Muskie

[Guest]

ciscokidz: I have read several of your postings over the past couple of months and have enjoyed many of your responses. I realize you throughly enjoy jerking peoples'
chains, but this time your remarks are inane.

Now to the subject. The only Muskies I have ever caught have been purely by accident and only a cpuple of them while fishing for yee ole water wolf. My question is from ignorance not stupidity. Because of their similarity in looks, forage, and tenacity, are they from the same biological family?

[andy j]

I never got a answer from my question above except for insane reply from ciscokidz. Get a life! or think about becoming a real sportsman. If anybody has any information about Mille lacs muskies would help a lot. Thanks AJ

[Guest]

Lighten up people! You sound like you want to crucify me! Or stick some treble hooks down my throat.

My response to Andy J’s post was obviously a joke. Notice the smiley face with tongue sticking out?

I am an avid muskie fisherman. I have never harvested or ate a muskie. I also do not fish muskie with live bait. If I ever inadvertently gill or gut hook one that I know will not make it I will harvest it.

By the way some people enjoy harvesting and eating muskie. I say all the power to them. We have regs for a reason, to allow for sustainable harvests. This is the way it should be.

Your beloved “sport” is in jeopardy from elitist “sportsmen” that put certain species on a pedestal. This attitude will lead to total catch and release regs for species (i.e., Lake Superior Steelhead). To me this is a shame and makes no sense at all. These are the same type of “sportsmen” that will catch an endangered blue sucker or greater redhorse and throw them up on the beach.

All fish should be viewed equally. They are some of the most mysterious and wonderful creatures on our planet. There have already been 22,000 species identified and more are named every year. Of these there are fishes that can fly, walk across land, breath air, sense electrical fields, create electrical fields, mask electrical fields to avoid predators, change sexes during life cycle, communicate with one another, give birth to live young, sense movement in water from great distances, smell chemicals, have no eyes, have both eyes on one side of there body, have not changed for millions of years, and a whole slew of other interesting adaptations.

Unfortunately we are currently in the six great extinction phase in earths 4+ billion years. Today freshwater aquatic ecosystems are some of the most threatened places on earth. Because of this, fish species are and will continue to disappear. Why are we in the middle of a great extinction you ask? Pollution, exotic species, habitat degradation/loss, and global warming are some of the big reasons. The biggest reason though is the 6 billion Homo sapiens that think they own this planet. Most of these 6 billion don’t know and/or don’t care that this is happening. Or in their own perverted ignorance they just say hogwash. A lot of “sportsmen” care about their species of choice. The rest they consider “rough” fish. They think it is a shame to kill a muskie, brown trout, and rainbow. These trout are not even endemic to MN and muskies are only endemic to certain waters, mainly waters connected to the Mississippi River watershed. Most lakes in MN that have muskie have them because they were stocked there. These stockings have undoubtedly led to the extirpation of fishes endemic to the system to which they were introduced.

So to those of you who say that I am not a “sportsman” I thank you. I am not a “sportsman” I am a FISHERMAN.

With all best fishes,

Ciscokidz

[Guest]

DLR,

Muskie and Pike are from the same biological family. The family name is Esocidae (pronounced e-sock-id-e)the Pike Family. There are several species in the family and all are in the same genus Esox. The Pike (Esox lucius) and the Muskie (Esox masquinongy) are the most well know to people. There are also a couple of species of Pickerel. The Pike is distributed throughout the entire northern hemisphere while the Muskie is found only in North America. There is a rare "silver phase" of the Pike that is still genetically an Esox lucius but does not have the body spots of typical spots and has an overall silver hue. This type of Pike has been caught in several lakes in MN.

[Rick]

Let's keep it civil gang!!!

[Guest]

Face it ciscokidz - you do a poor job of answering posts on this topic and other places on this site. Think before you post!!

[Guest]

PW,

I am sorry you feel that way. Your one post has really helped me out a lot. I will think about answers to serious questions in the future. I suppose you also did not like the reply I gave DLR on the Pike family question. It is just two posts above your only post. Did you even read it? How about my others? I initially was trying to spark a controversy on this thread that would elicit critical thinking regarding my opinions. If you read my post they are some of the most informative on this forum (IMHO). If you can't handle this don't read any posts from Ciscokidz.

[Guest]

ciscokidz:

Thanks for the information. That is exactly what I was looking for. Thanks, again.

GOOD FISHIN'---DLR

[Guest]

Some more interesting facts about the Pike family include: they have been around a long time (evolutionarily speaking). They are closely related to the Trout and Salmon family (Salmonidae). A diagnostic technique used to determine how closely related and how old (evolutionary) fishes are is to look at the shape and placement of their fins. Salmonids and Esocids all have pelvic fins that are found in the middle of their body. They are some of the oldest Neopterygii (New-finned fishes). The newer fish in this group have their pelvic fins located up by their pectoral fins (i.e., Perch&Walleye, Sunfishes).

There are many fishes that are a lot older (evolutionary) than the pike as you can probably figure out. Some diagnostics for this include: shape of their tail (anal fin) is it homo- or heterocercal, bone or cartilage, swim bladder, etc.

Some really old fishes include:

Lampreys – jawless, cartilaginous

Sharks – cartilaginous, heterocercal tail

Coelacanth - heterocercal tail, lack swim bladder

Sturgeon – heterocercal tail, lack swim bladder

Paddlefish - heterocercal tail, lack swim bladder

Gar- ganoid scales (diamond shaped)

Bowfin (dogfish) - ganoid scales (diamond shaped)

[Rick]

I'm looking at good deals on Muskie lures and gear. I will have them available for you here soon.

[jkrash]

I can hardly wait

[jerad_s]

im guessing ciscokidz is studying or has taken classes in the field of animal ecology....great posting kidz......if you really wanna hear people go anal about "kill rigs" and such go to any muskie board on the net.....that is what makes me not want to be considered a muskie fisherman.....dont get me wrong i dont like kill rigs either....its the attitudes of muskie fisherman that i dont like....granted there are always a few really bad ones.....but i think they can go reallly over-board on their views of absolutely, positvely, guaranteed catch and release......as ciskokidz said "they have regulations on muskies for a purpose"....and hey ciscokidz.....love your views about how the muskie is thought of as a pedestal fish.....what about carp....they get big and put up a huge fight.....

[Guest]

jerad_s,

Thanks for the accolades, but don't even get me going on carp! I bow-fish for those species-displacing aquatic-macrophyte-uprooting muddy-water-making ornamental-oriental-exotic nuisance called the Common Carp (Cyprines carpio). Which is really just an overgrown minnow species.

It's a sort of love/hate relationship!

[captkev]

Let me ask a question, this comes from one of ciscokidz replys earler.

If I like to fish for Muskies, witch I do. and have never kept one. But I do like to use live bait once in a while. Does this turn me into a nonmuskie sportsman just becouse I like to troll for them in deep water when they are suspended??? never do I use treble hooks and never do I let them have the bait for 15 min.

when most guys are fishing 15-20 foot weed lines in the end of july first of august, I'm out fishing 30-40foot of water with one pound suckers.

And I'll keep calling myself a good sportsman, and a Muskie fisherman.

[Guest]

Captkev,

I have no problem with you fishing with live bait as long as it is legal in the waters you fish. I would hope that if you inadvertently killed a muskie using any legal means and it was of legal size that you would harvest it? Many of the muskie mags etc. have pics of muskie that are obviously bleeding from the gills and the caption says C&R. To me this is Catch&Waste! If you are not sure if a fish is going to make it use your best judgment. If you release a fish and later see it floating belly up, please harvest it. Fish are wonderful gifts from our creator that we should enjoy with respect and admiration. Harvest fish so as not to jeopardize the continued existence of their genetic populations (this is what Fisheries Management should do). Think about the future of fishing and whether or not you want to contribute to the elitist philosophies that will culminate in total C&R, barbless hooks, artificial lures, etc.

[muskieman]

Andy J If you want early season on Mille Lacs focus on the south side as most Muskies spawn on the south side. They start heading north in the middle of June and are caught on the flats the last week in June and early July and do not arrive on the northshore until mid July. Last summer we caught many tagged fish and they all were tagged in Isle Bay and Twin Bay. Many of the Muskies were 15 years old. We are seeing many 51 inchers now. 4 years ago we only saw 2 over 48, now it seems the Muskies are growing over 50 inches. Mille Lacs muskies are very fat. In the summer of 1999 we caught one with a 27 inch girth! Good luck fishin'

[This message has been edited by muskieman (edited 04-28-2001).]

[Rick]

What type of Muskie lures work best on opening day for Muskie?

[GullGuide]

I stick to sub-surface lures early season. Bucktail spinners and in-line bucktails are good bets as well as large plastics such as a giant sluggo.
>"////=<

[DUCKJ]

I FISH THE NORTH END ALOT IN THE SUMMER STARTING IN LATE JUNE AND DO PRETTY GOOD. IVE FISHED VINLAND IN THE LATE SUMMER AS IN AUG AND LATER, CAN YOU TELL ME HOW IT IS IN THE SPRING. IS MY BEST BET STILL THE SE END OR CAN I DO GOOD IN THE VINLAND AERA..THANKS AND HAPPY HUNTING......C.A.R.E.........DUCK

[This message has been edited by DUCKJ (edited 05-11-2001).]

[GullGuide]

Duck,
I do have to agree that MOST fish that bleed from the gills do not make it. Think about it if someone sliced your lungs, how long would you survive?
Many of the fish that die we do not see. They swim away fine only to die later, sink to the bottom and or drift to shore long after you have gone on to a different spot.
If I caught a leagal fish and it was bleeding I would keep it, just because I'd rather harvest it than to take the chance of it dying and going to waste.
Have a great season!
>"////=<

Tom Herman's Gull Guide Service
320-260-8281

[Guest]

This will be my first year realy muskie fishing, and this is what I have so far,
a poes giant jackpot, a poes awaker, a weighted viper, a 9 inch suick, a rapala super shad rap, a pig, and a rapala... magnum I think? any other lures you think I realy need before muskie season opens june 2?

Ryan Bradbury.

[Guest]

Ok guys I need help. I am going up to Lake Wabedo on June 2nd for a week. I plan on fishing for smallies and muskies. I was up there last year and had one follow, that was it. Please help me out with this. Please, tell me which lures, and which spots you think would be best for this time of year. How deep should I be fishing, with what, what time, and where?? Please tell me which spot is the most consistent, and what type of lure works the best, thanks. I have only been fishing for Muskies for the past three years, and in that time I have had, several follows, two fish on, but have yet to actually, land and photograph one. Please any help would be greatly appreciated, thanks.

KEEP CASTING...

[GullGuide]

Osprey,
Sounds like you are about to contract one of the worst diseases known to man...MUSKIE FEVER!!!
Your lure selection is great...nothing beats a monster ski blowing up on a jackpot! Just remember not to work it too fast. The wider the zig-zag the better. I would suggest however to invest in some bucktail spinner baits and some bucktail in-line spinners. If you really want a jolt..literally...get some speed trolling baits such as Berts, Cisco Kids and Shallow Depth Raiders. Troll these babies 10-50 feet behind the boat and crank the speed up to 5mph. What a rush!!
Bass Freak!!,
I haven't fished Wabedo much, but at this time of year, focus mostly on sub-surface lures, mainly bucktail. I would look semi-shallow near the best looking cabbage you can find. I would also start fishing around 7pm and then keep fishing past total dark. If you spot an active fish while it's still light, come back to that spot after dark and try a jackpot or another noisy surface lure.
Good Luck fellow muskie nuts!!
>"////=<
Tom Herman's Gull Guide Service
320-260-8281

[Guest]

Great! Thanks for the tips. I hope to land my first Muskie this year, and contract one of the worst diseases known to man...MUSKIE FEVER!!!

P.S. by semi-shallow do you mean like 8-10 feet or even shallower. With such a long winter the temps might be a little low. What is a good water temp for them to be actively shallow, and if they are not up shallow, then where should I look? Thanks again, can't wait.

KEEP CASTING...

[Guest]

Muskieman, First of all I would like to thank you for the tip about fishing outside Fisher's and Castaways for eyes. Was up there yesterday and took many fish, biggest being 28 inches. All released except for 2 that we took for dinner that were in the slot. Now replying to your post on muskies, most of the time I would agree with you and still do, butttt!! When running into The Blue Goose Inn yesterday evening spotted a 50" or so in about 2 feet of water 4 feet from shore. Have since talked with 2 other guys that have seen the same thing on the north side this year. Wonder what's up with that!!!!!!!!!!!!!