Change???? maybe a little.

[walleye101]

160's do kill dogs. At least 2 full sized dogs have died in 160's in WI this winter. One was an unbaited 160 trail set. It killed a springer.

This story could use a little more detail. Even 220's in open trail sets are safe. Dogs go over them like they are not even there. Must have been a fence crawl under?

[walleye101]

Many trappers like myself find that footholds are very effective at taking cats and Jonny said he uses snares. Where is the problem?

The problem is the daily check requirement for both snares and footholds. I'd love to use footholds and would catch more cats in fewer sets, but many of us cannot trap full time, for a month. The three day check is the only practical way to run any number of sets in decent cat locations.

Why is no one even talking about extending the check law for footholds?

[swampman]

What is stopping SMN trappers from switching to dog proofs?

160's do kill dogs. At least 2 full sized dogs have died in 160's in WI this winter. One was an unbaited 160 trail set. It killed a springer.

If MN trappers switch to 160's without tight restrictions on hole size fewer dogs will be killed but dogs will still be killed and the spotlight will stay focused on us. That's not good.

It would seem to me that with all the money that is generated in the dakotas from out of state hunters that they would have tighter bodygrip restrictions if they deemed it the huge issue that you do. The wildlife people are not stupid they often get blamed for lack of birds rightly or wrongly so and know that trapping is a useful management tool. I am also tired of hearing about the dp traps they are a useful tool nothing more, try driving one in the ground this time of year or keep them working in freeze thaw conditions. You also cant run them on a 3 day check and with gas prices that is a huge issue. Thats my thoughts and mine only so please quit with the "we" trappers you don't speak for me and your alternatives I find extreme and unecessary. Maybe you have more wisdom than the dnr and the trappers assoc. or maybe you just have a personal agenda I don't know.

[swampman]

Walleye the extended foothold has no chance of being extended IMO, the anti's pushed that years ago as the foothold was deemed "inhumane" we were told to use more bodygrips as they caused less "suffering" and so here we sit today.

[Random guy]

160's do kill dogs. At least 2 full sized dogs have died in 160's in WI this winter. One was an unbaited 160 trail set. It killed a springer.

[Random guy]

Quote:

The problem is the daily check requirement for both snares and footholds. I'd love to use footholds and would catch more cats in fewer sets, but many of us cannot trap full time, for a month. The three day check is the only practical way to run any number of sets in decent cat locations.

Why is no one even talking about extending the check law for footholds?

Very true, I check daily but it is my job. Plus my line is not just cats or fisher its everything open, so I am checking foothold at the smae time I am checking snares and my conibears. Plus the wolves in this area will clean out your traps if you leave anything more then a day, and often that is not fast enough. I'm not sure how some of the partime guys that have other jobs could run a daily line and make it work.

[Random guy]

Walleye the extended foothold has no chance of being extended IMO, the anti's pushed that years ago as the foothold was deemed "inhumane" we were told to use more bodygrips as they caused less "suffering" and so here we sit today.

It's the perfect one two punch. First wipe out the bodygrips then go back to the twenty year old anti campaign of suffereing foot holds. Conibears will be gone and it's a clear shot at the foot holds. Just like a battle plan for war, take out the tanks and escape routes so you can get to the now isolated and entrenched ground troops.

Oh this was not just a shot form the hip from a dog owner, it's much bigger then that.

[Ray1]

Im so sick of this thread that i am asking for it to be locked. This is only making sportsman lash out at other sportsman. But i am definatly with Jonny P and the rest of the sensible people. Im just hoping that all you trappers out there have contacted your house and senate about some of these issues. Lets not let the antis get us on this.

[Saw557]

Im so sick of this thread that i am asking for it to be locked. This is only making sportsman lash out at other sportsman. But i am definatly with Jonny P and the rest of the sensible people. Im just hoping that all you trappers out there have contacted your house and senate about some of these issues. Lets not let the antis get us on this.

I am with you on this one they should just delete the entire thread. I put up up I thought was a reasonable solution for debate and it just got ignored.

I am with Johnny P on this one. I think there are a couple of individuals that are trolling and posing as trapppers/hunters that have other things on their agenda rather finding a solution. There have been posts made about limiting openings to beer can sized holes and including 160's in the ban it really makes me wonder what it would take to make some people happy.

Lock-delete and put a filter on any threads that mention the words conibear body grip or any other reference to the issue. Enough of this C*#@

[9339za]

Continuing to kill dogs hurts trapping. Ignoring it and hoping it will go away will make trapping go away. We need to find solutions to the problem.

How does admitting there is a problem and searching for solutions make a person an anti-trapper?

I think there is no difference between pro-dog and pro-trapping. That's a false choice.

[FCspringer]

The reason this will get closed is simply because people let their emotions get in the way. Thats all, not that it's a bad subject. I in my trapping years always set about a hundred 220 sets with smelt as bait in a square bucket set. I cought about 250-300 coon each year untill snow cover hit or cold weather den ups. All those sets and only 1 dog ever. Which was 300 yards off a road, on private land and the owner was a tresspasser. The dog was unharmed. This is not dumb luck. It is a testiment to the fact that it is so rare 99.9999999% of people will never encounter it. Especialy with declining trappers out there each year. If the 220 is banned or made useless for my style of coon trapping, I to will quit all togeather but on my own land for control. Not sure for the Nth guys, but if they wish, I would trade every 220 in for a nice sized coon sized live trap, from a state fund set up from an increase on pheasant stamps. We simply can not afford to go buy 120 live sets to replace the 220's. So if the state and hunters via pheasant stamps duck stamps, would fund something like that. What do you all think about that? Would they work up Nort? But if the trapper was forced to pay for it I would not be for that.

[FCspringer]

Continuing to kill dogs hurts trapping. Ignoring it and hoping it will go away will make trapping go away. We need to find solutions to the problem.

How does admitting there is a problem and searching for solutions make a person an anti-trapper?

I think there is no difference between pro-dog and pro-trapping. That's a false choice.

9339za I think your wrong about us trappers out there thinking about what to do. We do wish to try something. It is not needed as bad as it's portrayed is all. And the solutions you have drempt up simply benefit no one but the ones that want trapping to stop. Please if your here to stir the pot, and not come up with any feasible solution, just ignore the discussion. Weather you mean no harm or not. You said your ideas. It will never fly with the trapping community. So don't take it wrong, but please forget about more discussion on the subject with talk of doing away with any traps, or the use of bait. We all know that is not a solution, but rather an end. And for you to keep this up is just getting feathers ruffled, and leading again to another locked thread.

[Ybone]

Debate by definition is the offering of different viewpoints so if you expect everyone to embrace your ideas it really isn't debate. Accusing people of being liars or posing as someone they're not probably won't help the debate either.

[Trashguy]

"if you expect everyone to embrace your ideas it really isn't debate"

Sorry, but that works both ways with that statement.

9339za has given unemotional alternatives/solutions here that have been asked for, but all that he gets for this is being slammed, because its not what some/most want to hear.

Listen, if dogs weren't dying, I wouldn't be here writing, sorry but that is the way I feel PERIOD.

[FCspringer]

Sorry fellas but to simply take away something with no return is not a compromise at all. We might as well go ahead and lock the thread now again. Sorry as I said before for trying. It is obviously not getting done the way I had hoped. And also I had intentions of this being as said at the start a discution for experienced trappers to sort through and give thoughts and or ideas. Not discruntal dog owners. It is clearly a topic that will just head one way so again sorry I tried, and I,m out. Thanks to those who honestly tried.

[NORTHCRAZE]

Johnny P.

Just a straight up question.

Do you or have you owned any dogs of any type ever?

How about the last 3 generations of your family?

[Ybone]

Trashguy, I wasn't talking to or about 9339za.

[Saw557]

"if you expect everyone to embrace your ideas it really isn't debate"

Sorry, but that works both ways with that statement.

9339za has given unemotional alternatives/solutions here that have been asked for, but all that he gets for this is being slammed, because its not what some/most want to hear.

Listen, if dogs weren't dying, I wouldn't be here writing, sorry but that is the way I feel PERIOD.

I don't expect everyone to agree to my ideas but a little discussion would be nice

9339 has offered ideas that really make a person question which side of the fence he's on

[Trashguy]

Have you read some of the comments being posted on that petition that is out there? I mean comments like "what if a child got caught in one of these" "or trapping is so barbaric", bla, bla, bla. So if I was a trapper I would do/change what ever it takes to shut off this nonsense thinking NOW and not have that thinking just snowball until.... Just my

[kelly-p]

Johnny P.

Just a straight up question.

Do you or have you owned any dogs of any type ever?

How about the last 3 generations of your family?

Seeing as I'm Jon's Dad I can answer part of that.

Lets see, dogs through my life. Kim, Sparky, Cassie, Jack, Jack 2.

Jack 2 liked to dress up once in a while.

Coke, Kelly. My wife bought "Kelly" as an older dog already named. The neighbors loved it when my wife stood on the front steps yelling "Kelly, Kelly, come here girl". "Kelly" died when she got out on a highway and was hit by a car. I didn't blame the car driver for her death, I blamed myself because I didn't watch out for her and let her get out on the highway.

Then I moved on to Micky, Tar and now Fred. Fred is with me every hour of every day. When I am working he is there, when I am sleepng he at the foot of my bed, when I awake he is licking my hand, when I am traveling he is there alongside of me. When he is outside whether in our yard, in the fields, on the lake or in the woods I never let him out of my sight so I know he is safe. It is part of the responsility of having a dog. I have become the "old guys" I used to laugh at with the dog sitting up in the front seat with them. Fred has done it so much he even sits up on his rear end in the passenger seat with his leg on the arm rest.

Anything else you want to assume NORTHCRAZE?

[Random guy]

Quote:

Johnny P.

Just a straight up question.

Do you or have you owned any dogs of any type ever?

How about the last 3 generations of your family?

I was part of the original "Jack's" life, Kelly P's dog. A huge blockheaded lab that kept me from falling off a bridge never let me get out of the yard without parents and a dog that trained ME how to duck hunt. Then of course was Mickey

Jack and I at the trapping shack

Me, Mickey, Jack and my sister with my first deer.

Then I had Goofy, a long time girlfriends dog that was as dumb as a box of rocks but would somehow turn into a world class pointer for about three minutes before he would go back to trying to bite his own neck.

After that I had Toni, she was a small mix breed mutt the wife brought home from a local farm. At first I was not impressed with her but she turned out to be a very good grouse dog and when put on a wounded critters trail she would drag me to it every time. Sadly she was killed on a job site. She went to work with me every day and the crew adopted her as the company pet. She got on the wrong end of some heavy equipment and was killed. It was not the equipments fault, it was not the operators fault even though he was in tears over it, it was my fault for letting her run around a job site.

[swamptiger]

Quote:

Have you read some of the comments being posted on that petition that is out there? I mean comments like "what if a child got caught in one of these" "or trapping is so barbaric", bla, bla, bla. So if I was a trapper I would do/change what ever it takes to shut off this nonsense thinking NOW and not have that thinking just snowball until.... Just my

The group who started the petition is also anti-hunting. Just curious what your response will be when they go after you, as a bird dog hunter?

Not being smart or sarcastic, this is a sincere question. Will you just bend over? The goal of the group who started the petition is to ban trapping. Do a little research, and you will see.

[swampman]

Have you read some of the comments being posted on that petition that is out there? I mean comments like "what if a child got caught in one of these" "or trapping is so barbaric", bla, bla, bla. So if I was a trapper I would do/change what ever it takes to shut off this nonsense thinking NOW and not have that thinking just snowball until.... Just my

This is nothing new, trappers have been hearing it for decades and nothing we do or say is going to change some peoples minds.

[kelly-p]

Johnny P.

Just a straight up question.

Do you or have you owned any dogs of any type ever?

How about the last 3 generations of your family?

A few more for you NORTHCRAZE. When my Grandfather was a Warden/Trapper he ran dog teams. Here is my Gandfather's first team while hauling hay to starving deer out in the bog during the "30's". "Spike" was the lead dog of that team.

My Father with Spike.

This was my Grandfathers 2nd team. He took this team to Hudson Bay to see what it was like there

So don't try to make it look like our family does not like dogs. They are not just let out of kennel to go hunting in the fall. They are a part of our life every day.

.

[NORTHCRAZE]

"The goal of the group who started the petition is to ban trapping. Do a little research, and you will see."

You can say that about some but not all.Truth said I never wanted to ban trapping as I also did it years ago. But after reading all these posts about the way trappers are responding to this issue I now no longer support trapping in any manner! This is only my opinion and is solely due to the trappers post here.Bad apples,maybe? It looks like I will not be grouse hunting or shed hunting next year. (Compromise?)