waste of money

[Powerstroke]

I do like Sartells signiture, but I hate one of his lines. He said

"In the future they should make an ID guide for those who need one and then make a regular 1 page front/back supplement for us real duck hunters."

What the hell's that supposed to mean? So, the real duk hunters were born with the inate ability to identify species without ever looking them up? This sport would die if people didn't have the availale resources that we do now. I don't know what a scaup looks like or a canvasback from a redhead, but I better learn since there are very tight resatrictions on hunting those birds. How am I supposed to know unless I can grab that book, that happens to contain any laws I will need to know, and study the features of different birds. When I first started duck hunting, we shot at anything that flew and with 4 guys we could sort out legal limits later. This was just 5 yrs ago. I don't hunt that way now cause I know better, but at the same time I odn't know how to identify my ducks yet so I'm ethical and don't shoot unless I can identify them. DOes that make "not a real duck hunter"?

I'm annoyed that I can't get the regs in a small package anymore, but the ad's actually make profit for the DNR. They MAKE MONEY on the regs.

Also stamps, years ago there would be so many stamps purchased and held at the stores and at the DNR that they would lose money with too much inventory. Now they only buy as many as they need and aviod over paying for over-production of the stamps. Cuts don't on waste too.

[captkev]

One thing I'd like to see is where the money goes, I know for land purchase, restoration, ect. ect. I'd like to see a list of the countys and what was done to them, and for how many years, how many trees and where...WHERE... WHERE!

I've looked all threw the DNR web site and can't find the new land that is bought each year, Now that potlatch is leaseing out thousands of acres, wheres all this NEW LAND ... Heck I dont care about 40 some dollars to hunt waterfoul, I spend 1000's on lic's for fishing, fishhouses, bait, tackle, guns, ammo, clothes, boats, gas, food, tires, dog food, vet bills, oil changes,hunting lic's, trips to the meat locker,CELL PHONE BILL to call TIP, ALL TAXES and I dont care just as long as I'm free and able to enjoy all of it!

Just as long as I'm not being TAXED for a DOME that I wont be useing cuz I'm too busy hunting and fishing!

[jblabsnduck]

Powerstroke, I think he was saying that there are hunters out there that don't need an ID book such as myself.

He said have one for the people that need one and a one pager for the rest of us that don't need one.

The guys I hunt with including myself can more times than not tell what kind of bird just flew over the decoys in the dark.(atleast before legal shooting time)

Also you can tell what birds arby the way the fly and by there wing beats.

I would study the book long before you go into the field to know what is what. Don't take that the wrong way, you wouldn't want to shoot something you shouldn'tand I don't want to have to call TIP on you.

[Sartell Angler]

Powerstroke- what jblabsnduck said...I never said that those who need an ID book shouldn't use one, or even that they shouldn't have one provided to them free of charge by the DNR...just saying that at the ripe age of 21, I am able to identify every duck in the air/on the water/ in the hand. If I don't know what it is I do not shoot, period. Therefore, I feel that it is a waste of DNR $$$ to print one for me or anyone else who does not require one. Not trying to be high and mighty here or anything--I realize that it can be tough to ID birds at first for some people and I would rather have a lot of consciencious hunters out there than people without regard for the birds, blasting away at anything that flies.

BTW I feel that the DNR does a good job overall managing our natural resources and think that they are starting to do an even better job this past year or so. I would like to see them focus more on the waterfowl and upland game birds in the coming years.

Riverrat- thanks for the compliment...glad to see there are those who feel the same way.

SA/wdw

[gorrilla]

Sartell angler, its already been stated previously on how the regs book is paid for by advertisers within. Thats why they are becoming larger and more extravagent every year. As far as not needing an ID book, I've graduated with a bachelor's in Wildlife Biology including numerous ornithology courses. I also banded and conducted several census projects on waterfowl throughout my early career in the MN DNR(I now work in a different field). Along with this I currently duck/goose hunt on average in three states per year over 60 days and I can't claim to know every moment I'm looking at a bird I can tell you what gender and species it is! I still look at ID manuals and see things I've never noticed before. The difference between a hen redhead and hen ringneck on a cloudy day at 45 yards over your decoys is never easy... So I think its dumb to not want the ID's available especially to newbies or occasional hunters. Can't we find better things to do than BIZATCH about everything under the sun that the DNR does...

[Mark Christianson]

Exactly some of my points I was getting at in my first post in this thread.

Cripes!!!! Get over it.

If the DNR doesnt print it with an ID section, then people will come and post that they are mad it was removed.

Double cripes!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Sartell Angler]

Relax guys...I think some people on here are starting to think that I feel more strongly about this "issue" than I really do. I realize that the ID guide can be helpful at times, as do I realize that the advertisers pay for the bulk of the waterfowl regs. Just agreed to the point that for a lot of guys the ID section is not needed.

SA/wdw

[jblabsnduck]

Let's all take a deep breath,READY.

This was just a question fellas.

All I wanted to see was opinions. I think there are to many pages but the next guy might say "heck I never knew that or wow that is what a hen red head looks like or OK now I know the difference between a snow goose and a swan"

I have the regs that I printed of the DNR site so I don't see all the advertising stuff but I was told that there is a ad in there for a guide that isn't even in MN.

Did the DNR ask guides in MN if they wanted to advertise? and if so was the price just way to high for most to do it.

Again this is just a question.

P.S there is a bird guide that even goes as far to show you how every type of birds flys when in a flock.

[magnumthunder]

(Contact US Regarding This Word) (Contact US Regarding This Word) (Contact US Regarding This Word)!! Someone always has to be complaining. First of all I think its a great idea! If you know it all then dont pick one up! It seems the guys that know it all are the ones that give the wrong advice! If you want the sport to live on then let it go! There are some new hunters who haven't seen the amount of ducks all you experts have. Next you (Contact US Regarding This Word) because someone didn't know what a certain duck was! Now some of you will admit that early in the season some ducks can be tuff to idenify. What if some who has moved here from another state and has been shooting sea ducks? Wow, no sea ducks here huh? I've seen post on here with people asking what kind of duck this is? thing about is a lot of people didnt have a clue, including me! Now I feel fairly confedent I can ID Ducks around here easily but still bring a book with me. I have taken people out with who have never got to see the amount of birds I have and could only ID A fully color Drake mallard and a Canada goose! Geesh You dont want people shooting something they are nor suppose to do you? I think it is easier for more people to ID with live birds and a chart. I know let me have it for giving my $.02 worth but be realistic all you experts. Some of you spend more time in the swamp in 1 month than a lot of people have in their life!!

[jblabsnduck]

magnumthunder, I wont let you have it and I don't consider myself and expert by any means. Do I know how to hunt? YES. Can I tell you what duck is laying in my hand? YES. Can I tell the difference between a snow goose and a swan? YES.

BUT I am learning new things everytime I go out. That is the great thing about hunting, not everytime is the same.You always have to adjust to weather, wind and all other surronding conditions.

Like I said before, I don't need the regs with the ID section BUT the next guy might heck maybe you might be the guy, I don't know.

Do I think it is a good idea for a newbie? YES.

I would tell ANYONE that is not sure of duck ID to steady that ID book long before they go into the field. GO to a pond or swamp with a pair of binos and look for those ducks(spring time is best for this)

I have taken people out with me that are new to hunting and I explain everything I do (if they want to know why I am doing something a certain way)I also will ask them to TRY and ID a duck in flight beofore we pull up on it or them.

I point out the way the ducks are flying and how fast the wing beat is. I took a guy out two years ago that was just amazed at the differnt sounds birds make when the fly(the whistle of the wings, the 747 coming in being the sound of a flock of bluebills)

Good Luck to all you guys this season

[Sartell Angler]

I retract my statement that the ID section is not necessary for all hunters.

Instead, I will focus my efforts on campaigning the belief that smilies (when used a dozen or more times in a single post) are unnecessary.

LOL

SA/wdw

[hobbydog]

OK...what kind of ducks are these and what are the clues? The first one with the right answer gets a new set of the regs with the ID section ripped out

[jblabsnduck]

Not being the clearest picture in the world.

I would guess they where ringbills with a few redhead on the tail end. Going by the way they are flying.

Ringills and redheads fly close to the same pattern.

[captkev]

... Heck I cant even tell and I'm compareing them with the regs... GREAT POST

[WalleyeWeasel]

REDHEADS...my favorite

[hobbydog]

Quote:

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REDHEADS...my favorite

---

and what are the clues you are using to tell you they are redheads

[WalleyeWeasel]

You really can't tell them from Northern bills, reds, or maybe cans except (blocky head)and color on the one i'm just giong by the fact that you posted simular pics. on the birdwatching forum........ When do i get my prize??

Awesome work by the way...

[hobbydog]

so it was a guess They are reds and one of the big clues is the shape of the formation....reds usually fly in a V shape. Also the shape of the duck. The book is good for ID in the hand which is good but experience and coaching can help in the field. Wing speed, shape, and altitude they fly and approach at are all clues. Early in the morning it can be the difference between a quack and dreep to differentiate a hen and a drake. I have hunted ducks for as long as I can remember and ID is never easy in a hunting situation. Ringers and bluebills still stump me....maybe because 90% of the time they are ringers and the fact few have nice plumage early in the season.

Here is another one....this one should be easy but is often mis ID because of lack of early season plumage. The tip off on these ducks is their graceful flight.

One of the problems with ID when hunting is you don't often get a nice wide open view. You are often lookig through the blind, into the sun, or in semi darkness.

[WalleyeWeasel]

Pintail

[wyldewal]

Pintail would be my guess also. Long necks, wing set slightly back on there bodies. Beautiful birds. tasty too. they can be very hard to ID at times, like at dawn when it's cloudy, when it's foggy, when they fly with a mixed flock... Too many situations to list.