Shingles

[chad austin]

Timberline shingles are made in Minneapolis, Owens corning shingles are made in OH.

[K_Josh87]

Are they not made at the Trumbull plant in Minneapolis? Our packages are always stamped Minneapolis.... I know they have plants elsewhere, but ours have always been stamped from Minneapolis. Anyone know where Malarkey shingles are made?

[chad austin]

I stand corrected and you are correct Josh. OC does have a plant in Minneapolis. Malarkey is headquartered in Portland, Oregon and I didn't see any other plants listed on their HSOforum. Along with that I won't be ordering anything in the near future from U.P. which looks like they are the only "supply house" that carries them within 50 miles of my office.

[K_Josh87]

Thanks for the info chad, You had me thinking for a minute, and I actually called O&C on it, and was not given a solid answer other than there are multiple plants servicing multiple states each... In which case, if they where stamped MINNEAPOLIS, that was where they where made... SO, then I did a little more digging and found that as the location... So, Even though its darn hard to really buy everything local and what not, I try very hard to support the local hardware stores and lumber yards etc. rather than big box stores, I like people to do business locally with me, I will do my business as local as I can...

I have also done a little looking into the Timberlines, I may have them quoted as a comparison for one of the next roofs that come in and see how they compare, and go from there...

Chad, what are you guys using for underlayment? I really like GAFs Deck Armour, but its pricy, I have used REX Synfelt on a couple roofs as well and that stuff if a heck of a step up from tarpaper in my mind as well, but that deck armor material seams very indestructible, but I have only used it on one standing seam steal roof, and will be ordering for a roof we have coming up in a week or so...

[dougger222]

Dougger- I am not familiar w/those brands. Are they at the big box home improvement stores?

No, CT has never put it's shingles in big box stores as it's goal is to sell to pro's and not homeowners. There are some Lowes in North Carolina however that carry Landmark shingles but this is only due to a technical issue (can't get into it on here).

You can see the full Certainteed line at any lumber yard or roofing supply house. You can also check out the Atlas and Malarky line there too.

One thing to keep in mind is this.

Not all manufacturers warranties are the same. Most only cover leaks as part of the warranty and exclude deffects in materials. OC/CT/GAF-ELK all have good warranties while Tamko, Atlas, IKO, and Malarky are leak only warranties.

A friend of mine does well over $1,000,000 in roofs a year and had a customer with $8K in water damage with the IKO cambridge line after 50mph winds blew off large sections of his 5 month old roof. IKO paid $800 the rest was paid by my friends insurance carrier. He only installs Duration shingles and would never touch a timberline. He does A LOT of roofs.

[dougger222]

I cannot speak of the Timberlines as I have not used them. Generally speaking, as an issue that came up in another post, a softer shingle is more flexible and less vulnerable to impact damage IME. The Owens Cornings have done away with the 30 yr shingle, offering only a limited lifetime warrenty shingle, with 110 MPH wind rating, and that goes to 130 with a cert installer I believe, So, that tells me, if nailed correctly, they should hold up to 130 MPH. Stay away from the Certainteeds, and I have not heard of the Malarkeys either... Stick with something you know is good, and somewhat Local, I do not know where the Malarkeys or the GAFs are made, but, if you buy a shingle from across the country, and install it yourself, essentially it has ZERO benefit to the local economy... And I'm not one to be upset about someone wanting to do their own work, but sometimes it doesn't hurt to think about the home front a bit... everyone's out trying to make a living, and to save a buck, including the folks that do this kind of work, or make these products... Once again, do the research, use the product you are comfortable with, you have had great wisdom shared here, truly more than tradesmen should generally share. Take the advice, check out the products, and make your own judgement call...

Good Luck!

If you don't do many roofs what makes you think the Landmark line is bad? We do a fair amount of roofs and have laid all shingles and found the Landmark to be superior to the rest. Do a roofing forum search as recomended to the OP and find out for yourself what other roofing pros are saying about what's the best standard laminate line out there today.

Another roofer I know does about 500 roofs a year all with Landmark. His business is located in MN but he's technicaly a storm chaser. He worked here in MN in 08 and did a ton of roofs! By 09 he was out in CO.

Also,

There is ZERO truth in a softer shingle being better to resist hail impacts. This is the reason why the insurance carriers helped pass laws in July of 07 to do away with roof overs. The carriers knew for years how a second layer of shingles will be softer than one installed directly over the deck resulting in a higher chance of hail damage.

The same concept is true when comparing a house with organic shingles versus fiberglass shingles after a hail storm. I've had hundreds of 1-5 year or laminate roofs bought with real hail damage and have only seen a handfull of organic roofs with real hail damage. We're not talking granular displacement we're talking mat broken.

[crothmeier]

8ball - Im not sure who in your area handles Malarkey. Im down in the SW corner of the state. They have a dealer locator on their HSOforum.

Just to clear my statements, I sell Timberline, Landmarks, Malarkey and a few other brands. I'll sell what the customer wants. In my opinion they all are a good product. There are things about the Malarkey that I like over rest, and things I like about Landmark, and Timberline, ect. Service and companywise, I have easy access to my rep and quickly answered questions by Malarkey over the other two, and the warranty is a little clearer and coverages are better as well.

[crothmeier]

Poster By: dougger222

One thing to keep in mind is this.

Not all manufacturers warranties are the same. Most only cover leaks as part of the warranty and exclude deffects in materials. OC/CT/GAF-ELK all have good warranties while Tamko, Atlas, IKO, and Malarky are leak only warranties.

False.

Malarkey isnt a leak only. They actually have whats called a "your choice" warranty. You put their product on, and if you want to choose any other brands warranty coverage, they will honor that. Most people dont choose another brands, but the option is there. I think there is some misinformation here. I fill out warranty cards for/with homeowners when I sell a roof.

[8-Ball]

Thx for info Croth...points well taken. 8-Ball

[dougger222]

Thats funny the liturature that's in front of me clearly states all Malarky lines (Legacy, Northwest XL, Alaskan, Hurricane, Highlander CS, Dura-Seal 25, and Dura-Seal 20) are all LEAK ONLY warranty and the ASTM D3462 rating is claimed rather than certfied.

I've never laid them so can't comment much on the product itself just stating the warranty is all.

[crothmeier]

I must have a different warranty card from them than you then. either way all the brands discussed are decent shingles. and all of them just took a big price increase, and all of them have announced another increase for end of May beginning of June already. Steel is looking better and better all the time.

[crothmeier]

Found the "leak" terminology warranty in a different warranty write-up/literature. Learned something new. Mmmmmmmmm crow.

[chad austin]

All of them just took a big price increase, and all of them have announced another increase for end of May beginning of June already.

[dougger222]

I find it odd a manufacturer who only warranties for leaky shingles would copy another brands warranty that covers defects and even cosmetic defects.

This "your choice" warranty makes me think the manufacturer is to lazy to write it's own warranty to compete with the big three GAF/ELK, CT, and OC who all cover more than just leaks.

I buy my shingles from a lumber yard and my prices are better than any of the roofing supply houses and are good through July. The prices are so good in fact they beat the big box prices. A 2sq roll of Winterguard for example is $20 cheaper than any body else out there.

For the record,

NO ASPHALT SHINGLE WILL LAST 50 YEARS. There I said it!!! Even these 15-20 year full replacement warranties are a joke...

[dougger222]

I must have a different warranty card from them than you then. either way all the brands discussed are decent shingles. and all of them just took a big price increase, and all of them have announced another increase for end of May beginning of June already. Steel is looking better and better all the time.

True,

But steel will go up also. Although it's not got much petrolium in it (paint) it's price will go up as diesel fuel goes up which will increase transportation costs.

Alumium is said to go up so steel is right behind.

[8-Ball]

Yikes- I just checked info on pulling the permit for the new roof going on next week,, $250 clams! Ouch. Didnt see that coming. Figured $100 or so... Oh well.

[chad austin]

When they asked for the project value, what did you include? Labor and materials should be all you figured. What was the per SQ price that you gave them? How many squares are you installing?

[8-Ball]

Chad- they just wanted to know the total-they didnt ask per square. I told them the estimate I got from the adjuster. I suppose my honesty worked against me on that one.. Maybe when I fill out the info on the permit I will knock a few K off and save a few bucks, maybe.

[8-Ball]

33 squares, by the way...

[chad austin]

From New Brighton's HSOforum. This is the fee schedule for building permits.

Project Value: $2,001 to $25,000

$71.33 for the first $2,000 plus $14.42 for each

add'l $1,000 or fraction thereof up to & including $25,000

The math that I come up with is

$250.00 - $71.33 = $178.67 (this takes care of the first $2000)

$178.67 / $14.42 = 12.39 which is equal to $12,390.00 + $2000.00

Is the total job cost $14,390.00? I typically use $250 * amount of SQ on the roof which means that your roof is 57.56 SQ. I would make another visit to the city and see if they can find an error unless your roof is that big.

[chad austin]

33 * 250 = $8250.00 which should be the project value, the adjustment has profit built into it and profit should never be included in the project value.

Go back to the city and see if they can do something about the wrong project value.

[8-Ball]

Chad- I dont have the paperwork here. They left a voice mail after I told them our quote and how many squares we have (33). I guess I need to investigate/clarify further w/the city... Thanks for your insight.

[8-Ball]

Definitely will do that..

[chad austin]

I come up with a permit value of $161.46 give or take. Call your insurance company and they will email the adjustment to you.

[8-Ball]

I will. Thats a little easier to swallow than $250. I obviously got incorrect info...