Grill/brush guard or not?

[IFallsRon]

A friend is considering a grill guard for his new F150. He does a lot of deer country driving in the twilight and dark.

[overdalimit]

Ron,

The Grill Gaurd is not necessarily going to make the truck deer proof but it will give you a much better chance of being able to drive away from a car/deer accident. The biggest problem when hitting a deer is wiping out the headlights and cooling system and being dead in the water, so to speak. Hit a deer at 65 and there will be damage, no matter what, but the truck has a much better chance of being drivable after the impact with a gaurd. I own a body shop and know this info first hand.

[Valv]

A grille guard or brush guard will not do a thing against hitting a deer or other animal. I fact it will increase the damage. It will take out the whole front end, including radiator support, hood, fenders, etc.

The ONLY way to have a deer resistant bumper is to get a Ranch Hand (brand) or similar type bumpers.

They are not the prettiest, but sure built tough and for a good purpose.

A grill/brush guard will protect from a pheasant or maybe a turkey (if you are not driving too fast), but that's it.

[Shack]

Yep, had a customer drop a huge amount of money on a custom made deer pusher. He added up all the cost's of deductibles over the years, vehicle down time, hassles and hassles. He had about three issues. The first one was he bought a new vehicle every 3 years or so. The next was even know it looked very cool, having it on dropped the trade value as many people did not like this added feature. In the end he just gave it away with the truck basically because it never could be transfer to the new truck. Third was Air Bag deployment! The place that did the custom from guard like the one above made him sign a release about the airbags not deploying during a head or partial front side impact. I am not sure what they do now, but modifying an airbag system is a very touchy subject and from a liability stand point a big NO! No!!! If a product claims, relocates sensors, modifies the AB system in way, I just do not sit easy when it comes to aftermarket over riding an OEM safety feature. It could void any warranty on the AB system (if under warranty) and trusting and aftermarket company with the AB system or a custom shop could cause issue. The unfortunate thing is, when do you find out your AB failed during a crash?

Not to mention this does change the characteristics of the crinkle points in the front end of the vehicle (points designed in that allow the vehicle to crush proper to save the driver and passengers) and basically in an event of a head-on or partial head-on, sending the oncoming vehicle right into your windshield. My customer had his tied in solid to the frame and if an impact occurred, the ides of what would happen was the guard would bend/fold back enough to almost provide a ramp of sorts for the on-coming vehicle to travel right into his windshield. No absorption of impact. More of defection of impact right in the drivers face

Just something to think about They make look great, and make the vehicle look indestructible, make it so you do not even have to stop after you hit a deer, but there is always a down side to cool things

Good luck!

Edit note: Most of this went down in the mid to late 90's. Airbag systems have changed leaps and bounds since then. Maybe not an issue anymore?

[overdalimit]

I am not sure I agree with Valv and Shackbash on this one. I have seen many trucks that have hit deer and the grill guard trucks tend to drive in under their own power 9 times out of 10 while the non grill guard trucks come in on a hook probably 70 percent of the time. As for the airbag issue. Those work on inertia (60 to 0 in 1/2 second kind of thing) I guess I don't understand how a grill guard is going to have any effect on the inertia switch. As for the crumple zones...most of the deer hits I see are above the frame rails and it is the inner structure/sheet metal absorbing all the impact (yes I know the sheet metal also incorperates crumple zone technology). On the few occations that the deer impact damage was past the centerline of the front wheel the hit was so severe that the trucks were a Total loss. No gaurd on either of those trucks that I am thinking of by the way. Like I said in my original post. Nothing will make your truck deer proof, but a good brush bumper will give you a better chance of being able to limp it to civilization vs. not having one. Shackbash and Valv I know you guys are good and might be speaking from personal experiance but I feel there is a difference of opinion here. Not that it matters but I too am "certified" ASE, ICAR, GM, FORD, CHRYSLER, PPG and R-M.

[Jeremy airjer W]

I am not sure I agree with Valv and Airjer on this one.

I'd like to know how you know what I'm thinking!?!?!?!

[shizzy]

my only add on is I have seen quite a few "grille guards" that had some pretty sorry looking mounting methods. Cheapo thin non gusseted braketry that looks like it would fold over on to the hood of the truck with a stiff breeze or mounts that simply attach to the stock front bumper.

Make sure if he does go with one that it has some sturdy mounts. I would only run a grille guard as a place to mount some auxillary lights.

[overdalimit]

Originally Posted By: overdalimit

I am not sure I agree with Valv and Airjer on this one.

I'd like to know how you know what I'm thinking!?!?!?!

Whoops I meant shackbash just saw green. LOL

[overdalimit]

I do agree with the line of thought that says you get what you pay for...600.00 does not buy much protection.

[Shack]

overdalimit I did add in a note though:

Edit note: Most of this went down in the mid to late 90's. Airbag systems have changed leaps and bounds since then. Maybe not an issue anymore?

Quote:

most of the deer hits I see are above the frame rails and it is the inner structure/sheet metal absorbing all the impact (yes I know the sheet metal also incorperates crumple zone technology)

I was not talking about hitting a deer, I was talking about hitting another moving or still vehicle with the guard I had in mind.

The brush guard I used as a reference in my post is was nothing like I had ever seen. It was on a brand new 1996 Ford Bronco that was sold/ordered new at Brookdale Ford. As far as I know the guy still has these custom build still to this day. It would make the one in Valv's posts look like it was made out of pop cans. It was a sight to see. If you ever get around Brookdale/Superior Ford's show room, ask Terry H about the guy who would have the custom cow catcher's build for his new trucks and back then the legal paper work they had to go throw when his new truck was sent out to have this put on before delivery. He might have some pictures still. When the customer would come in for service, he had the battle scares from the deer he cleared with it. I will find out who made these and more details. If you get in the service department, see if John C is still their and I know he would remember the grill guards this guy built.

[shizzy]

More than likley the dealership was just doing a CYA with the airbag deal. there is a great chance it would have no real effect, but if that 1% popped up when the customer had an accident they would be pretty happy they had him sign the waiver.

[Shack]

Yep, find out more on who built the guard. It was fabricated and mounted on at Truck Utilities over in Maple Wood. I was made out of 4" round heavy wall steel tube, 1/4" plate, and powder coated black. He did not like the aftermarket options of the thin wall 2" tube offered at the time. I guess previous guards failed on him like overdalimit said.

The Bronco was completely stock, Eddie Bower, leather and every option. He had (very expensive at the time I was told) dual wenches install. One on the front, inside the cow guard and another inside the custom read bumper that was also made by Truck Utilities. He used these to pull out his dock in the fall???

I remember talking with the guy at the time. You could tell was not hurting for money at the time (mid fifties maybe). That is when we talked about the deductible costs and truck down time, verses him have something in the front that would blow a deer to the side. He had a cabin some where up north and most times he would head up late on a Friday night. I can not remember how many deer he had hit before the customer built guard, but I know it was enough for him to drop some ching at TU. I even remember the guy coming in for serving with his Bronco. You could see he used this as designed and it worked. The picture of the truck I remember was hanging in an office and was tossed away awhile ago. If one crops up I will scan and post it. This front guard was crazy.

Yes, it was the sales department of the dealership that instigated the CYA.

[Valv]

Shackbash and Valv I know you guys are good

I thought I was better than Shackbash....

Just kidding, I know it's the other way around.

Anyway, my opinion comes from many years of hauling and traveling across the country, personal experience, and buying rebuildable vehicles .

I personally witnessed a direct front deer (mule deer not whitetail, add 200lbs to it) impact on a truck traveling 65mph on I80 in Laramie, WY towing a 32ft gooseneck with 9 steers in it. I remember vividly the exclamation that started with "oh.." and ended much worse, there was hair, blood and something else flying all over, When we stopped, my boss didn't want to get off the truck. I had to, and when I scratched my head and with a grin called him out, he discovered his brand new, $ 1100 Ranch Hand bumper had just splatter all over, and no damage to truck and trailer (steer were a little shocked up), he shook my hand (I had nothing to do with the purchase), and got back on the truck as happy as he could be.

On the opposite side, I had my wife with a F150 hitting an antelope, and body shop showed us how the brush guard "amplified" the damage to radiator support and hood.

Same situation on one of my Dodge trucks 1/2 mile from my house.

Now, go to any truck stop any evening and check how many have no grille guard, and the ones that have it what it looks like. That will tell you what it takes to withstand the hid of a deer.

In any case, whatever you decide to do, remember to be safe and not hit brakes hard (or nothing at all), don't swerve away, and try to just decelerate in case of a deer collision. Many accidents are caused more from people trying to avoid collision than the impact itself. Be safe, drive responsibly, be careful.

[overdalimit]

Well if a guy can't make a good informed decision with all that information he deserves to have a wimpy tube bumper that won't do what he bought it for! I feel we are all on the same page here now. A real cheesy gaurd may do more harm than good and a big beefy one will cost some coin but will be worth it.

[hondavxr]

I agree a lot with what you guys are saying. Trust me on this, those over the counter brush guard that you buy will not protect you from anything. Their purpose is for "LOOKS" only. Most brush guards on the market are made of thin steel or very weak stainless steel. You would be better off just hitting the deer. I have seen some instances that brush guard did more harm to the truck than the deer itself. Only the super heavy duty guards are worth even installing. But remember that the heavy duty guards also weigh a lot more, so your front might end up sagging more. There's always an up and down to everything.