targeting big Walleyes

[heaterht]

I am relatively new to the world of walleye fishing being from central Missouri. I will be going on my second trip to Canada this year and want to try to target bigger fish. The trip is from june 5 thru 12 to Red Lake Ontario about 250 miles north of US border. Last year we were successful in catching alot of 17" to 20" fish in shallow(around 10')water on Lindy Rigs. We did catch a few larger fish but I think we could be more successful if we knew where and how to target big fish. Anyone w/ knowledge of different techniches please let me know.
I have recently heard of open water trolling for big fish this time of year and was wanting to get some specifics on things such as what depth to concentrate on, what depth the fish will be suspending at, what to look for on sonar, and rigging tips for crankbaits and planer boards.
Thanks
Dan

[Guido]

Take a look at the Largest Walleye of the Season thread, in the walleye section below this thread.

Canitbeluck has some good info to look into there!

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1...2...bam got him

[PerchJerker]

I don't want to sound discouraging, but the early June timeframe you have for your trip is an "in-between time" that far north. There will always fish on the shorelines and points, but by that time of year they will also be moving to deepwater structure (reefs and mud). The result can be scattered fish, especially if it's a late (ie. cold) spring. The bigger fish will be the first to leave the shallower spawning areas and shorelines and move to the reefs, but they're not always biting right away when they get to the reefs.

My best advice is to use good electronics that can identify big fish - you can't do this with a "fish id" feature. If you're catching smaller fish but marking big fish, give that area some more time. If you're not marking big fish and that's what you want, you need to move. Run and gun some spots and use your electronics.

On Canadian lakes I've always had more success with livebait than with trolling - find where the fish are stacked up and stay on top of them. But if you're looking for that one big fish, trolling lets you cover more water. Trolling a stickbait on a 3-way rig is a great way to go.

Good luck. The bite should be great at that time of year, even if it might be a little tougher to consistently find the big ones.

[bigeyes]

Guess it depends on what you are calling a big walleye most of those canadian lakes are known for kicking out awsome # of smaller fish. If 4-5 is big then you should be able to find some fish like that. If 10 is big you may be in for a change of venue. I have not been on Red but if you seem to be getting those 17-20" it is probably a #'s lake. Ask around they owner and they locals will know for sure. Some lakes do # and big fish, but not many(lac Suel and eagle come to mind) Open water trolling for suspended fish is primaraly a great lakes method. You need great water clarity and the type of baitfish that suspend way up(mainly shad). This does not fit the bill for most canadian lakes. That doesn't mean you can't troll for bigger fish, but they are likely not suspended much. Good Luck

[Guest]

I haven't fished red lake, but I have fished the English river just a few miles south of there.

We caught both huge numbers and big fish.

In general, as what already has been stated, the "numbers" are going to be shallow early in the year, just after spawn. On top of shallow reefs are the ticket for all the "eaters" you want.

If you are looking for BIG fish, then you have to start working deep water structure, that is very close to these reefs. Even at the bottom of these reefs, you will find these fish.

Point is, that they are there in that water. Just don't travel too far from your "numbers". The fish need to eat and they are going to where the food is. The bigger fish tend to go to the summer haunts first.

It is patience and you need to try large live bait. Good chubs will do it, no fatheads.

That time of the year, I will generally pull spinners with chubs.

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Let 'em go so they can grow!!!

[heaterht]

Thanks for the replies. I have some more questions though. First, I do believe this lake does do #'s and Big fish. Last year there were 260 fish caught and released over 22" just from the lodge we go to alone, although only one went over 30". I still don't know exactly what to look for when you say deep structure(how deep, and what kind of structure). I know of one place on the lake around the size of a football field that is about 15ft and is surrounded by 50ft waters. Also I was wondering what a three-way rig is

[LuckyFish]

heaterht Deep is relative to the waters you are fishing. Deep in a shallow lake could be 10' to 15' or if the lake is deep and large it could be 20' to 40' or more. The thing you have to keep in mind is that most lakes thermocline in summer so if it is summer eyes your targeting the thermocline might be 20' feet and there won't be any eyes deeper than that. A three way rig consists of your main line from the rod that is attached to one eye on a three way swivel a leader of say 18" to 4' or more is attached to another eye. This is the buisness end, you can use a single hook and crawler, or a floating jig and a leeche, or crawler, or like many do you can use a spinner with a minnow, crawler, or leeche. You can be as creative as you like just don't put any weight on this line. A "dropper" line is attached to the third eye of the three way swivel. To this line you will attach the weight usually a bell sinker of 1/2 to 1 ounce or more. This "dropper" line can be anywhere from 12" to maybe 3'. depending how high you want your bait to ride. The trick to using a three way is to try to keep it as vertical as possible while trolling forward. An excellent way to keep your bait riding in the strike zone for those bottom relating fish and those suspended just off the bottom.

PS I wouldn't worry about a thermocline in the time frame you mentioned.
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Good Luck & Good Fishing. Lucky

[This message has been edited by LuckyFish (edited 01-27-2004).]

[PerchJerker]

In the days and weeks after walleyes spawn they begin a "migration" to their summer locations, which is typically mid-lake structure. Your 15' reef could be an example of this, especially if it's one of the closest mid-lake structures to shore. If there's food there the walleyes will be there too. Another good 'textbook' structure is a shoreline point that drops into deep water. Some reefs are better earlier in the summer and some are better later in the summer. You'll either need to get pointed in the right direction from people at the lake, or you'll have to spend some time looking yourself (USE YOUR ELECTRONICS - this is where good electronics and the knowledge to use them correctly can really come into play).

My suggestion, and try to remember this -- fish quickly to rule out unproductive spots, then spend your time carefully working through the spots with fish (especially big fish). Run and gun until you find them, then work them over. Life is too short to fish spots that "look good" but aren't producing fish.

LuckyFish did a nice job of explaining a 3 way rig. A couple things I'll add - use heavy sinkers, like 2 and 3 ounces, which help keep your line more vertical as he described. Instead of livebait I use a stickbait like a #11 floating original rapala. This lets you move fast (forward troll) and cover a lot of water. Use this as a quick methold to cover lots of water and locate fish. When you find good areas, slow down and go back through those area with livebait.

I use weaker test line on the dropper to the weight, so when I snag I usually lose just the weight and not the crankbait. You can go through a lot of weights.

This type of trolling requires lots of adjustments - almost constantly letting out line or reeling in line, so the weight rides just above the bottom. This lets you effectively fish water from less than 10 feet deep to over 40 feet deep without taking your line out of the water. I usually use about a 2 foot dropper to the weight and a 4-5 foot dropper line to the bait.

Trolling 3 way rigs is most effective when you're working shorelines, or long points, or big reefs, where you have lots of water to troll. It's not a good technique to use in small spots because your bait will quickly exit the spot.

I have never had much luck trolling for suspended fish on Canadian shield lakes. Almost all of my big walleyes have come on livebait in spots that I already knew were good locations.

Hope this helps.

[This message has been edited by PerchJerker (edited 01-27-2004).]

[bigeyes]

Looks like some good advice. I'll add again that it depends on what is big too you. Sounds like the lake has a few decent sized fish, but one over 30" for the lodge last season is a pretty good indicator that this lake is not a good bet for 8+ pound fish. For example I usually go to Lac Suel and our group(usually about 6 people) will get more than 240 fish over 22" in the 5 day trip we are there. Still sounds like it may be more of a #'s lake?

[Guest]

Agreed.

If the lodge is posting pictures of 22" fish, that isn't very big for walleyes.

Red lake is a big body of water and it is very well known for both numbers and size.

If you are looking for big fish, I would recommend that you lodge at LOTW. It is a better fishery. Holds TONS of big walleyes, and you catch all the numbers you want. Example of my last trip there in the summer of 2003 was working a reef where we pulled 8 fish over 25", the largest pushing over 30". The smallest was about 19". That was one afternoon.

Example of the reef we were working was 50 feet on the north side, 35 feet on the south side. The reef peaked at 15 feet. We worked mostly in the 20 to 30 foot range. The reef was between two islands, along a string of islands, leading from the narrows to big water. This is a staging point from spring spawn to their summer haunts. Every year, we absolutely slaughter fish from 5 to 8 pounds.

Also, for working reefs or any rocky structure, I prefer a good bottom bouncer to keep snags to a minimum over a 3-way.

There are tons of top notch resorts on LOTW. They are probably cheaper that what your paying @ Red Lake. If you want, I can get you some good info?

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Let 'em go so they can grow!!!

[heaterht]

Well I don't think I want go to another lodge. He charges $550 a week including room and board and 3 squares a day(man that woman can cook, not bad looking either . They are also from my home town of Sedalia, Mo.

We also have the advantage of being able to fish two lakes. The smaller one, Parker lake is full of big Northerns and loaded w/ small walleye. My dad brought home a 44" year before last. There was also a 50" muskie caught on Red last year at the same time I was there. Crazy thing spewed eggs all over the inside of their boat!

This has all been good info. and I think it will help. We've mainly been fishing in the back of the bays, maybe well go out more on the main lake and look for some deep structure. There are spots on this lake that reach over 100ft(maybe a little too deep). Red Lake is also known for big lake trout, although I don't know how to fish for them either. If you have any more ideas i'm still listening.

Thanks a bunch
Dan

[PerchJerker]

If you have been catching fish "back in the bays", try looking for fish near the mouths of the bays ..... major points, reefs, the closest islands, etc. Also try looking in the middle of bay or the middle of the mouth of the bay for reefs. Another good location can be a saddle between 2 islands, similar to what Big G described.

[heaterht]

I've been looking at the map and have found some of the saddles you're talking about. I'm trying to talk my dad into hauling our boat up there this year. It would nice to have it so we could do more run and gun fishing. Plus the electronics on it are better than our portable.

The middle of one of the bays is 140' so maybe we can find some reefs around that area. I'm still not sure what you mean by reef. I know the owner said that there were some sunken islands found over the course of the summer they previously had no idea existed so these may be of interest also.

[ccarlson]

First, if someone is really serious about targeting big walleye, you have to do the research to be sure you are fishing the right lake. You might do ok on red but my research pointed to many better lakes. I chose a lake that produces many 30+ inch walleye each week, and had special regulations to protect the big fish. Then I narrowed down the time frame when most of those were caught, then put in a few years to really get to know the lake and the habits of the big fish. I've caught 12 walleye over 30 inches in the last 3 years and over 30 walleye between 26 and 30 inches. Other guys in our boat have done even better.

Second, stealth. Big fish are like huge bucks, they spook much easier than the average fish. Sneak up on the spot and then make the first 10 minutes on the spot really count. Be ready and no noise. You'll most likely pop that big one right away. Catch some smaller ones and the big one will scatter.

Third, fish the part of the lake that holds big fish, not small fish. They do inhabit different parts of the lake. Where I go, we see guys heading to the smaller bays and they catch eaters all day long. I always fish structure in or very near the main or largest parts of the lake. you want to look for structure that is close to deep water.

Fourth, use the wind. Big fish are opportunistic. One trip I caught 6 walleye over 25 inches in a half hour in 1-3 feet of water. The wind was pounding a shoreline and we just pitched leeches on a splitshot rig to the shore. One hour later, after the bite quit, we adapted and caught a 31 incher in 22 feet of water.

like others have said, the open water trolling just doesn't produce on the canadian lakes I've found. Live bait on finnesse terminal tackle is the key.

good luck,
ccarlson

[Guest]

The one new thing we tried this year was open water trolling on LOTW in the Narrows. We were trolling for musky. We caught some BIG pike and musky doing this. We would troll over deep water and find schools of bait fish. We were average 10 to 15 pound pike on each hit, plus a few muskies in the 30 to mid 40 inch range.

We didn't try it for walleyes that much, however we did slam a few nice eyes on our musky cranks. We found them to be suspended too.

In working Red and other similar waters to that. GET OUT OF THE BAYS. Bays are not the big walleye holders when you compare them to reefs/sunken islands/rock piles/ whatever.

Find a hump on the map. Don't get too deep of water. Keep it close to main lake shoreline. The larger the structure, doesn't always mean the better.

My best bit of information, is to buy the Critical Concepts walleye book (From Infisherman) on location. It will tell you what you need to know. I don't mean to sound like an advertisement, but I've only been serious walleye fishing since 97. Before that, I didn't know squat. From 97 to 99, I struggled hard, trying to figure out what my boat partners were doing. I read that book, and now I converse with my good buddy walleye chasers, and we discuss the maps in detail as to where we are going and why. Once you find the fish, then it is just a matter of giving them what they want and when they want it.

Drop a jig or a lindy rig on the right hump and you will slam all the walleyes you want. Get off the deep end of those "right" humps and you will hook all the big walleyes you want!!!

Good luck!!!

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Let 'em go so they can grow!!!

[heaterht]

I'm waiting for my copy of critical concepts to arrive as we speak! I ordered it and another book on walleye fishing(i forgot the name) last week.

Man i got the fishin' fever. If the weather would cooperate i could be fishing for some slab crappie on the Lake of the Ozarks. Every time I get a day that I can go the weather sucks.

I really appreciate the info, I'm going to study those books and try to put together a plan of attack:P. I know it's going to be more productive to go out w/ at least a basic knowledge of where the fish will be. As long as I can find the fish it will only take a little bit of fishin' to find out what they want.

Dear Lord, thank you for the fish, If you let me catch the big one I promise to release her and make a plasic replica if my wife will let me.
Amen