Durango Oil Change - Synth vs Conv

[CJH]

I have on 06 Durango with the Hemi. Love it, its been a great truck so far. I don't do oil changes myself (haven't since college), so was wondering if it is worth it to go with Synthetic vs Conventional oil? With gas prices high, would it help me get better mileage (With gas over $3/gallon and going up, would I make my money back) I haven't priced it out yet, but I would think it would about double the price of the oil change.

Any thoughts/advice would be greatly appreciated!

Thanks!

CJH

[theoilman]

There can be a lot of difference between the different brands and grades of synthetic oils.

All should provide at least a 2% increase in fuel economy as compared to petroleum oils.

All will reduce wear as compared to petroleum oils - from less that 20% wear reduction to over 50% wear reduction - which will greatly extend engine life and lower long term costs.

All will provide lower pour points which means easier winter starting, and provide better high temp protection.

All will transfer heat better and keep the engine cleaner.

Only a few will provide extended service life.

But all these points are in varying degrees according to each one's capabilities.

Most on the market in the US today are 'Group III' base stocks - which means they are actually highly processed petroleum base lubes - all store brands, most oil company brands except Mobil1.

AMSOIL and Mobil1 are 'Group IV' base stocks which means they are designed and built on the molecular level so all the molecules are uniformly the same and designed to be a better lubricant.

Is yours a 4.7 or a 5.7 engine? The 5.7 requires either 5W-20 or 0W-20 - don't use a heavier oil! The system that shuts down 4 cylinders at cruise is very viscosity dependent. I have heard if you use a 5W-30 of losing 3 or 4 mpg, it may even set engine fault codes and check engine lights. The 4.7 prefers 5W-30 or 0W-30.

Specifics:

AMSOIL's lowest level products: XL series will provide typically 2% to 5% increase in fuel economy/performance while providing up to 50% wear reduction and an extended service life of up to 6-months/7500 miles which ever comes last, not to exceed a year. Available in 5W-20 (prod. code XLM), 5W-30 (prod. code XLF) and 10W-30 (prod code XLT). Suggested retail $6.35 per qt.

AMSOIL's 'traditional' family will provide typically 3% to 5% increase in fuel economy/performance and an extended service life of up to 1-year/25,000 miles 'normal' driving or 1-year/15,000 miles of 'severe service' driving (almost all of us are in the severe service defined category. Available in 0W-20 (prod. code ASM), 5W-30 (prod. code ASL), 10W-30 (prod code ATM) and several heavier viscosities. Suggested retail around $8.00 per qt.

AMSOIL's high performance oils will provide better than 5% increases with most reporting 10% and better and an extended service life of up to 1-year/35,000 'normal' or 1-year/17,500 mile 'severe' service intervals. Available in 0W-30 (prod code SSO). Suggested retail $10.10 per qt.

Yes, AMSOIL is some of the highest priced, but lowest cost lubricant available!

Many quick lubes and repair shops will change your oil if you bring in your own - ask and price ahead.

You can order AMSOIL direct on-line: AMSOIL On-Line Direct Store (I get credit for it if you use my links.) Wholesale available - contact me direct

[Shack]

Is the truck still under warranty? If so you would still want adhere to the factory scheduled maintenance intervals. In this case, It might not be cost effective to run synthetic yet. If you are out of warranty, by all means go right ahead.

Now, the oil synthetic oil guys have some good info for fuel mileage gains and longevity of internal eng. parts.

When this question has been asked of me in the past, I say do the research with the synthetic companies and make your final decision. Ams Oil is a great product to start your research with.

The one thing I have learned from working at dealerships for many years is C.Y.A…

You would not believe how many people will come back to point a finger, at the guy who told them something and things did not work out.

Good luck dude.

[Shack]

I see the Oilman gave you a great head start while I was writing my post.

He has got some good info right there.

[Jeremy airjer W]

A 2% increase would barely get you $10 in fuel savings over a 3,000 mile service interval, But the other benefits of true synthetic might be worth it in the long run. If you don't plan on keeping the vehicle until the wheels fall off then would it really be worth at least doubling the cost of the oil change?

[CJH]

Thanks for the advice/knowledge guys. Good point shackbash, as I am still under warranty, so no changes for me.

Other than the other wear and tear bennefits, it looks like the only way the dollar equation would work out, is if you could prolong the life of the oil and still get the 2% increase in mileage. I think the added bennefits are important, just don't know if it fits in the budge, especially if I am going to turnover the vehicle in approximately 5 years or so.

Thanks again, and please post any additional thought you might have, as I am sure this is something others are considering as gas prices continue to rise.

What about Nitrogen tire inflation? Same deal, is that worth the cost and how much would it increase mileage?

[Shack]

I would assume you have a lease?

Nitrogen is supposed to have some fuel econ qualities, because it holds tire pressure at correct levels for a longer period of time, regardless of outside temperatures and small seepage issues. As for it directly effecting fuel econ, it does not make the car lighter anything like that.

Nitrogen in your tires is mostly advertised for longevity of the tire and to slow wearing of the tread. It’s supposed to keep tires cooler than normal air mixture, keep tire inflated to correct air pressure longer so premature wear does not occur and you get a nice little green valve stem cap. Draw backs are, when your tire is low or out of air, you have to go back to the shop that has nitrogen to get you nitrogen filled back up (you can fill with regular air at any time).

The airline industry has been using nitrogen in airplane/jetliners tires for some time now. The low heat factor helps save tire wear during landing of the plans and jets.

If I where leasing a vehicle, I would not purchase nitrogen.

Now, you are buying a set of four tires and can talk the advisor into throwing nitrogen in for free, I would do that.

The other thing is regular air we breathe is made up with nitrogen. The machine that fills your tire basically absorbs nitrogen from the atmosphere, puts it into a holding tank until the right percentage of nitrogen is achieved. So, you are putting regular air into your tire, just with a higher percentage of nitrogen mixed in.

[Jeremy airjer W]

Keep your tires inflated to the proper pressure and check them periodically. Especially if the temps have gone up or down dramatically. Right now we are just starting the let the air out with service season. More air has to be added in the fall and winter and all that air has to come back out in the spring!

One thing I would suggest to help maintain tire pressure is having the beads greased. I have done this to every vehicle I have owned with aluminum wheels and I do this to every wheel I clean the bead on (which is often!!). Have the tires dismounted and apply a thin layer of bearing grease to the bead of the wheel and reinstall the tire. This will dramatically reduce the chance of corrosion forming on the wheel. No corrosion = no bead leak = no low/flat tires = saves you money! Repeat whenever the tires are replaced. I have never had a corroded wheel/bead leak on any of my vehicles. I have had plenty of flats!

Long story short, keep an eye on them and there is no need for nitrogen!

[theoilman]

The Group III synthetics provide economy performance increases closer to the bottom end - 2% improvements. With AMSOIL's PAO Group IV synthetics most report the higher numbers, with many better than 5%.

Also AMSOIL covers you for extended service intervals with AMSOIL's additional warranty. (Mobil1 extended service products do not while vehicle is under manufacturer's warranties, or any application of 'severe-duty' service - see their back label.)

Car manufacturer's warranties are paid based on failure analysis. If something failed in the engine under warranty they cover it. In most cases the owners manuals give you "suggested" or "recommended" intervals. The last I checked my dictionary suggested or recommended don't mean "required." AMSOIL also provides an additional warranty: AMSOIL Complete Warranty Link If there is a lubricant failure using AMSOIL's recommended guidelines AMSOIL will cover it. If using AMSOIL you ever suspect a warranty problem, first get a sample of the oil before the engine is torn down - before contaminating from other outside sources, contact the dealer you bought the oil through or contact AMSOIL Tech Services to have the oil tested. The oil analysis will provide a complete report on the condition of the oil base, additives, wear materials, water, antifreeze, fuel levels, oxidation, nitration and more. Most of the time the analysis will point you in the direction of what first happened. For example water or glycol (along with specific additives) will indicate a possible head gasket or crack somewhere. In this case, the oil would be a victim of the failure, not the cause. Nitration or oxidation being high might point to emission system problems. ETC....

[Shack]

Oilman,

I will start out saying, the chance of a failure inside of an eng. under factory warranty or even extended warranty is very, very slim.

The basic fact of domestic manufactures, is they have to cut corners because of economy issues. What does this translate to the average Joe who buys a new car? Well, it comes down to the manufacture putting more requirements and guide lines that have to be met by the owner to get large dollar repairs covered. The manufacture’s are requiring more and more info and records before a repair is authorized. Funny I say this, because prior authorization of a large dollar warranty repair, used to be none existent. Dealers used to be self authorizing for these repairs. Now, when things have been tight the last couple years, the domestic automotive manufacture has requested maintenance records even under the new car warranty. If the owner can not show maintenance records that follow the “required” maintenance schedule of the owner manuals, they have the legal right decline the repairs.

Now, you know and I know, I have been threw this with customers in the past. I will say the only time I have seen this issue brought up was with customers who owned 6.0l Ford diesels. Customers bought new trucks and the first thing they did with an eng. that holds that much oil, is go to synthetic oil, which lasts longer. When something fails, the first thing from Ford was to obtain the customers maintenance records. Per the owners manual, if the maintenance was not followed by the manufacture’s schedule, the repair was declined. Then the mechanics had to make depositions, and things would not work out for the customers.

I love Ams Oil. I run it in many things I own.

All I can say is, if you are under warranty and thinking of doing something different than the owners manual states, call your local dealer first. Tell them what you are going to do and make sure you will be covered if a failure occurs.

Good luck.

[boatfixer]

The Ford dealer I bought my truck from has an Amsoil display right in the service dept. 1 service advisor even pushes it, warranty or not.

[Shack]

Boatfixer,

If the dealer backs it, then go for it!

Just make sure first!