Gun Nut &/or Vietname Vet Question

[Scott M]

So there is an article about Mikhail Kalashnikov being troubled by his AK-47 being used to kill so many people in war, revolutions, etc. But he's also been a promoter of his weapon. This quote from 2007 during the 60th anniversary of the firearm raised a couple questions for me:

Quote:

During the Vietnam war, American soliders would throw away their M-16s to grab AK-47s and bullets for it from dead Vietnamese soldiers

So I want to know from Vietnam Veterans, is this true?

If so, it begs the question of with what are we sending our soldiers to war? Now I'm from the generation after Vietnam, and I've always been led to believe that Americans have the best technology and send their soldiers to conflicts and wars as the best outfitted and armed men in the world. Is that not true? Is it only recently true? One would think with our defense spending we'd have the best outfitted men.

I'm couching the question within the context of weapons, but I would expand it to include all gear and equipment.

[jentz]

Yes its true.The M-16 at that time was in its infancy before chrome breeches/chambers were introduced,They consistantly jamed from mud,dirt and debris.The AK didnt do that because the tolerances were loose.It was more reliable.Since its upgrade it is up with the best.As far as well equiped look at the Iraqi war NO ARMORED Humvees dont always believe were the best equiped!!!

[Gordie]

Another thing that made the M-16 fail was the use of ball powder it was so much dirtier than was anticipated ,it was suppose to be a self cleaning due to the use of ball powder.

They (government, military) did not listen to Eugene Stoner. The military didn't think the M16 .223 was enough gun and tried to basically make the gun fail.

The AK-47 work with handfuls of dirt thrown in the action and keep working. Its reliability was what made it so popular.

[klecker]

My Dad talks about it all the time. His first m-16 would fire 5-6 rounds then jam. No matter what he did. They were also not issued cleaning kits at first. He either carried a M-77 or a used AK, when he had to go on forward observer missions.

[Eric Wettschreck]

Not a Nam vet but I've been everywhere else, man. (Sing it Jonny Cash)

AK-47's could very well be compared to Remmington 870's. Drop em off a cliff, roll em in the mud, drive over em with a truck.......pick em up and shoot. They just plain flat out work.

As far as the rest of the gear......It's a very common mis-conception that our soldiers, sailors, and airmen are being equiped with the very best. While I was never involved in the purchasing aspect of Navy stuff, I was involved heavily with using the stuff. Quality was middle of the road at best.

[huntnfish]

I'm no where near old enough for Nam but I've done a fair amount of reading on special forces in Vietnam and many used either AK's or Stoners. I was told the M-16s we shot in Basic were Vietnam era and after shooting them I would guess they probably were. They were complete junk. I did learn how to clear the weapon pretty well though.

[delcecchi]

Whilst I spent my army time in early 70's in California, so never used M16 in combat conditions, we did use them in Basic training. I never had a jam under those conditions, and I shot a fair amount.

What I recall hearing and reading at the time was there were a couple of factors. Something about the lubricant, either it was the wrong stuff or it wasn't available or something. There may also have been some design issues that got worked out. And the troops who were issued them maybe weren't trained very well in proper cleaning and lubrication procedures.

And politics might have entered into it as well, with incidents being blown out of proportion. We had half a million folks over there at the peak. They couldn't all have been scrounging guns and ammo off dead VC.

[Recon]

I spent part of 1968 and most of 1969 in Vietnam with a Marine Recon unit .I believe the M16 was first issued in country in 1963. Manny of the problems with it, I believe, we're in the early years. I don't recall having any problems with mine but I also toke the time to keep it as clean as possible at all times. We had a couple of rules that we followed as a unit. Never more than 15 rounds in a magazine and always remove rounds from your magazines if we were in a rear area! I believe weak magazine springs were a major cause of problems with this rifle! The marines really pounded it in your head the importance of taking care of your weapon! Still some just never got the importance of caring for your weapon! Never saw anyone carrying an Ak but I'm sure people used them in the heat of battle, after all if you were out of ammunition or had a malfunction and there layed an AK I'd of picked one up too! I did see a few people carry 870's and had one patrol leader, a Sargent, who carried an old Thompson 45.