Gilbert OHV area & MRR

[Dave]

Sorry to combine two subjects but it seems that any positive light on ATVs can't happen without an anchor attached. This weekend ATVAM (All Terrain Vehicle Association of Mn) will be having its spring convention at the new OHV park. I believe it was even mentioned here by some who are not thrilled about ATVs, that the Park is a good idea. Take a look at this Duluth article and tell us if you feel it's "A Sad Day" too.
I've been to the area, stayed for a week. Anyone I spoke to about the "Park" was excited about the opportunities it'll bring up there.

http://www.duluthsuperior.com/mld/duluthtribune/3160898.htm

[Biggestfish]

I like the MRR response about not wanting ATVs to be banned..... But they are against riding ATVs in a old mine pit. I think that sums it up, The truth is right there, MRR wants all motorized recreation banned. I would have to guess we should banned mining also, since that is what created the area in the 1st place.

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Just Having Fun!
Love to Fish.

[Benny]

Intresting artical.A point the MRR person stated about it being only a small percentage of Minnesotains is ludacris(sp?)
Any one care to join me on any Saturday morning at the intersection of HWY 65 and Viking BLVD. to count ATV's in or on trucks and trailers?A few weekends back on one of our false spring days, I sat there at that intersection waiting for the light to change, and counted 35 ATV's just with in the time it took for the light to change.ALL were headed north for the most part.Man these people realy think the rest of us don't have a clue, if that day reresented this so called small percentage, I sure would hate to try crossing that intersection if the percentage changes to a large one:~)
Thanks, Benny

[Guest]

"We need to ask ourselves, 'is this what I want to leave for my children?'" - Jamie Juenemann co-director of Minnesotans for Responsible Recreation

Why is it that desperate people always have got to drag the children into it? I guess they're the last refuge of scoundrels.

My kids love 4 wheelers and anything with a motor in it. In fact, I am constantly asked by my daughter when she will get a "baby" (sub 90cc) 4 wheeler like her cousin.

I will make certain to instill the idea in the kids that, if used responsibly, an internal combustion engine is one of the finest things in life. Anyone that tells them otherwise should be considered a messenger of Satan.

[Guest]

It is a "sad day" that ATV riders are crammed up into such tiny "parks" because the rest of the trails are put on hold due to environmental evaluations. The "fumes and noise" comes from over crowding any given area because no other areas are open.

MRR needs to face the fact that noise is a constant component of the Human species and fumes is a byproduct of modern man and his transportations.

ATV riders need to face the fact that if not ridden responsibly, the environment will be destroyed. There is no question about it.

Off roading needs more trails spread throughout the state to prevent over using of any particular area. However, these trails must be managed in such a way that the ecosystem is not destroyed (confiscate ATVs and fine irresponsible riders).

We're all in this together, whether we're for the environment or recreational upportunities.

[Dave]

Spike, any opinions now on this latest development????????

[Guest]

Benny,

I agree with you. Drive up and down 35E once north of the cities. I would say every 25th vehicle is pulling an ATV. I think ATVers are simply active participants in their pastime. It probably is a relatively small percentage of the population, but it's very active.

My question to the MRR is, what percentage of the population owns the proper equipment for bird watching, who owns proper hiking shoes, who owns a canoe that's enviornmentally acceptable (aluminum canoes probably are too noisy), who owns X-country skis, who owns...a little absurd, but you may get the point. It's probably a relatively small percentage of the sum population. Should we shut them out their opportunities to pursue their desires in Minnesota because they're not mighty in numbers? Definitely not. Why should the people who ride ATVs be treated inferior because we are not the majority of the population? I'm not arguing whether ATVs are have the potential to do damage or make noise. I'm asking the opposition, why should ATV riders be treated different than any other Minnesota outdoors user group.

Unfortunately, the opposition doesn't visit here to debate this. Spike, you're as close as we have to representation of the opposition. Do you care to weigh in? You're opinions are always appreciated.

[Dave]

It's funny how one "previous" board member (John Reynolds) from MRR stated awhile back, in the DNR Forum, that the OHV site in Gilbert was a good idea. And now the MRR co-director (Jamie J) states it'll cause dust and noise. I've been there. I didn't see any homes even close to the Gilbert OHV Park.

[kelly-p]

In my opinion MRR is against anything that they do not like or aggree with. In every dispute there is a middle ground, a compromise that is workable to all parties involved. MRR refuses to even consider that middle ground. ATV's are just where they are focused at this time. They will move on to many other types of outdoor recreation. We are all in their sights if we do not stay in their narrow view of what is "right".
Here in the Upper Red Lake area we are at this time "remote" enough that MRR is not openly here. In time they will be here. That will be interesting as in this area ATV's are a part of life. More people in this area own them for work then recreation. In this area with it's lack of improved roads it is often just as quick to get on the ATV to go somewhere as getting in your pickup.
What MRR refuses to see is that we all have different wants and needs and VIEWS in this world. But there is room for all of us if we just try.

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Waskish Minnow Station
218-647-8652

[Dave]

Kelly, any ATV rides in your area this year?I think you had one last year but I wasn't able to go.

[Guest]

Dave,

MRR's stance on the noise issue is not whether there are houses around but whether there is the opportunity of motor noise in the woods. Just because no MRR member is hiking in the park doesn't mean the noise from ATVs will not disturb beings (bambies and thumpers are what MRR is fabricating concerns about here) in the forests.

[This message has been edited by basshunter (edited 05-01-2002).]

[Dave]

Ah, yes, I forgot about those concerns, basshunter. That must be the reason we have a good deer population with all the "chaos" in regards to ATVs. Pretty soon we'll be hearing how airborne dust prevents critical mating of butterflies or something.

[SpikeRoberts]

Alright, you guys sucked me back in. How are you guys doing? Haven't been here for a while, good to see that things are still civil. Hope you're all as fired up about the opener as I am. Believe it or not, I think I will be spending opening morning on Spider Lake.

I've only got a few comments to make about the Gilbert riding area.

First, I totally support the riding area in the mines. I don't see any possible enviromental threats nor do I see any conflicts of use with hunters, birdwatchers, or any other recreational users. I've driven by mines near Crosby and those in the Gilbert/Eveleth/Virginia area thousands of times and have rarely ever seen anybody out there.

Second, I can't speak for MRR because I'm not a member, but from the way I understand the situation they were contacted by some local residents that had some concerns about the area being sighted close to their homes. I have no idea how close the riding area is to any residential area so I can't make any judgment about the legitimacy of those concerns. I don't necessarily have a problem with their involvement in the development of the park -- be honest here folks, the DNR hasn't necesarily treated this issue in the wisest possible manner in the past and it can't necessarily hurt to have a few watchdogs on sight -- I also support the fact that ATVAM was actively involved in the process.

Third,
Bornofice, I do have to respectfully disagree with you about the "dragging the kids into it" comments you made. I'm sure you want the fisheries to be in as good or better shape for your kids (I certainly know I do -- I have 1 and 1 on the way) and that you advocate for resource management based in part on that desire. You can't necessarily hold it against the MRR folks for wanting to preserve some things the way they grew up knowing them to be. That said, I certainly don't think that argument applies in the mine area, but it may in some of the state forest areas. I know that the Spider Lake Area will never be the same as I once knew it, but hopefully there will still be parts of the Foothills that I can share with my kids as I ahve known them -- I now know what a formative experience it was for me to be able to spend a lot of time in the woods away from the "world."

That's all I've got (probably too much). Hope I haven't ruffled any feathers. I don't see you guys posting often enough in the fishing forums. As I've said before I think you're pretty good guys and I wish we could chat about something we all agree on -- that fishing rocks.
Later, Spike

[kelly-p]

Dave, There haven't been any big organized rides yet. Most of us "old folks" are still trying to recover from a long year on the lake. There have been alot of people coming up to ride and learn the area.

[Guest]

Spike,

When is opener or Spider Lake? Do you think a Raptor 90 will be OK on this trail?

[SpikeRoberts]

Basshunter,
After re-reading my post I can see where the confusion may have come from, but I think we're talking about two different subjects I was referring to the fishing opener ON Spider Lake not the ATV opener AROUND Spider Lake. I can't tell you too much about that -- I think the DNR has a trail map and info on their site. If you go, do me a favor and treat the area with some respect (I'm sure you will, folks that care enough to talk about the issues are probably not the irresponsible ones that have messed the area up) and do your best to make sure others do as well.

[Dave]

Hey, Spike! No more peeing in the lake while fishin' either

[SpikeRoberts]

Don't worry Dave, I usually wait and do it on some guy's ride when he's not looking
LOL

[Dave]

And that wasn't mud you wiped off your boat seat either

[This message has been edited by Dave (edited 05-02-2002).]

[Ely Lake Expert]

I would just like to say that I took a ride over to the park on saturday and there was ALOT of people there. It seemed very well organined and smooth running. You go get a sound test and if you pass they put a sticker on the side of your wheeler and you are free to ride and enjoy yourself. They did a good job of posting the dangerous areas. They also went in and dug a mud run. On your way out they have a place to wash your fourwheelers.
The only problem is trying to get that red iron ore dust off is a pain. I don't know how many hotels are gonna want people walking around with that ore dust on them because it really is hard to get out of fabric. It will be interesting to see if and how long the hotel owners are gonna want people staying in their hotel that are going to the park.
The terrain of the park is great just cleaning off after is hard.
That is just what I thought about this weekends big event.

Ely lake expert

[This message has been edited by Ely lake expert (edited 05-05-2002).]

[pikechaser]

HELLO ALL==I attended the atvam spring convention in gilbert over the weekend and for the most part things went pretty smoothly.. I camped at the sherwood forest campground and Im sorry to say satrday afternoon there was a gentleman that wald thru and handed out a flyer asking people to behave and ride responsibly, due to many complaints...Unless people start to ride with some common sense I fear weare all doomed

[Benny]

pikechaser, that guy should get a pat on the back and a big h#ll ya!!!! I am glad to here someone took time to get the point across that we all have to ride responsably .
Did anyone get a name so we could thank him for going the extra mile for us?
Thanks, Benny

[pikechaser]

Benny--no I didnt think to get his name--it was early in the morning and I had just gotten up....I believe that the letter he was passing out had come from somone on the board from ATVAM....I attended their dinner/auction saturday night and the prez Sonya Bartz asked for all atv riders to really be on there best behavior this year. the way things are going we may not have many places to ride next year

[Benny]

I agree with you on that, the big dumb governor signed the bill against the ATV's.So now the DNR can ban any riding area or woods they please, even the county land that was not soppose to be included in the bill.Some Reresentative got the wording changed and didn't inform anyone about it till Jessie signed the bill.
I will just have to take my money to Wisconson and buy gas,lodging,food and suppies over there.Minnesota can have thier non money spending MRR people walk all the quiet woods they please now, just hold on to your wallet when the state buget needs more so they tax us all for it.
Benny

[Dave]

Benny, what Bill you talking about?