Sneaking on Whoa

[jbdragon17]

I have been working with my 8 month Red Setter to get her ready for grouse hunting. She has been doing very well in my opinion. I am very happy, but have one issue. She sometimes starts sneaking in when I "whoa" her. Most of the whoa training I have been doing with her is on a barrel or check cord. She will sit on a barrel for 5-10 minutes if I let her, but will sneak once on point. I think I am going to next try setting her on the ground next to the barrel. Any suggestions?

[charliepete2]

I was against using e-collars for training for many years. Finally after some prodding I borrowed my neighbors collar. My pup at the time was about 2 years old and a really good bird dog, but I had some problems with him creeping on points as I appoached. I used the e-collar on it's lowest setting to nick him as he tried to creep on my approach and followed the nick with another 'whoa'. It might be one of those miracles, but he's never done it again in 3 years after one afternoon with the collar. I don't think the e-collar performs any magic as far as teaching a dog things it doesn't already know, but for a trained dog it's a hell of a tool for reinforcing what they already know, but think they can slide on. It just lets them know that you can put your 'hand' on them at any time.

Used right an e-collar can be a pretty handy tool and is probably less instrusive than a check collar. I've tried it on myself and on the lower settings is no more uncomfortable than being tapped with a finger. Guys who set the collar on high and stand on the button for any infraction are another story entirely, but these same guys would probably be kicking the snot of their dogs if they didn't have a collar anyway.

[jbdragon17]

I am getting ready to order an e-collar soon. I will have to try it. I would think nicking her after a unheeded "whoa" would be the way to go. That way she will think it was her fault for getting nicked. I wouldnt want her to think me saying "whoa" results in her getting nicked.

[setterguy]

If she starts sneaking on whoa, pick her up and place her back where you originally gave her the command. Get some paper plates, and start throwing them in front of her while on a whoa. If she moves, pick her up and place her back where she was. She will soon figure out that whoa means stop, no matter what else may be going on. And let me know before you order that collar, I may be able to save you a couple bucks.

[captkev]

Setterguy, Now thats somegood addvice, I like that paper plate trick... Now I can stop chaceing my hat. One more thing I'd try is a pinch collar on a long check cord, give the command and put slack in the cord, wistle clap your hands, THROW A PLATE , or even better yet have someone make the distraction for you, try and tempt the dog to break the command, If it moves give the cord a YANK. E-collars are a great tool, but Obediance should be done to your standards first, only let the dog move when YOU release it, tap on the head, back, wistle what ever command you use to release.

[gspman]

When using a pinch collar, in theory, the dog is supposed to administer it's own correction. I.e., the harder it pulls the more it gets pinched. Yanking on a pinch collar (or a prong collar) is generally not advisable.

The pinch collar is usually used with a whoa post. The dog wears the pinch collar which is tied to a post with a length of rope. I believe the collar is to be located lower on the neck so the dog will associate the pinch coming from behind it rather than in front of it where you are. The dog walks toward you and when it nears the end of the rope the command "whoa" is issued and the dog is slightly pinched when it reaches the end. It then stops and the pinching ceases. Over several training sessions it will stop when "whoa'ed" because it knows it will be pinched if the continues moving. At least that's how it's supposed to work.

[captkev]

Its great to hear all the differant methods I dont concider myself a pro-trainer, I can only speek for what has worked for me. I worked for a Pro for five years, and have forgoten some of the methods, so I've done alot by useing message boards like this, I'm shure the pinch collar on the post works great, is there any reason a pinch collar on a check cord wont work??? I have'nt had any problems YET, and it has worked great in the past.

[tomahawk]

Get a 20 ft. rope and a pulley,fasten the pulley in a tree about 8-10 ft. high,and run the rope through the pulley.Tie a loop on one end so that you can put it around the dogs belly.Now woah him, when he creeps pull gently on the other end of the rope lifting his back end off the ground.He will get the hint.Repeat this perodicaly just for a reminder.Works great for my dogs.