Hip displasia in Labs?

[Benny]

I looked at some puppies today, owner is not willing to give a writen garranty on the hips or eyes.He is not a breeder or a kennel owner, but the pups,sire and dam are all AKC reg. and I got to see both the dam and sire and they were fine.

How often does this desease strike labs?
Should I really worry about it?

I have heard some kennels and breeders as well as some vets require the dog be destroyed if they get the desease.

Thanks, Benny

[Labby]

Benny
I have seen labs with bad hips. First of all it is very painful for them and the owner. I would goo with a reputable breeder with a guarentee. As for putting the animal down I cant see them making you do that. I would suggest neutering or spayed

Good Luck
Lab

[gspman]

If I were you I would look elsewhere for a lab. If he won't guarantee the health then red flags go up for me.

[LABS4ME]

Benny, Read the thread at the bottom of this post. It's from the pheasant hunting/dogs forum, page 2.

AKC registartion has nothing to do with inherited genetic disorders...just means both dogs are pure bred; And guarantees DO NOT guarantee that there will not have joint disorders! They just spell out what will happen if your dog unfortunatley carries a disorder. If you really want to reduce your odds of having a genetic disorder, reseach the pedigree, the parents will have both been screened as well as the grandparents. Their are OFA #'s for both hips and elbows, as well as CERF #'s for eyes. It is also advised to get the third generation cleared. Doing all this still doesn't mean 100% of the off spring will come up clear, but it does heavily put the odds in your favor that they will. You asked how prevelent dysplasia is; In the late 80's early 90's the rate of dysplasia in SCREENED dogs was 40%. It is down to I think 30%, (still to high), but head way is being made. Remember this is screened dogs, how many are not screened?

Just physically looking at the parents doesn't mean they aren't dysplatic, It is hard to notice in young dogs or dogs that haven't been worked recently. I once had a female out of one of the Nation's best stud dogs, and she had a bad left hip. Clinically (x-rays) she had mild-moderate dysplastic, physically she never showed signs until the age of 10. Most dogs with the same rating would start showing signs at 5-6, but she must've had a high pain tolerence. Severe dysplasia can show as early as 2, but generally 3-4. I could've sold puppies left and right out of that female (to this day she was one of, if not my best lab) but had her spayed. Even with all her qualities I wasn't willing to pass down dysplastic genes. I never tell people to not buy a pup out of this litter, or that litter. That is each individual's decision, there are dogs that come from unscreened pedigrees that will be fine, it's a matter of what risks you are willing to take. Maybe you know the breeder and are comfortable with his dogs; Maybe the parents have OFA #'s and he just doesn't offer a guarntee...I don't know. If you purchase this pup, have it spayed or nuetured or at least do not breed it without having it screened. I think the AKC owes it to the public and the puppys to require all bred dogs to be screened for the most prevelent disorders in their respective breed.

Good Luck with your decisions...Ken

yetihttp://fishingminnesota.com/ubb/Forum61/HTML/000289.html

[duckbuster]

I agree with LABS4ME!!! If the dogs are OFA'd then I wouldn't be to concerned about the guarantee. When we bought our YLF this spring our pup came with a 30 month guarantee so long as we attached the kennel name to her registered name. If the kennel name was not there the guarantee was void.

LABS4ME I'm curious to know what the name of that stud was. EBONSTAR LEAN MAC perhaps?

[LABS4ME]

D.B., actually it wasn't Mac, Rumors of him throwing genetic problems are grossly exagerated. I'm not totally exonnerating him, but he is probably the most bred Lab in the history of the breed and with all those pups out of umpteen thousand females through a couple generations, problems will always surface. Different breedings using the same male but different female will have different results. But it's always the popular stud dog causing the problems never "my dam". But reality shows it could be either/or causing the problems or just that those particular dogs together brought out an undesirable trait. Unfortunatley indiscriminate breeding will always take place with the "hot" trial dog du jour. I have a six year old QFAA male out of Mac before he became a "somebody". I will only breed him to females that are CERF'd at least 2 generations as Mac has been known to have some eye disorders in his pedigree. You win 4 nationals and the list of girl dogs waiting to be bred is long and never ending...(sounds like a dream job eh'? ).

The dog that sired my dog was FC-AFC Sky Watch Radar. A dog which I think the standard for all labs should be measured! I bred my Master hunter to him in 1990. This was my first breeding after starting to "screen" my dogs. Problem was, it was when everyone else started screening their dogs also, and I didn't have any backround to go by on the other dogs in the pedigrees. Had some hip problems in that litter even though both parents were clear. Hence the cause of my stance on hip/elbow evaluations. It's not fun for the breeder when he gets a call about problems with a puppy. That is why I state you should go back as many generations as possible for clear hips/elbows. Dysplasia is a nasty trait that can be passed down from only one parent, and that parent can screen clear, but a grandparent of the puppy could've been a carrier or worse actually dysplastic and have a direct connection to dysplasia with the pup. I've since those early days started my lines all over with dogs that are cleared at least 3 generations back, including some that have been used in the seeing eye program, they are the most demanding in genetic standards you'll find. They can't afford to put 2 years of training into an animal then to have it come up lame on the person who relies on it most.

Sorry for rambling...I guess what I'm stating is choose a puppy with as much knowledge as you can and from a breeder who's doing his homework and will stand by his breedings.

Good Luck! Ken

[duckbuster]

LABS4ME I was just curious because he has been THE dog for a lot of trialers and his record is quite impressive. My little female is out of FC-AFC Blackwater Rudy. I agree with you that if you are going to breed your dog she MUST be OFA'd and cert. on eyes as well. Do you have a female now that has been bred? If so, to who?

Look forward to your reply.

[LABS4ME]

Currently I'm looking at a breeding of my two year old (if hips and elbows are clear, they should be almost every dog in her 4 generation pedigree was OFA'd), with a Master hunter, OFA Exellent, CERF'd with Derby points and several Qual. Jams and a reserve Jam (and hunted extensivley) who is a cross of Jazztime/Trieven lines X Piper lines. These should be super pups (intelligence and temperment) and really good looks to boot! I tend to look for older trial lines that have good genetic traits. I think you end up with calmer dogs with the looks and coats that a lab should have. I am pumped as these dogs may point...the trieven lines threw alot of pointing labs. I'm keeping a pup if this breeding goes, and hope that she points. The last pointing lab I had was the Master dog I spoke of in my last post. I put her down 2 years ago, and really miss that pointing ability.

Good Luck! Ken