New AIS law

[Scott K]

Quote:

I totally disagree with the fact that a ticket for non compliance will not help.

You get stopped and handed a ticket for a few hundred for no plug pulled, water in livewell or weeds on the trailer and my bet is the next trip you will comply.

Since a couple years back when they decided that the plugs needed to be pulled while the boat was in transport, take a look around and you will see how many will not comply. I was at a bait shop at Mille lacs and of the 10 boats in the lot, I believe I counted 1 plug pulled so it shows people will not comply unless they are forced to or fined.

Sure it will help. But so will not allowing any boats onto lakes. No docks. Lets shoot all of the birds, so they dont transfer it. Or we can just put a sticker on every bird, because that will let the other animals know they cant go from one body of water to another with out bathing.

I guess how much does the state want to inconvenience us, before we just go else where to fish? Or live?

[harvey lee]

So how much money will you justify that is enough to spend on this? Since it is a dire need to "slow it down" 1 billion? 50 billion? unlimited money? At what point doesnt it make sense? Just to slow it! We arent talking, preventing it, just slowing it.

We already have lake shore owners trying to close off public lakes to stop people from going on "THEIR" lake and spreading it. We are allowing the authority to pull us over, for no other reason then we are pulling a boat. We have the them crying for more money, because they dont have enough resources and staff to slow this down. Yet they arent very concerned about enforcing the present laws that were put in place to keep our resources to the level we want them.

I am sure that the DNR is trying to figure a way to stop this but simply has not found something that will stop it wothout hurting the resource.

In regards to one getting pulled over, if you have weeds hanging, you should get pulled over as you are breaking the law. Now, just pulling one over to check for something could be a different issue that seeing one break the law.

I have no idea what the max amount spent should be but I do know doing nothing will get us nowhere.

In regards to the DNR wanting more funds to operate. so many here always say, get more CO's out in the field but will at the same time say no to any increase in funding. I know of no business that can operate with the same funds they could even 10 years ago.

[harvey lee]

Scott, I see really no inconvience to this law at all. Simply comply, that takes a few minutes a trip. Unless one simply wants to fight the system as it appears many would rather do.

I think they tried to find a way to decal the ducks but it was going to cost to much to teach them to read the decal.

[Scott K]

This may be a little off subject, but I just came from fishing down south. They allowed 42 lines in the water, that would include trot lines, jugs, and poles, noodling. They also allowed sunfish as bait, gold fish, carp, they allowed cast nets to catch bait. And guess what? There was still fish, the water was still able to produce fish. Here in MN, 1 pole, no cast nets, no sunfish, no gold fish, no carp, no noodling, and many many other strict laws. I think it has more to do with controlling the people, then controlling AIS.

We seen the water patrol out as well, guess what, they werent out checking livewells to see if your bait was an 1/8" bigger, or checking to see if your plug was pulled. They were out checking how your fishing was. Giving you some tips to catch more, and helping you have a good time and enjoy the outdoors. Telling us to try this technique, helping us catch fish. Huh, who would have thunk, DNR trying to help you, not ticket you for something stupid, like your horn doesnt work

[harvey lee]

I have talked to many CO's in this state that let me know where the fish were biting if they knew.

I guess it's all in how one approaches the CO's. I have NEVER had my biat on the Mn river check here either for size.

Using your example, North Dakota has very few deer hunting laws and they also have next to no people and put way less pressure on the deer than happens here in Mn.

I highly doubt that the state you are talking about, Missouri I would guess has near the lakes or fisherman or women that Mn does and there is much more fishing pressure here. We have to compare apples to apples.

Well, at least I got a answer for my original question, that's do nothing and lets let the chips fall where they may. That of course is your right to believe that.

I am very glad the majority of the population population does not agree with this type of cure to any issue.

[Scott K]

Well I will tell you one thing, it wasnt for a lack of people. The shores were lined with people, about every 50 feet. The boat landings were full, and on Saturday morning, you had to park about a half mile a way. The landings probably held 100+ boats.

Yes you are correct, it was Missouri, I was fishing Lake of the Ozarks, the Osage River, and Truman Lake. No lack of people fishing there.

Oh, and I also forgot to mention, they allow snagging of paddlefish. Wich, the season was going on while I was down there.

[harvey lee]

There are some southern states who allow the harvest of 10-15 deer per person also but I would never suggest that for Mn. That would never work here and I care too much for our resource to suggest that here.

[Scott K]

There are some southern states who allow the harvest of 10-15 deer per person also but I would never suggest that for Mn. That would never work here and I care too much for our resource to suggest that here.

[Might_B_A_Pike]

Here is idea to help instead of complaining about what doesn’t work.

I believe that sportsmen in general should police themselves (not saying we don’t need DNR) but if sportsmen held each other accountable it could have a big impact.

If the DNR could get a percentage of fisherman to donate one 8-hour shift to sit at the public access of infested waters and “help” not “inspect” anglers coming off the water it could be a great help.

They could remind boat owners to remove the drain plug, lend a helping hand to pull those annoying weeds off the trailer all the wile educating the boat owner on why these actions are important.

If any boat owner refuses the friendly help, the volunteer could simply take some pictures of any infraction, licensee plate ect. And call it in to the local authorities or DNR

I realize that there are a lot of PA’s in MN and it would be hard to have all of them 100% manned, but if you could at least hit the busy ones during busy times it could help in changing the culture and developing better habits for boat owners.

How do you get anglers to volunteer a day out of their summer? I think there would be several incentives that the state could offer to anglers. I think with the inevitable rising of fishing license fees the state could offer a substantial discount or even a free license to those willing to spend a day at a landing. Or possibly offer a week earlier opener for those who participate!!! There are plenty of incentives that would not be any additional cost to the state, they may lower their revenue a bit, but if it lowers the cost of trying to control AIS it would be a cost savings in the end.

I know the DNR already has some volunteers doing this now, but there are not nearly enough to make a big enough impact, that is why I recommend the incentive program. Personally I would gladly sit at a landing for a day if it meant a free fishing license or an exclusive week-long season

[lotsofish]

There is a type of bacteria that is able to kill zebra mussels, and it's said to not have a negative impact on other aquatic species. I was able to find web results all the way back to 2002 about this. In Sepetember 2011 WCCO ran a story about this. You can read it online here: http://minnesota.cbslocal.com/2011/09/12/killing-zebra-mussels-with-environmentally-safe-bacteria/ This product was approved by the EPA late last year, and I believe they have started using it in power plant and water treatment facilities.

What the DNR should be spending money on is researching this new product, testing it to make sure it has no effect on native mussels, insects, and plants, and devising a method of applying it to zm infected lakes.

More info: http://www.mtdemocrat.com/news/bacteria-could-zap-zebra-mussels/

[TruthWalleyes]

Here is idea to help instead of complaining about what doesn’t work.

I believe that sportsmen in general should police themselves (not saying we don’t need DNR) but if sportsmen held each other accountable it could have a big impact.

If the DNR could get a percentage of fisherman to donate one 8-hour shift to sit at the public access of infested waters and “help” not “inspect” anglers coming off the water it could be a great help.

They could remind boat owners to remove the drain plug, lend a helping hand to pull those annoying weeds off the trailer all the wile educating the boat owner on why these actions are important.

If any boat owner refuses the friendly help, the volunteer could simply take some pictures of any infraction, licensee plate ect. And call it in to the local authorities or DNR

I realize that there are a lot of PA’s in MN and it would be hard to have all of them 100% manned, but if you could at least hit the busy ones during busy times it could help in changing the culture and developing better habits for boat owners.

How do you get anglers to volunteer a day out of their summer? I think there would be several incentives that the state could offer to anglers. I think with the inevitable rising of fishing license fees the state could offer a substantial discount or even a free license to those willing to spend a day at a landing. Or possibly offer a week earlier opener for those who participate!!! There are plenty of incentives that would not be any additional cost to the state, they may lower their revenue a bit, but if it lowers the cost of trying to control AIS it would be a cost savings in the end.

I know the DNR already has some volunteers doing this now, but there are not nearly enough to make a big enough impact, that is why I recommend the incentive program. Personally I would gladly sit at a landing for a day if it meant a free fishing license or an exclusive week-long season

All sounds great. But i can't help but remember that my boat will transfer at least 3-5 gallons of lake water reguardless of pulling the plug, or removing weeds, etc...Should i police myself and dump the boat in a scrap yard?!? Seems like a good solution...except i'm only 1 boat of MANY who also transfer lake water reguardless of removing the drain plug.

Great, Pull weeds, Pull the plug...but your not stopping the transfer. Just making it less obvious.

[reinhard1]

still no answer to this question. should the sea lamprey's in the great lakes be left alone or should they be "controled" as they are now? they are a invasive species. there are studies as we speak being done in many states to find ways to "control" or eliminate invasive species. there were studies taken prior to finding the chemical to control lamprey's. was that a waste of money? doing nothing certainly is not the answer. there is nothing i will do this year that i havent done for years. these new regs do not change anything for me as far as fishing nor will they be a problem as far as time if i get checked. good luck.

[harvey lee]

There is a type of bacteria that is able to kill zebra mussels, and it's said to not have a negative impact on other aquatic species. I was able to find web results all the way back to 2002 about this. In Sepetember 2011 WCCO ran a story about this. You can read it online here: http://minnesota.cbslocal.com/2011/09/12/killing-zebra-mussels-with-environmentally-safe-bacteria/ This product was approved by the EPA late last year, and I believe they have started using it in power plant and water treatment facilities.

What the DNR should be spending money on is researching this new product, testing it to make sure it has no effect on native mussels, insects, and plants, and devising a method of applying it to zm infected lakes.

More info: http://www.mtdemocrat.com/news/bacteria-could-zap-zebra-mussels/

How do we know that they are not studing this or for that matter tersting it in one of the lakes or ponds in the state?

[harvey lee]

Scott, I was not talking overharvesting anything, I was addressing the issue of different regs for different states as they all have different situations unite to thier state.

As with all laws, follow thr rules and there will be no fine, break them and there will be.

I do not believe anyone wants to chop your head off. This sounds more like silly town.

If you speed all the time and get speeding tickets you will also get fined. I am sure that will also slow one down unless they do not care what they pay for fines or insurance. Same time.

[Kyhl]

That's exactly what I was asking, if you are thinking there is a better way and maybe there is, what would that be??

The reason for this post was to ask, what is a better solution to this, not why you do not like it.

[harvey lee]

Kyhl, I may have missed soemthing in your post. Didn't you say to have more friendly people at the landings? My reply was they are going to have people there to inform one about this new law that takes place in August of 2014 and are now informing people at the landing of such laws and noone will get fined until after the August 2014 date.

I guess they could have passsed this law, put it in place right away as of now and if you had not heard about it, fined you. But, they are not doing that at all. Trying to make sure all are aware of this before one could possibly get a citation. I thought that was nice of them to at least give us some time to make sure all know and have time to comply by taking 2 minutes to have the boat ready for the road legally.

As far as the probable cause to stop one, I am not a lawyer so I could not discuss that with any knowledge. I am sure someone will see that it is tested in the state Supreme Court for legality.

Rh1, no one will reply to your lamprey question.

[BobT]

Quote:

As most know, I have been very pro on the trying to stop or slow this stuff in our lakes and rivers which would benefit all of us who use the water and for the people who will also enjoy them in the future. I would say I believe we would all want our resources to stay as clean as possible for future generations.

Quote:

I think we have to get off the sticker as a reason not to try and control or stop the AIS.

With all due respect Harvey, it's statements like these that impede good discussion and honest exchange. You assume that because some of us are not in favor of the stickers, road side checks, or other ideas we are ultimately against doing anything at all or perhaps even in denial that a problem exists at all.

I hope I can say this loudly and clearly enough to be understood. THAT ATTITUDE IS SO WAY OFF THE MARK AND ONLY SERVES TO WIDEN THE GAP BETWEEN THOSE OF US ON OPPOSITE SIDES OF THE FENCE!

[Kyhl]

Harvey Lee, We are on the same page as to more people at the landing.

My only change was to skip printing stickers and use that money to hire another person for another landing.

I would not mind seeing more tickets written for real violations. Lack of a sticker is not a real violation. Transporting AIS would be a real violation. As far as I know, that is already against the law. All they need to do is enforce the current laws.

The problem with this is manpower. Hence my suggestion, skip the sticker and hire someone instead.

I am aware of the new rules. My sticker is mounted inside the lid of my rod locker. I see it every time I change presentations. No one else has to see it unless they ask.

[BobT]

Quote:

I guess they could have passsed this law, put it in place right away as of now and if you had not heard about it, fined you. But, they are not doing that at all. Trying to make sure all are aware of this before one could possibly get a citation.

Do we have a sticker in our boat to remind us about every boating and fishing law that was ever voted into existence? Do we have a sticker in our car to remind us of all the laws as they come into effect?

Every year the handbook is updated, printed, and made available at all license agents when we purchase our license. One of the first pages in the handbook highlights new regulations. In addition, it is always available on the DNR HSOforum. If that's not enough then we don't belond having a license to begin with. Save the cost of the sticker and hire another person or invest in the research.

[TruthWalleyes]

So we're all ignoring the fact that the law states to remove plugs...minnow buckets...but doesn't address the fact that many of our hull designs retain water even if boat is tipped at a 30 degree angle.

Transfering is going to happen. If i don't take extra steps this year, i'll be a big contributor to transfering ais and i'll also be complying with the laws as written.

So the next step is understanding how to manage these invasives instead of criminalizing all those with boats...since once again...boat hulls are not designed to drain completely, and by completely, i'm talking about gallons.

[DTro]

You assume that because some of us are not in favor of the stickers, road side checks, or other ideas we are ultimately against doing anything at all or perhaps even in denial that a problem exists at all.

I hope I can say this loudly and clearly enough to be understood. THAT ATTITUDE IS SO WAY OFF THE MARK AND ONLY SERVES TO WIDEN THE GAP BETWEEN THOSE OF US ON OPPOSITE SIDES OF THE FENCE!

O

Ding Ding

[yonk]

So the next step is understanding how to manage these invasives instead of criminalizing all those with boats.gallons.

You hit the nail on the head.

Not all waters will sustain all AIS. AN individual AIS species need certain criteria to thrive and not all waters have these criteria. Some waters may support a small colony of a particular AIS species with out it being an infestation.

[lotsofish]

How do we know that they are not studing this or for that matter tersting it in one of the lakes or ponds in the state?

If they are, they haven't publicized it. You asked for an alternative, and I think researching a product that has been proven to kill ZM is something that should be done now when only a handful of lakes have them, instead of in 10 years when the number of lakes that have them is 10X the number now.

Preventing the spread is important too, but even with inspectors at every public access, the spread of ZM is pretty much inevitable. How did they get in Pleasant, Sucker and Vadnais lakes when boats aren't even allowed there?

Even if they can't completely get rid of the ZM with treatments, if they could keep the numbers low it would a lot less likely that they would be spread.

[harvey lee]

That is why I asked what others would suggest on how to otherwise try to stop or slow the spread of this IS.

No sticker will not do much of anything in regards to slowing the spread.

So, lets drop the sticker as far as the DNR is concerned but how do we do anything else to slow this.

I have seen, I don't like the sticker, I do not want to pull my plug, I do not want to be stopped and checked and I do not want to remove the bait from my boat. One even said, I will not do this as all I do is fish the river and never go anywhere else so how could I spread this. Like the CO knows where everyone fishes all the time. That cannot nor will that ever work. Not enough CO's to follow every boat around every day. I would agree that the decal itself is more than likely not doing much by itself to stop anything.

Take all of that away and we have nothing left. That's what I am talking about.

Yes, it is much more than a sticker being dropped.

So far, I have really not seen much for suggestions other than drop everything the DNR wants to do Bob.

That will not stop or slow anything and help not one bit.

As RH1 stated, it seemed to have surely helped with the Lamprey but noone will address that. No difference with the AIS or the Lamprey in regards to trying to keep the lakes clean on IS's.

I agree with Kyhl that maybe the savings from no decal could put a few more DNR people at the landings to check for AIS.

DTro, I know you are totally against this whole program that the DNR has proposed for law as you have stated in numerous posts that you do not want to remove your bait, pull your plug or any of that as I have read it numerous times in your posts. It's a pain to remove the bullheads from the boat to take home. I have done that for the past 2 years and it takes minutes per trip and I have had no issues doing that at all. Really a small part of the whole program. Ding Ding.

So, It's not just the decal, it's the whole program but I have yet to see you suggest anything to do to try and cure this or slow the spread.

As far as what the DNR is doing for testing of chemical for the stop of anything, I do not know what they are researching at this time but I highly doubt that they go to the press and advertise this or people would complain about that also.

Bob, the reason I posted this in the first place was to ask what else could the state do instead of the current program they now have in place in regards to this AIS. I realize you do not care for the decal and that is fine but even if they dropped that, then comes the biat, roadside stops or checks at the landing and so many are also against that. There have been numerous posts stating just that.

To be honest, if I am willing to support the DNR in trying to slow or eridicate AIS and that will come between myself and other fisherman, then so be it as I feel very strongly in keeping or trying to keep our resources as clean as possible. I am more than willing to listen to any better options for this and if some were posted, I would be more than willing to call my state rep or Senator and suggest such a proposal. But other than Kyhl, I really have not heard much other than no decal.

Bob, Dtro or anyone else, my ears are wide open. Since you say Bob that many are not against the issue of stopping AIS but you do not care for the roadside stops or the decal, what would your suggestions be to make a few changes to help with this? Please help me understand what else the DNR could do that might help slow or stop this issue.

If we could come up with a better option and all agree as much as we could, how could it hurt if we each contacted our reps and suggested the same thing. Maybe next year during the next legislative session, something could get changed. I am sure someone would at least listen to the suggestions of the people of the state who put them in office just maybe. But, we have to agree on more than just we do not like the decal or I highly doubt that they would even bother to listen to that.

Lotsofish, I will agree that there is more than likely nothing anyone can do to totally stop the spread but until we find a way, I guess I am more than willing to do what I can to help stop the spread or slow it by means of my boat until they possibly can come up with something. I realize that birds do transfer it and I will agree that it would be all but impossibly to stop that.

Ok, let me have it.

[Desperado]

OK, I guess I need some education on the whole Lamprey program

What are the express actions being taken to "control" them?