Cancer lumps on female dogs udder- have you encountered this problem?

[BLACKJACK]

A couple weeks ago when I took my 2 and 8 year old female labs into the vet for spring shots and check-up, he felt several small lumps on the older ones udder. He said they could be cancerous or benign, he won't know until he takes them out in a month (shes in heat right now, he wants to wait until thats well over with).

Since my previous 12 year old female lab also developed a cancerous lump on her udder that grew from the size of a peanut to a grapefruit in about 3 months - I ended up putting her down because of it - I'm very concerned. My question to you guys with female dogs is, how often have you had this problem? The vet said it happens in female dogs that are not fixed, going thru the hormonal changes of the heat cycle over the years. The way to prevent it is to get them fixed before the first heat cycle.

The reason that I like female dogs is that they listen better, my first lab was a hard headed male and I said never again but I'm contemplating changing that. The reason I haven't spayed my females is that I had intended to get a litter of pups out of them when they hit five years old, for a replacement.

I don't want this post to degenerate into a 'sin of backyard breeding post' (I do get them checked out and xrayed before I breed them), save that for another post. Just let me know if you've owned female labs in the past, whether you've encountered this problem. I'd like to get a handle on what percent of female dogs develop lumps on their udders.

Thanks.

[LABS4ME]

Hey BlackJack,

1st off let me say sorry to hear of the problems you and the pooch are encountering... hopefully all will end up a scare and you can breath a sigh of relief. Sometimes they do develop lumps that are benign as they get older during their heat cycles... so maybe they will be nothing and just go away.

On to the breast cancer in dogs... Unfortunatley your vet is right. It is very perdominant in females (I've seen in it in many - many labs and other larger sporting breeds). I couldn't give you a hard factually percentage, but it's greater than most people are aware. His course of action is best... spay early, but if your intentions are to breed them, as I do with most of the females I ('ve) own (ed), that isn't a possibilty. What I generally do though is spay them at the earliest time I can after their last breeding... I know I still have increased odds of my dogs developing breast cancer, but, I have to date, dodged that bullet. Had other forms of cancer take down dogs, but yet to have it manifest in the breasts.

Don't gauge all males on the one you previously owned. I have a male right now that is more sensitive, kinder and listenes better than most of the females I've owned. In fact the last 2 males I've owned I would not put in the stubborn or knot headed category. It really does boil down to the breeding they come out of and early training. There is a reason most field trialers lean towards owning a male over a female (aside from stud fees), it's because once trained, they are the same dog out of the crate day in and day out. Female's moods will swing during cycles and you can't hunt/train/ or compete with a dog in heat if other dogs are around. Just remember though you are trading one evil for another when going from Male to Female. If not nuetered at a young age (which will DEFINITLEY help with any attitude problems if they are prevelent) a male has a high perponderence of testicular cancer. I generally really try and sway those buying males from me to get them nuetered at 8-10 months unless they are going to compete the dog. To keep them intact as a stud dog for a possible couple of breedings throughout their life is not fair to them to have the risks of contracting and going through cancer. The demand is not out their for non-titled stud dogs... no matter what the breeding. But in the end, each person has to make their own determination as to what they want and/or expect out of their dog. All my dogs are sold on a limited registration, which I do lift once they prove to me that they have recieved their numbers for hips/elbows and eyes. This actually makes most of my clients spay and nueter their dogs right away as they know they won't go through those minimal efforts. The limited registration with the AKC makes any litter bred out of that dog unregisterable unless I've lifted the "limited" portion PRIOR to the dog being bred. I'm O.K. with people breeding their dogs as long as they follow even the minimal protocol.

In the end, your vet is giving you good hard information. With some research I'm sure you can come up with answers, but you already answered it your self... You've had one confirmed female with it and a possible second one coming... I don't know how many females you've owned, but divide that by 2... this may be a higher percentage than what actully is out there as a whole, but even that is still probably higher than you want to see.

Good Luck with the vet... let us know how it turns out!

Good Luck!

Ken

[Swamp Scooter]

No need to say much more than labs4me just did. The tumors can just be growths that do not cause the cancer. It does need to have a biopsy done to be sure though. I have had females that have had the lumps and nothing wrong. Sometimes it can come from trauma in the field as they tear throught he cover. Sorry to hear about it just the same.

I also agree that not all the males are the same and you will get very different temperments with them and most of the time not so "moody". Not that any of it is bad it is all about the individual.

good luck

[Little Joe]

Yup, my 9 year old yellow has a bunch of lumps on his underside. All are benign and according to my vet, quite common in older labs both male and female. Hopefully that's what it will turn out to be. I do question the need to remove the lump in order to see if it's malignant. My vet just did needle biops which were quick and relatively painless.

[duckbuster]

Hey Guys, Is there any chance they are just fatty tumors? I had plenty of them on my last female, who was spayed before her 1st cycle.

The female I have now is not going to get fixed because I too want to breed her a few times but this has always been a huge concern of mine.

Blackjack, I'm with you with the female thing. I will always have them not because I had a bad experience with a male in the past just that I like their personality better.

I will say that if this happens to this female I have now she will be the last one I ever have that does not get taken care of from a reproducing stand point.

Blackjack, please keep us posted on what's going on with her and the outcome.

I'm sure I speak for the rest of the forum when I say GOOD LUCK with this and that our thoughts are with her!!!!!

[BLACKJACK]

Thanks for the advice guys. I called the vet yesterday and scheduled BOTH of them to get spayed on May 10. I don't want either of them go thru what my old dog did, when that tumor started growing, she was licking it all the time, then it would break open, then more licking, it was nasty. Hopefully when they remove the lumps on my older dog they'll be benign. At this point, they're pretty small, it will be a small incision to get them out, get'er done is my thought vrs waiting for the results of a needle biopsy. When I started thinking about the pros and cons of spaying the young one, the 'free' pup that I'd get if I bred her in a few years didn't match up against the anguish that I'd feel if she develops a cancer later in life. When I need a pup, theres lots of good lab pups around. My brother, the owner of a male lab will be bummed, but hes not the one that has to put up with a dog put to sleep before their time because of cancer.

I'll report back after May 10.

[BLACKJACK]

Thought I'd post a quick update. Just had my older dog in last night getting her stitches out, had her in two weeks ago to get neutered and have three different lumps taken out of her titties. All the lumps came back benign!!! That was good news!!!! Aside from four different incisions, an infection that was cured by some antibiotics, and two weeks as a 'conehead', she came thru it fine. Now its back to walks and dummies and getting her back in shape.

Last week I also had my three year old female lab in to get spayed. After seeing my previous two female labs get lumps on their titties, it was an easy decision.

Cost of the first surgery was $800+. That includes several lab tests for another problem. The spaying on the second dog was $300. My vet said puppies are around $150 to spay. The reason I'm listing the prices is for the guys that think they want to keep their female dogs intact so 'they can get a pup' out of her. Yes, you can but then you run the increased risk of lumps and problems later in their life. That $650 difference will buy a pretty nice pup when you're ready. My first lab had a couple litters of pups, they're fun and they're cute, but they're also a lot of work, and its not really that big of a money maker by the time you figure in your vet bills and costs. Don't do it. From now on, when I need a pup, I'll go buy one. Theres lots of labs around - on this HSOforum, the Strib, Outdoor News.

Onto duck and pheasant hunting with two healthy dogs!!!

[LABS4ME]

Great news BlackJack! Hope she brings joy to your hunting for many more years!!!

You bring up a good point most people are not aware of... Spaying and nuetering of older dogs costs more than a 9 month old pup. Unless you are really looking at a dog that SHOULD be bred, it is a wiser route that you have your dog fixed at a young age. I have spayed many females at a year old that I knew would not cut it for my breeding program. Much easier on them at that age than at 6-8 years old when you are done breeding them. I still spay all my breeding females after their last litter and it is a slower healing prospect than the younger dogs. I too have reverted more to buying a pup when I'm ready than trying to time a breeding to when I need a pup. I have bred less litters over time as I can't compete with all the $200-300.00 dogs out there. To much work and money involved in raising a litter of quality pups to sell them for that.

Thanks for sharing these points with us!

Good luck!

Ken

[Swamp Scooter]

Good news and advice all the way around. I think the vets go to the higher price at 5 years of age. Hope the recovery goes well and good hunting.

[huntingislife]

My male lab is 8.5 months right now. I better get him done soon then before the price goes up. Does anybody know if there is a price difference between spaying and neutering?

[BLACKJACK]

Thanks Labs!!

[Bryce]

Just had a talk about this with our vet. He said research shows that the spaying needs to be done by second or third heat cycle to reduce cancer risks. We spayed our first female at 9 after her last litter. She was dead from cancer at 12. We will not be taking the risk of surgery with our current female. Just have to deal with the diaper every six months. Does anyone know if a dog stops cycling at certain age? Will make a kind of test case for our young girl who will have to have enough litters to pay for three years of training. Pretty cool that can say titties on here. Rick's diciples must not peruse this board.

[xedge2002]

Our lab was 14 years old when we had to put her down. The last few years she didn't go into heat on a real regular basis but she did once or twice from age 11-14, I don't know if it was a full blown cycle or not she just had a little bleeding for a few days.