Lowrance Elite 7 HDI

[Chris Barlage]

I recently purchased 2 of these units. One for the console and one for up on the bow. The book that comes with them really does not explain networking these very well. I know both of these use nmea 2000, but what advantages/features will I gain by connecting these 2 together.

[CaptainMusky]

If you use the NMEA 2000 to connect them you can share information between the units. Transfer waypoints, display the transducer that is connected to the one unit on the other, etc.

There are many other possibilities, but these would be the most commonly used.

[Dbl]

You can share waypoints and GPS through the NMEA2000 network. Depending on your boat you may need to add additional cables to the NMEA starter kit Lowrance makes. On my ProGuide I spent about $120 to share waypoints. One caveat, when you create a waypoint on one unit it will show up on the other. When you delete a waypoint on one unit it will NOT delete it on the other.

I did go through some issues last spring after installing the units to my boat about one unit kicking the other off. As soon as I disconnected the NMEA network both units worked fine. After a long discussion with Lowrance tech support we discovered a bug in the software where the units were trying to find an EXTERNAL GPS source, not using the internal. New updates I believe corrected that issue. Mine worked fine all last season after using a workaround. As I mentioned I believe subsequent updates fixed that.

[Dbl]

I see Capt posted while I wrote my post. You can ONLY share waypoints and GPS data, not transducer information. You need to step up to the HDS units and an ethernet setup for that capability.

[Chris Barlage]

whats all in the nmea starter kit. One person at cabelas told me all I needed was the lowrance Ethernet cable to connect the 2. I figured for 70 bucks for the cable I can just transfer data every so often with an sd card if that was the only real benefit

[Dbl]

The Cabela's person is incorrect. NMEA is not the same as Ethernet. You can't use an Ethernet cable because there is no ethernet port on an Elite 7. NMEA requires terminators and power. If you want good information on setting it up and the best price on the starter kit talk to the good folks over at Thorne Brothers.

Here is what you get in the kit; 2-Feet drop cable, 2-Feet power cable, 15-Feet cable, 2ea. "T" connectors, and network terminators. It was cheaper for me to buy two kits than individual components because I needed more than 15' of run between units.

You are correct it is a lot of money to just share waypoints. Your method of just sharing memory cards is an excellent one. It certainly is less work than buying, installing and getting the NMEA network up and running. But I wanted it so I went to the trouble of doing it, its not for everyone.

[Dbl]

Also if your interested I do have some photos showing the NMEA setup in my boat. I will add it is not easy finding the correct way to set up a NMEA network, there is info on the Lowrance web site but it is not all that great. I also struggled because of the problems in the units themselves that I mentioned in my earlier post. All of it conspired to make my install a bit harder than it should have been.

[delcecchi]

If the manufacturers had used blue tooth or even ethernet instead of some bizarre network proprietary to the marine electronics industry none of these problems would exist. And only putting ethernet on the high end units is shameful.

But that is water over the bridge.

[CaptainMusky]

Dbl, sorry about that. You are right about not able to share the sonar stuff on NMEA.

I have my HDS units connected via ethernet and I can see waypoints from my other unit on there. When I create it on one, it automatically pops up on the other. This type of functionality is about all I really care about. NMEA gives you tons of other things like onboard diagnostics, etc, but I dont really have a need for that at this time.

Plus with ethernet its just one cable.

This wont help you since the Elite units do not have ethernet.

NMEA is a much more involved setup like Dbl says.

[Dbl]

Well...I can't say I disagree with you Del but these technologies were developed by the manufacturers long before ethernet and bluetooth existed. NMEA actually goes all the way back to 1957, though most manufacturers standards started in the late 70's.

As for not using ethernet on lower priced units, well they are lower priced for a reason. If you want the latest and greatest then you can pay top dollar for that. I think its good we have these options. I don't need to pay for sharing transducers or engine data I have things in place already that allow me to do that.

Also remember you still have to build a NMEA network if you want more than waypoint sharing even on the HDS units. To enable waypoint sharing all you need to do is connect the two HDS units with an Ethernet cable, (which maybe why the Cabela's salesman was confused about the Elite 7). No NMEA Network is needed unless you are using other network sensors like temperature, fuel, interface cables or an external gps. At least that is how I understand it.

The following is directly from Lowrance's web site explaining each of the following protocols. It may prove to be interesting. Keep in mind a company such as Lowrance isn't building units to only be used in the Midwest on fishing boats and pleasure cruisers. Their units are used in a wide-variety of applications, the main reason for using a standard protocol.

NMEA 0183, NMEA 2000 or Ethernet?

We live in an era where chartplotters, echo sounders, radars, instrumentation systems, audio-visuals inputs, engine data feeds and many other sources of on-board information can be interconnected to exchange, process and display each other’s data. It can therefore aid the decision-making process to understand the different ways that data can travel between the various units in what is generally described as an integrated navigation system. There are three standards currently used in the leisure marine sector:

NMEA 0183

NMEA stands for National Marine Electronics Association (of the USA). NMEA 0183 was first introduced in 1983 as a voluntary industry standard for data communications among shipboard electronic devices. It uses a simple ASCII, serial communications protocol that defines how data is transmitted in a "sentence" from one ‘talker’ to one or more ‘listeners’ at a time, and therefore cannot be used to create networks. Data transmission is slow by today’s standard at 4800 bits / second and the standard does not allow for multiple ‘talkers’. However it is still in widespread use and is perfectly adequate for situations where one piece of equipment, for example a hand-held GPS, is to be connected to another such as an on-board chartplotter where the user wishes to integrate the two sets of data.

Generally, however, NMEA 0183 has been superseded by the NMEA 2000 networking standard, although many devices are designed to communicate using either standard.

NMEA 2000

Currently the accepted standard across the international marine industry, NMEA 2000 is much more sophisticated than NMEA 0183 in that it allows multiple units to simultaneously both transmit and receive data. With the inclusion of multifunction displays into a networked system the user can then choose any combination of data outputs to be displayed at any position or for any situation. It is NMEA 2000 that has made possible the development of the integrated navigation and control systems that are now being fitted on craft of almost every size and application.

NMEA 2000 has a range of advantages over its precursor, NMEA 0183. The cables carry the current as well as the data, reducing both the cabling requirement and the risk of electromagnetic interference. Devices are connected using CAN (controller area network) technology and NMEA 2000 not only allows the transmission of data at vastly great speeds than NMEA 0183 (250,000 bits / second versus 4,800 b/s), but also in a more compact form, making it far more suitable for complex, multi-unit systems. Navico’s SimNet networking system uses NMEA 2000 protocols.

Finally, as a common standard NMEA 2000 allows the boat owner to interconnect equipment from different manufacturers.

Ethernet

Ethernet is a widely-used cable-based technology for transmitting very large amounts of electronic data between units of equipment within a LAN (local area network) and as such can be found in all forms of computing technology across every aspect of modern life.

Capable of transmitting at rates of 10 MB per second and more (versus 0.25 MB p/s for NMEA 2000) it can play a valuable role with marine electronics that process high volumes of data, for example radar, electronic charts and weather overlay information, and it is now common to find such units that now offer both Ethernet and NMEA 2000 connectivity. However there is no marine standard for Ethernet and equipment from different manufacturers may not be able to communicate with each other. In addition, unlike NMEA 2000 it does not have the ability to prioritise the transmission of critical data and so is not recommended for applications such as steering or throttle that require a near-instant response.

Summary

All three technologies continue to play important roles in the inter-connecting of marine electronic devices, and users are advised that they discuss their requirements with their dealer before determining which is most suitable for their particular needs.

[delcecchi]

Well...I can't say I disagree with you Del but these technologies were developed by the manufacturers long before ethernet and bluetooth existed. NMEA actually goes all the way back to 1957, though most manufacturers standards started in the late 70's.

As for not using ethernet on lower priced units, well they are lower priced for a reason. If you want the latest and greatest then you can pay top dollar for that. I think its good we have these options. I don't need to pay for sharing transducers or engine data I have things in place already that allow me to do that.

Also remember you still have to build a NMEA network if you want more than waypoint sharing even on the HDS units. To enable waypoint sharing all you need to do is connect the two HDS units with an Ethernet cable, (which maybe why the Cabela's salesman was confused about the Elite 7). No NMEA Network is needed unless you are using other network sensors like temperature, fuel, interface cables or an external gps. At least that is how I understand it.

The following is directly from Lowrance's web site explaining each of the following protocols. It may prove to be interesting. Keep in mind a company such as Lowrance isn't building units to only be used in the Midwest on fishing boats and pleasure cruisers. Their units are used in a wide-variety of applications, the main reason for using a standard protocol.

NMEA 0183, NMEA 2000 or Ethernet?

We live in an era where chartplotters, echo sounders, radars, instrumentation systems, audio-visuals inputs, engine data feeds and many other sources of on-board information can be interconnected to exchange, process and display each other’s data. It can therefore aid the decision-making process to understand the different ways that data can travel between the various units in what is generally described as an integrated navigation system. There are three standards currently used in the leisure marine sector:

NMEA 0183

NMEA stands for National Marine Electronics Association (of the USA). NMEA 0183 was first introduced in 1983 as a voluntary industry standard for data communications among shipboard electronic devices. It uses a simple ASCII, serial communications protocol that defines how data is transmitted in a "sentence" from one ‘talker’ to one or more ‘listeners’ at a time, and therefore cannot be used to create networks. Data transmission is slow by today’s standard at 4800 bits / second and the standard does not allow for multiple ‘talkers’. However it is still in widespread use and is perfectly adequate for situations where one piece of equipment, for example a hand-held GPS, is to be connected to another such as an on-board chartplotter where the user wishes to integrate the two sets of data.

Generally, however, NMEA 0183 has been superseded by the NMEA 2000 networking standard, although many devices are designed to communicate using either standard.

NMEA 2000

Currently the accepted standard across the international marine industry, NMEA 2000 is much more sophisticated than NMEA 0183 in that it allows multiple units to simultaneously both transmit and receive data. With the inclusion of multifunction displays into a networked system the user can then choose any combination of data outputs to be displayed at any position or for any situation. It is NMEA 2000 that has made possible the development of the integrated navigation and control systems that are now being fitted on craft of almost every size and application.

NMEA 2000 has a range of advantages over its precursor, NMEA 0183. The cables carry the current as well as the data, reducing both the cabling requirement and the risk of electromagnetic interference. Devices are connected using CAN (controller area network) technology and NMEA 2000 not only allows the transmission of data at vastly great speeds than NMEA 0183 (250,000 bits / second versus 4,800 b/s), but also in a more compact form, making it far more suitable for complex, multi-unit systems. Navico’s SimNet networking system uses NMEA 2000 protocols.

Finally, as a common standard NMEA 2000 allows the boat owner to interconnect equipment from different manufacturers.

Ethernet

Ethernet is a widely-used cable-based technology for transmitting very large amounts of electronic data between units of equipment within a LAN (local area network) and as such can be found in all forms of computing technology across every aspect of modern life.

Capable of transmitting at rates of 10 MB per second and more (versus 0.25 MB p/s for NMEA 2000) it can play a valuable role with marine electronics that process high volumes of data, for example radar, electronic charts and weather overlay information, and it is now common to find such units that now offer both Ethernet and NMEA 2000 connectivity. However there is no marine standard for Ethernet and equipment from different manufacturers may not be able to communicate with each other. In addition, unlike NMEA 2000 it does not have the ability to prioritise the transmission of critical data and so is not recommended for applications such as steering or throttle that require a near-instant response.

Summary

All three technologies continue to play important roles in the inter-connecting of marine electronic devices, and users are advised that they discuss their requirements with their dealer before determining which is most suitable for their particular needs.

Ethernet or bluetooth and some software would be cheaper than any of this semi-proprietary stuff. And the Elite-7 only came out last year, at a time when hardware for blue tooth and ethernet was practically free.

They really shouldn't micturate on my shoe and tell me it's raining.

But it is their product and if they want to differentiate the elite from HDS by not having ethernet, that is their privilege. Since NMEA is supposedly higher function, a guy would think that is the one that would be left off the low end unit.