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Moon Lake Refuge

Tongue and groove

21 posts in this topic

Alright, it's going up today and tomorrow.  Couple questions.  Is it worth trying to nail the groove or is face nailing alright?  Also, did anyone mix and match board to make patterns line up or did you just pull from the pack and put them up?

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I've always face nailed it, and I think that is what most do.  If I remember correctly, someone on here blind nailed it and said it wasn't worth it.  

With the boards, I've always tried to set the ones that have a major imperfection on the ends aside, and use those for under windows, above doors, etc.  The boards that have cool patterns get used in a more prominent location.  Other than that, grab and go!    

 

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You are definitely going to want to just face nail the boards, you wont notice.  Trying to blind nail is a total pain and you will splinter a lot of boards doing so.  What kind of wood did you get (cedar or pine) and how thick?  I installed the 5/16" cedar on mine and you are definitely going to get a little frustrated with the amount of waste you will have (specially considering how much it cost).  My wood came in packs of 8 and I bet I averaged about 5 good full length boards out of each pack.  There were quite a few with large knots that would fall out (can glue those back in) or that were missing.  You will also notice that only about 2 per pack are straight, the rest will be warped and range anywhere from a slight bow to a full rainbow.  Another issue to pay attention to is the actual tongue and groove, some of the boards went through the router and must have been warped at the time so they were either missing the tongue or grove.  Best way to attack is opening multiple packs at once and "grading" all the boards.  Separate them into separate piles for either full length useable, 3-6' usable, short trim, and the burn bin.  Planning ahead will save you some headache.

 

I used something like 60 packs (~$1000) and probably had to burn about 6 full packs away because of dump wood and have a bunch of scraps that I'll use for smaller projects.  Burning $100 worth of wood is way more satisfying than just throwing it away.  I would expect about 10-20% waste.  Nature of the beast...

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Good info thanks, I want to face nail but my dad is being a pain and wants it hidden.  We have 5/16 pine and got it all half off on the menards Black Friday sale. Putting it up shortly and will start wiring in the coming weeks.

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With a pneumatic nailer it is a piece of cake to blind nail it at about a 45 degree angle. Why do it any other way?

 

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1 hour ago, roony said:

With a pneumatic nailer it is a piece of cake to blind nail it at about a 45 degree angle. Why do it any other way?

 

Because 5/16" tongue and groove is really weak to begin with and you are trying to nail on the edge giving you less material for that nail to support AKA you have no holding power there.  Even going at an angle you will have a maximum thickness of 3/16" of material.  You can certainly try it but you will just get frustrated installing it and wasting a bunch of material splintering the edges.  Don't forget about the wood swelling/shrinking when the extreme changes in head that these shacks go through, you want those boards to either be able to move around or be rock solid.  Blind nailing definitely won't provide enough stability to make them rock solid so they will move around and eventually crack on the edges.  The only way you are going to get by blind nailing is if you apply some glue/adhesive to your furring strips first but then you have issues if you ever need to get to a wire behind or replace a cracked board (beer, fish, and buddies aren't always the nicest on things and accidents happen). 

 

If this was normal 3/4-1" car siding or hardwood flooring then you would be totally fine blind nailing it but doing it with paper thin 5/16" regular grade, soft, splintery pine is just asking for trouble and it will eventually come apart if you blind nail. 

 

You will be much better off and happier just face nailing.  If your dad has the extra time and he really doesn't want to see nail holes then you can always mix sawdust and wood glue and fill all the holes.  To be honest, once you get the shack set down on the ice you won't notice a darn thing around you, let alone a few pinhead nail holes. 

 

 

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Face nail. I tried to hide mine but with the temp changing it does shift around. I ended up going through the house and face nail it all after words

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Dude, staple the tongue. Harbor Freight has a pneumatic stapler for under 20 bucks on the right weekend.

Or HD has the worlds most liberal return policy. Do it the way a real pro would. Face nailing is for white color Nancies. JK

You wanna limit movement, run a bead on liquid nails. Solved.

Edited by JigSawJimmy

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I gave my dad one wall to staple, to be the decider... Fist few boards were a pain, after dialed in were good to go.  Can still see the staples just barely but looks better than face nailing.  95% or more of the first five pack I opened have been usable to excellent condition.  Need to run the wire for the plate light and throw up another furring strip but hope to make some good progress tomorrow!

image.jpeg

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Face nail, it's way to thin if you're using the cheap 5/16 stuff. I didn't have much waste at all on a 8x16.

Edited by Hawg

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I gave my dad the back wall to try on.  I'll admit defeat.  Once the stapler was dialed in it worked fantastic!  Not to much slower than face nailing considering we're gluing every piece and it looks great!  So far only a couple boards have been bad out of the first 15 packs or so and they look to be plenty good for cabinets or behind furniture.

so far the back wall and entire ceiling is done.

image.jpeg

image.jpeg

Edited by Moon Lake Refuge

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Also we did buy the premium t & g so that might make a difference in quality boards per pack 

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Nice work guys, any new progress pics? 

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Yeah you can check my moon lake ice house post for more.  T&g is done and starting on the bathroom this weekend.  Cabinets up next.

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On July 19, 2016 at 8:14 PM, Moon Lake Refuge said:

Also we did buy the premium t & g so that might make a difference in quality boards per pack 

MLR

where did you get the premium T&G? 

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What do you consider premium? The $10 stuff is 5/16 isn't it?

OOPS, just looked back, you used the wide stuff. Just curious though, how much did you get for $10? Is it 1/2 inch?

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It is labeled premium.  Less knots and warped boards I would imagine.  If other people are seeing 20+% in waste I only have about 1.5  bad packs out of 50.  The stuff we got was 5/16 but originally priced at 16-17 I think.  There is a different quality of the same board selling at 10 a pack but likely get what you pay for there.

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1 hour ago, Hawg said:

What do you consider premium? The $10 stuff is 5/16 isn't it?

OOPS, just looked back, you used the wide stuff. Just curious though, how much did you get for $10? Is it 1/2 inch?

Not any wider.  It has two sides, one has the line down the middle one doesnt.  Looked like the same stuff as the cheaper siding we just wanted a flatter finish.

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