Pentax and Canon Guys II

[Swimmer]

So...I put in some research online and really like the Canon 20D body...realisticaly I can get it for $730. The lense research was/is a little tougher since I want the option of going out to 300mm. But I found a lense like the Tamron 28-300 really lost a lot of sharpness, got soft at the edges, and had some CA issues...so, I think I found that if you want to get serious about long range shooting (certain wildlife situations) you will need to fork out some dough for the "L" series (PS I'm still not sure what they are refering to in the "Prime" lenses).

There are some interesting reviews of the new EF 28-300mm f/3.5-6.3 IS lense. Kind of the ultimate if you are only carrying ONE lense...but $2100.

The lense...the reviews were sky high...that I think I'm set on for the first one to go with the 20D is the Tamrom 28-75 f/2.8 DI. Very sharp -- rivaled a surpassed the Canon 50mm f/2.8 L in a lot of categories.

Dilemma. I actualy made the trip to Ritz Camera over lunch time and tryed the cameras out in my hand. The best FEEL was the Pentax! It was a little physically smaller than the Canon and Nikon, the LCD was huge, and the image through the viewfinder (what did mean in the viewfinder?) was brighter (kinder) than the Canon or Nikon (Iknow this is a function of the kit lense). So, now I'm thinking too much again. Save some $ on the Pentax/kit lense ($600) and maybe not think too seriously about super quality photos. Or go with the Canon body w/ superior sensor and Tamron ($1150). Leaning towards the Canon still, but the Pentax was a great feel.

[Swimmer]

Sorry, One more question. I can get a new 20D online for ~$740. The 30D is about $160 more...are the tweaked features worth it, considering the sensors are the same given the greater price? I think it would be cool to have the NEW 30D, but in a few months they probably will come out with the 40D!

[floating minnow]

Swimmer,

I purchased a 30D recently and I am very happy with it.If you can buy one for $900.00 go for it but I would be really be worried about the price since the going rate for the body only is $1400.00.Be sure you are getting the battery,charger,software,USB cord and video output cord.I highly doubt they will be coming out with a 40D anytime soon.

[Dbl]

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Dilemma. I actualy made the trip to Ritz Camera over lunch time and tryed the cameras out in my hand. The best FEEL was the Pentax! It was a little physically smaller than the Canon and Nikon, the LCD was huge, and the image through the viewfinder (what did mean in the viewfinder?) was brighter (kinder) than the Canon or Nikon (Iknow this is a function of the kit lense). So, now I'm thinking too much again. Save some $ on the Pentax/kit lense ($600) and maybe not think too seriously about super quality photos.

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One of the things that sold me on the Pentax was the feel and layout of the camera. I personally like the smaller body, and I have large hands. The viewfinder was another big selling point.

I don't quite understand the statement about taking lesser quality photos with the Pentax. The lens you put on any of the current manufacturers bodies will have a large impact in the quality of the photos you end up with. I had, but just returned the Sigma 100-300/f4 EX APO DG/HSM which has given me excellent results. My issue with this lens is a front focus problem, the reason for the return. There are many good value priced zooms available, the brand new improved Tamron 70-300mm f/4-5.6 Di LD Macro at under $200 is one that will give results you won't believe for a consumer grade lens.

If you want larger, longer and more money the Sigma (Bigma) 50-500 at around a $1000 has good reputation. If you go with primes (fixed focal length, not telephotos) you can find excellent values that take wonderful photos. Speed in a lens is what drives up the cost. Wildlife shooting doesn't generally require the same fast lens that sports shooting will require. This gives you many choices in both the manufactures lenses and 3rd party companies. I could go on and on of all the good choices in lenses but you have already started down that road, so continue searching for what you are willing to spend to obtain the results you want.

All said, the 30D is one great camera, I think the larger LCD 2.5 as opposed to the I think, 1.8 on the 20D, the availability of spot metering, etc make the 30D a better way to go. Steve, the Canon pro can offer you more advice than I on which is the better camera, but my choice would be the 30D.

Something else to think about is the Pentax announcement a day or so ago of the new K100D 6.1mp DSLR with SR (shake reduction)technology, the system does not require special anti-shake lenses and can be used with almost all existing Pentax mount interchangeable lenses. As the Canon and Nikon guys know this can give you almost a two-stop reduction giving you better ability to shoot in low light, tough light conditions, and more hand holding opportunities. This camera will be shipping in July and will retail for $699. Just over a month away, it gives you another choice to ponder.

Last but not least, be very careful about an on-line purchase from just any vendor. This comes from experience. There are only a handful of really reputable places to buy photo equipment on-line. A low price, much lower than can be generally found anywhere else is normally a red flag. There are some rating services that rate stores reliability that are a must to research. A couple of the sites and forums I e-mailed you will also provide users experiences with various on-line retailers. It really is a buyer beware type of world for on-line purchasing. I know you probably already know this, but for others considering on-line purchasing please do your research!

[Steve Foss]

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If you go with primes (fixed focal length, not telephotos)

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Quite right that primes are fixed in focal length. But many primes are telephoto. Telephoto describes any lens focal length that magnifies the image above what our natural eyesight does. So a 200L f2.8 is a prime, and is also a telephoto. A 15mmL is not a telephoto, but it is a prime. And a 100-400L is a telephoto, but not a prime (not a prime because it is a zoom.) Clear as mud?

And as for whether the 30D is worth $160 more than the 20D, that depends on how much you value your $160. It would be worth it to me, if for no other reason that the 30D is the current model and has those upgrades.

Also, LCD brightness on the rear screen can be set on the 20D and 30D, so even though it appeared less bright than another brand in the store, it'll be easy enough for you to intensify it. The don't come set from the factory at their brightest setting. The view through the viewfinder on the 20D is a bit grainy. That was one of the knocks against it when it came out, but it was one way Canon cut a corner here to add a feature there. I don't find it a problem. Even when I'm using macro and manual focusing it's sharp enough so I can find the focus. I don't know if the 30D has less grainy glass in the viewfinder.

[Swimmer]

Thanks again guys. The K100D does sound right...I hope they keep the same ~ body dimensions. Now I have another dilemma to ponder. Maybe the price on the DL will plummet with the introducion of the K100D. What is the DS model that folks in the forum (that Dbl intoduced me to) are talking about...from what I can gather it has more AF points and penta-prism.? I wonder what the K10 (10MP) will go for? and, any idea when it debutes?

Steve, I was referring to the brightness of the view-finder not of the LCD. I think the DL uses an improved penta-mirror instead of the penta-prism which, I think, is a less-expensive (relative to the DS model penta-prism) mirror...wow, it is bright though. I think they all are TFT LCD displays.? I did not get enough of a run-through at Ritz to really compare the other features of the brands...and the girl working there was about as knowledgeable as myself . So, I guess I will wait for the K100!? But still drooling over the 20D or 30D. And of course every day that flies by is a day closer to death (not to be morbid ).

The kit memory card in the 20D (and I think the 30D) is 500MB and I would like the 1G+ size. I also have tripod, case, ect.. So, I think I would be happy with just a body at this point. What else would come in a kit not mentioned above...cords and software?

Thanks again for divulging some of your knowledge...I know it can be a bore to reiterate stuff that the newby could probably find by searching past threads. That being said, new technology is being announced continuously so the tired old questions may still have some legitimacy.

[Dbl]

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Thanks again guys. The K100D does sound right...I hope they keep the same ~ body dimensions. Now I have another dilemma to ponder. Maybe the price on the DL will plummet with the introducion of the K100D. What is the DS model that folks in the forum (that Dbl intoduced me to) are talking about...from what I can gather it has more AF points and penta-prism.? I wonder what the K10 (10MP) will go for? and, any idea when it debutes?

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I actually have the DS myself, it was just after the D. The K10 or whatever the name will be, I heard will be priced less than the 30D and the D200. Just a rumor, don't know that for a fact, but my pennies are being saved for it. Should be out this fall, September or October, I have not seen an actual date. The body size on the K100 is not changed from the DS, DL and all the button layouts look identical, except the addition of course of the SR switch.

[Swimmer]

[quote

I actually have the DS myself, it was just after the D. The K10 or whatever the name will be, I heard will be priced less than the 30D and the D200. Just a rumor, don't know that for a fact, but my pennies are being saved for it. Should be out this fall, September or October, I have not seen an actual date. The body size on the K100 is not changed from the DS, DL and all the button layouts look identical, except the addition of course of the SR switch.

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"just after the D"...do you mean the DL? Am I correct in my analysis of the DS...having the penta-prism and more AF points?

The Pentax 10MB model also makes me drool. I don't want to wait until Fall...do you think there is an avenue where I could exchange a DL for the 10D (not even up of course)? In other words, get familiar with the "sport" with the DL and then move on up with the 10MP this Fall without losing to much ka-ching in the process? I'm getting ichy.

[Dbl]

The "D" came first followed by the "DS", the "DS2"(mainly in Europe) the "DL". I'm glad they are getting away from the *ist DDDD Duh and going more back to their roots with the K series. Makes much more sense.

Yes my DS has 11-point wide-area AF with an AF sensor point indicator. I believe the DL has 3 point AF. The DS does have the glass pentaprism, designed exclusively for its digital SLRs.

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do you think there is an avenue where I could exchange a DL for the 10D (not even up of course)? In other words, get familiar with the "sport" with the DL and then move on up with the 10MP this Fall without losing to much ka-ching in the process?

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I think we may see some used DS's, D's maybe a DL or two with the introduction of the K100-K110 cameras. That will not be good for prices on used. On the other hand it will be great for those looking for a back-up body. Most of the serious shooters will be waiting for the new 10mp model and keeping their old bodies. Thats what I am going to do when I upgrade to the 10mp camera. You could buy a DL and see what it is worth on HSOList after the 10mp comes out. If you feel you won't get much for it, keep it for a second body.

It is a tough decision for you, that is a given. You have to consider what you are willing to spend or lose based on a purchase now if you are looking at another purchase later. Welcome to the wonderful world of photography. Buzz I know started with the D50,or was it the D70 buzz? Then went shortly after to the D200(correct me if I'm wrong). He might have some insight on what he had to go through.

The good thing is no matter what camera you buy now, the lens you purchase will work no problem on the new body, whether it is Nikon, Canon, or Pentax. The thing I love about Pentax is they have kept the same mount for 30 some years. You can take an old "M" manual focus lens and buy a 1.7 adapter that will make it an auto focus lens. The older "A" lenses work like a charm on the new DSLR's. You can even take a 645 medium format lens and with an adapter use it on a PK mount. Many of the old screw mounts are adaptable to the PK also. With the SR feature on the body, all these lenses now have the potential to be "anti-shake". Whether this system is as good as the Canon IS or Nikon VR remains to be seen.

[buzzsaw]

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It is a tough decision for you, that is a given. You have to consider what you are willing to spend or lose based on a purchase now if you are looking at another purchase later. Welcome to the wonderful world of photography. Buzz I know started with the D50,or was it the D70 buzz? Then went shortly after to the D200(correct me if I'm wrong). He might have some insight on what he had to go through.

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DBL gets an "A" as his memory serves him well. I picked up a D50 in December and loved the camera, however aside from taking pics of my children my passion is the outdoors and I needed more shutter speed, the higher MP's didn't hurt either as it is basically an extended zoom when cropping pics. It's a personal decision for each individual and I went out and got the D200 in April and have been very happy with the decision. With all of that being said, if I knew in advance how much I would be enjoying what I was doing and what set up I would need to maximize that potential, I would have bought the D200 right away. It offers so much for such a fair price, I'm sure the new Pentax you are discussing will do the same. Like I was told when I got into this by Tom Wilson and Hobbydog... It's an addiction and you want bigger and better and they were most certainly correct.

P.S. DBL, shoot me an e-mail.

[Dbl]

You've got mail buzz.

[buzzsaw]

As do you my friend.

[Swimmer]

My Girlfreind just looked over my shoulder and wondered if we were speaking in tongues? Perhaps the "D" is being slightly over-used? [i told her you were communicating with pixels). Or, are are you guys (not ME of course) just passionate? Have a good weekend and lets hope our troops are commin home soon.

Myself, four (4) days off this weekend...hope you'all have a great weekend...WITH your DSLR's.

[Dbl]

The "D"SLR owners no "d"oubt will have a "d"arn good "d"ay! Everyone have a good, safe weekend.