How often do you vaccinate for rabies?

[311Hemi]

Just curious how often you guys are vaccinating for rabies, or what your vet is recommending?

[Bryce]

Pretty sure we're at 3 years for everything but lymes and bordatella. Will double check tommorrow or Wed. when I call the vet to get a current vac. record to send with the youngster to play doggie games. I believe most cities require rabies at 2 years for licensing purposes.

[Sandmannd]

I think Bryce is right, call your vet though to make sure. Do it whenever they say to. It's not that expensive and should be done for all your pets.

[LABS4ME]

Rabies? I do every 3 years... as required by the law.

7-way dog vaccine? I only do till 2 years of age and another booster at 6. A lot of what I've read says to not even do the booster... The vaccination and immuniztions are cancelling each other out. Much of what I've read said we are over vaccinating our dogs.

Lyme vaccine... I just started back on this last year after 12 years of not using the old vaccine, Muriel came out with a 'new' way of vaccinating... Instead of a live cell bacterin trying to produce immunity which was the common way (and not successful way) of vaccinating your dog, they have succeeded in a vaccine that causes the dog to produce an outer cell protein (OSP A)which when ingested by the tick, kills the Lyme bacteria while still in the tick before it's transferred to the pet. I'll do this every year. Will also probably vaccinate for Anaplasmosis.

Bordatella when needed.

What ya' got for us 311?

Good Luck!

Ken

[311Hemi]

 Originally Posted By: LABS4ME

Much of what I've read said we are over vaccinating our dogs.

Mainly I was wondering what other vets in MN are recommending for rabies, but overall I am trying to determine more on exactly what you stated above! There are some good posts on some other boards I frequent with a lot of info, just trying to sift through it all and make sense of it. My current vet office says that my dog is due for rabies this year which is only the 2nd year of a tri-annual recommendation by the manufacturer (I still need to speak with the actual Dr. confirm). I am wondering why if they would do that if the recommended standard is a 3 year vaccine (unless needed by law). The National Association of State Public Health Veterinarians’ Compendium of Animal Rabies Prevention and Control, 2007 states that: “No laboratory or epidemiologic data exist to support the annual or biennial administration of 3- or 4-year vaccines following the initial series.”

I just don't want to be paying for and subjecting my dog to vaccinations that are not needed, and am just starting to look into all of this.

Also, challenge studies have shown distemper/parvo vaccinations to have a duration of immunity of 7 years (5 years for Onderstepoort), yet my vet recommends annual vaccinations. I need to ask them why (I assume because the label state a recommendation of annual based on historical info, not scientific).

Ken, what is in the 7-way vaccine?

My dog currently gets:

-Rabies: 2 years

-Distemper/Parvo: 1 year

-Lepto 4-way: 1 year

-Bordetella: 1 year

-Lyme: 1 year

-Frontline: 7-8 months/year

-Heartguard: 7-8 months/year, but looking to start giving Ivermectin in a 1% solution which would equate to a .018ml of the solution for a 67lb dog. Each Heartguard chewable tablet has 272mcg of Ivermectin (for the 51lb-100lb dog size), which equals about .027ml of the 1% solution (NOT paste).

Taken from a post on another forum:

 Quote:

Table 1: Minimum Duration of Immunity for Canine Vaccines

Vaccine Minimum Duration Methods Used to

Of Immunity Determine Immunity

Canine Distemper Virus (CDV)

Rockborn Strain 7 years/15 years challenge/serology

Onderstepoort Strain 5 years/9 years challenge/serology

Canine Adenovirus-2 (CAV-2) 7 years/9 years challenge-CAV-1/serology

Canine Parvovirus-2 (CPV-2) 7 years challenge/serology

Canine Rabies 3 years/7 years challenge/serology

Data from Duration of Immunity to Canine Vaccines: What we know and Don’t Know by Dr. Ronald D. Schultz, Professor and Chair, Department of Pathobiological Sciences at the University of Wisconsin School of Veterinary Medicine.

Note: Challenge studies are those in which an animal is vaccinated, isolated for a number of years, and then injected with high doses of virulent virus to test its immunity to disease. Serology is the method of counting antibody levels in the blood to determine an animal’s immunity.

[LABS4ME]

The 7-way vaccine is your parvo/distemper/lepto(s)... solo-ject vaccine. It has 7 vaccines in it. I usually administer the 4 puppy vaccinations, one at a year and another at 2 and then I did one at 6 or 7, but have since been pondering if I'll continue on that route or not. I amy cancel the one at 2 or the one at 6-7 after more research.

I've read some of what you've posted and plain and simple pet vaccinations is a multi-billion dollar industry... the general answer is "you may not need it every year, but it won't hurt". I don't believe that. I have a son who has a vaccine injury and I believe in the minimum amount of vaccinations and not the maximum. They are finding many reasons why over vaccinating is detrimental and I will not subject my dogs to this. And no it's not price induced... I buy and administer my own vaccines (less the rabies) and it is only a few dollars per vaccination... I just choose to let their immunity build up and not cancel out those memory cells and to be subjected to another vaccine and possibly weaken the overall ability for the dog to fight off the disease.

Good Luck!

Ken

[311Hemi]

 Originally Posted By: LABS4ME

I've read some of what you've posted and plain and simple pet vaccinations is a multi-billion dollar industry... the general answer is "you may not need it every year, but it won't hurt". I don't believe that. I have a son who has a vaccine injury and I believe in the minimum amount of vaccinations and not the maximum. They are finding many reasons why over vaccinating is detrimental and I will not subject my dogs to this. And no it's not price induced... I buy and administer my own vaccines (less the rabies) and it is only a few dollars per vaccination... I just choose to let their immunity build up and not cancel out those memory cells and to be subjected to another vaccine and possibly weaken the overall ability for the dog to fight off the disease.

Thanks for the info on the 7-way vaccine, thats what I suspected.

This is exactly along the lines of my current thinking, although I just recently started looking into this subject. My vaccinations are not due until this fall....so I have plenty of time research.

[germanshorthairs]

311, I have been giving my dogs the ivomec(ivermectin)1% injectable stuff for about a year now. I was hesitant at first(because if you ask a vet about it they don't recommend it because they are losing money over it) but not after I researched. I give it to them year round so no need to even have them tested for heartworm every year. I know guys that give there shorthairs 1 cc a month and have never had any problems. That seems like a lot more than the 272mcg(on the heartguard label) but they have been doing it for years and there dogs are great. I give mine .5cc a month and no problems. I put it on a piece of bread and make sure that they eat it. If you type in (hartz valley kennels heartguard) in a yahoo search there is more info for you. Just this alone will save you a bunch!

[311Hemi]

GS, thats good to hear. My next step is going to purchase it sometime soon. I have a few heartguard tablets left to use up until then.

Here is a good post I found that would be worth reading through. I have heard of others giving .1 ml or .5 ml with no ill effect....but this post describes in detail the dosing for dogs. There was a vet tech on anther site that also gave these same recommendations, may be worth going over with your vet:

 Quote:

"This addresses the issue of correct monthly dosage of Ivomec (1% ivermectin) solution for PREVENTION of heartworms in dogs. It is not about the much higher dosages of ivermectin required to treat canine intestinal worms or external parasites.

First, some abbreviations used in this post, posts by others, and on websites containing heartworm and ivermectin information:

-one gram = one thousand milligrams = 1,000 mg

-one gram = one million micrograms = 1,000,000 mcg = 1,000,000 ug

-one thousand grams = one kilogram = 1 kg = 2.20462 pounds

-one liter = one thousand milliters = 1000 mL

-one milliter = 1 mL = almost exactly 1 cc (cubic centimeter)

From several websites, including ones that have Freedom Of Information copies of the original ivermectin clinical trials, the recommended dosage rate of ivermectin for PREVENTION of heartworms in dogs is 6mcg/kg.

That's SIX micrograms of ivermectin per kilogram of dog.

The datasheet that came with the bottle of 1% (one percent) sterile solution of Ivomec bought from a local feed store indicates that if given to CATTLE at a rate of 1mL/110lb (one milliliter of solution per one hundred ten pounds of animal), that the CATTLE would receive a dosage rate of 200mcg/kg.

That's TWO HUNDRED micrograms of ivermectin per kilogram of cow, bull, calf, etc., or 33.333 times the dosage rate appropriate for dogs.

Therefore, to calculate the amount of 1% (one percent) solution to give to my dogs I had to reduce the 1mL/110lb of cattle down to 0.030mL/110lb (three hundredths of one milliliter of Ivomec [1% ivermectin] solution per one hundred ten pounds) of dog.

So "Lady", who weighs about 55 (fifty-five) pounds, needs 0.015mL (one and one-half hundredths of a milliliter) of 1% Ivomec solution each month. I have read that Ivomec is also available in 0.27% solution, which would be easier to dose accurately. "Lady" would need the easier-to-measure 0.056mL (5.6 hundredths of a milliliter) of the 0.27% Ivomec solution.

The same answer to the dosage question can be achieved another way. The Ivomec (1% ivermectin solution) label states in two places that each mL of Ivomec contains 10 mg of ivermectin. 10 mg (milligrams) equals 10,000 mcg or ug (micrograms). The correct dosage is only SIX mcg per kg (kilogram) of dog. That's six mcg per 2.20462 pounds of dog. So the 55 pound "Lady" mentioned above would need (6/10,000) X (55/2.20462) mL or 0.015 mL of the 1% variety of Ivomec each month.

The pharmacy in the local Wal-Mart Supercenter sells tiny disposable applicators (like syringes without needles) that hold only one milliliter of solution, with a graduation for each hundredth of a milliliter (Update: the last batch I bought of this same brand of applicator has half as many graduations, one for each two hundredths of a milliliter). Removing one of these plastic applicators and the 1% Ivomec solution from my refrigerator (where I keep both stored), I found during the first test that 23 actual free-fall drops (as opposed to the unreliable "dps" graduation scale included on some of the aforementioned applicators) equaled 0.61mL of solution, and during the second test that 33 free-fall drops equaled 0.91mL of solution. Using the total of 56 free-fall drops being equal to 1.52mL, each one of those drops of 1% Ivomec calculated to be 0.0271428mL. Comparing this amount to the desired dosage of 0.0300000mL of 1% Ivomec solution per 110 pounds of dog (see paragraph seven, above), each one of those particular drops was therefore the correct amount to give to a dog weighing 99.5 pounds.

Keep in mind that free-fall drops can be different sizes. Volume contained in each drop of 1% Ivomec is affected by temperature of the solution, temperature of the applicator, applicator material (plastic versus glass), how clean or dirty the applicator is, and the size and shape of that portion of the applicator which is close to the opening. For that reason it is a good idea to do your own tests to determine the drops per mL relationship, and to IGNORE any graduated scale (on some applicators) which claims to represent "drops" instead of hundredths or fiftieths of a mL.

It is easier for me to apply a single drop of 1% Ivomec solution to an absorbent dog treat than to the back of a dog's tongue. This also keeps the applicator clean enough to store in a baggie in the refrigerator, instead of throwing it away. I refrigerate the 50mL bottle of Ivomec also. I put the drug on breaded chicken patties after they have cooled to room temperature, to avoid any possible drug breakdown due to heat.

Note that a single drop of 1% Ivomec solution is almost a 2 to 1 overdose for "Lady", and more than a 2 to 1 overdose for my several 45-pound dogs. In clinical tests even Collies had to have an overdose of at least 15 to 1 before they showed any ill effects. However, it would be reasonable to assume that there are some dogs who are even more sensitive to ivermectin than any of the relative few who were in the clinical trials.

A Heartgard Chewable for dogs 51 to 100 pounds delivers 272 mcg of ivermectin according to the label. One kilogram equals 2.20462 pounds. Considering the recommended dosage rate of 6 mcg per kilogram of dog, this means the Chewable is formulated for 100 pound dogs, with 51 to 99 pound dogs receiving a harmless overdose. I keep this in mind when dealing with the difficulty of precise measurement of small amounts of ivermectin solution. "

[SoldierGirl]

There is plenty of evidence that we are over vaccinating our pets. If you do not want to vaccinate you should at the very least have their titers checked every couple of years to make sure they still have immunity. This can also be done for rabies in some states in lieu of the 3 year vaccine. I'm not sure what MN regs say. How animals react to vaccines varies from animal to animal. I've seen dogs vaccinated for distemper and parvo at 1 and 2 years and die from it at 6 because they had no immunity. Rabies vaccines for humans are supposed to last for life. I need to be revaccinated every 2 years for rabies because my titer is too low. I vaccinate my pets every 3 years.