work well. I also pinch down the barb on ALL my hooks making hook removal even easier. And no, I rarely lose a fish. Does anyone else out there do this?

[Keith_MN]

Quote:

---

That technique does work well. I also pinch down the barb on ALL my hooks making hook removal even easier. And no, I rarely lose a fish. Does anyone else out there do this?

---

jalberg,

Yes, I also pinch the barbs on my hooks. I would like to see more people pinch their barbs. On larger hooks (ie spinnerbaits and buzzbaits) it reduces the damage to the fish when removing the lure. And on smaller hooks ( which can occasionally be gut hooked) it makes the removal a breeze when using the technique linked to above.

And so what if I loose an occasional fish. I was going to release it anyway, right?!!

[jalberg]

exactly!

[skink]

That made me think of something I experienced recently fishing with some new guys. They kept deep hooking fish with a crawler and yanking out the hook and hoping it would survive. I told them that they should be cutting the line and saying goodbye to a cheap hook because they can survive with it. I've noticed a lot of fishermen, seasoned even, that don't know that fish will survive with a hook rather than yanking it out. Some guys don't care. Just a thought to pass along.

[grab the net]

When one particular live bait becomes available, (waterdogs) there is no better livebait period for bass and northerns. A 6-8 inch WD is just crazy in shallow cover either on a jig or plain hook. Otherwise suckers in the late fall on circle hooks are great fun also. My hooking percentages and deep hooking are no worse with live bait than with artificials. When live bait is called for, I use it, I mean we are there to catch fish and have fun right? I save the only artificial for T's, otherwise I go with what is working. Anybody ever use livebait to pre-fish for a Tournament, then figure out how to get them to go with artificials for the Tournament day. I bet ya have.

[RK]

Quote:

---

For a split-second I was fifteen again being thrown from a dock with a wedgy as tight as a violin string.

---

Bwahahahahaa! That's hilarious.

I'm good man. Seen your posts here and there and keep meaning to drop you an email. I'll do so this week and we'll catch up. Saw Bob Ebsen this week - first time I'd seen his face in ages.

Will be in touch.

Rob