Suckers or Shiners?

[Guest]

Tip up fishing with Suckers or Shiners? I fish a stained lake, and wonder if anybody has any preferences. Or any better luck with one or the other. Also smelt that I can get around here is already beheaded and gutted. So I am not sure that I want to use them.
CP&R

[Guest]

What are you fishing for?

[Guest]

Well my actual thought was for Pike. But if you have any walleye stories to add that would be great.

[Guest]

Just use perch like you usually do.

[LaVoi]

I use suckers exclusively. No pike will pass up a sucker. Good Fishin, LaVoi

[Guest]

Hey Toad, found another new name.

PERCHOIDS !!

Waddya tink?

[cwmn]

The processed smelt will work, I put a fat head or two on a treble hook with the smelt. The fat heads keep the bait moving and sread the oil scent of the smelt.

[Guest]

I have had my best luck on shiners. 5-6 inchers tipped on a quick strike rig when fishing pike and 3 inchers tipped on Haugers when fishing walleye.
Good Fishing, Matt.

[MnSportsman]

I do a lot of fishing for N.Pike during the winter season. I can't say which is better, sucker vs. shiner, because I believe that there are other factors that may come into play on deciding which type of bait I use. I have found that suckers seem to be a "hardier" bait, since they seem to stay livelier, longer, for me if I'm traveling around, & they seem as tho' they can stand a second "hook-up" if I move to another spot. Shiners seem to have trouble staying alive, regardless if they are used right away or, not. [They seem to have an aversion to traveling. ..I have tried different methods of hooking,bait-well/minnow bucket water/etc.] But, I still use both,but it depends on the following....
One of the things I tend to do, is try & match the bait ""shape/type" to the natural
forage that might be available in the waters that I'm fishing. If sunfish/crappie are a prime fish for the habitat, I'll tend to use shiners more, since their profile as a fish is a closer resemblance. If I'm in an area that has a good perch population, I'll tend more to a sucker presentation. If it's a "toss-up"... Then either could be the best. Off times I'll try to use both(as in winter/2 lines), & see if I can find a "pattern".
Carp & sucker "profiles" are a clue, as are sheephead/buffalo "profiles".
This is just my opinion, there are other factors that come into play.... like..flowage(running water), depth of the area waters, feeder creeks(could be a "chub" population around),is there other,possibly bigger/larger population predators around?(Wallys/Catfish/Bass) etc..

Hard to say what would be better, isn't it??

If I had to make a "cut-n-dried" choice....
..... I'd go with the sucker minnow!
But....
See ya out there!

------------------
Good Luck & Watch your bobber!
MnSportsman
Proud to be a member in good standing, of the
"Church of the Divine Wilderness"!

[Guest]

Well said MnSportsman!
I agree, matching the forage of the lake you are on is the best bet in most cases. For example, where I grew up near the cities, shiners were better as there were more shiners, sunfish, crappies as natural forage. Here in the Bemidji area where I am now, suckers are much better for pike and it is almost impossible to find good pike sized shiners in any bait store.
Match the hatch and you will catch pike.
Good luck!

------------------
Adam Johnson
www.adamjohnsonfishing.com

[Guest]

I spend alot of time in a spear house. Sometimes the pike wont come in unless the decoy is in constant motion and others they cruise right in when the bait hasnt moved at all. It all depends on what particular mood the buggers are in that day. I know that alot of you dont agree with spearing but it does teach you alot about the feeding habits of those gators. I dont spear anything i wouldnt eat if i had caught it on a line. Most of the fish that come in i just toy with to see how they react to different movements of the decoy. nothing is better than twitching the decoy just right and watching that eating machine go into action and slam into you bait. Personally I would sit in the darkhouse with out a spear if the law made spearing illegal. good fishing to all no matter which method you may choose.

[Guest]

I agree angling in a spearhouse is a rush. It's just like having a big screen under water TV, in color. Watching a pike dart and spin around chasing a decoy or airplane jig or just sit nose to nose with it fluttering its fins. Or how a sunfish or bass will slide in and nose up to a panfish jig and gulp it in. Some of my fondest memories are sitting in the spearhouse and jigging for sunnies with my dad.

Toad

[Guest]

Finally I am posting back. To busy lately to reply (sorry). Thanks for all the great replys. I have been doing a little fishing and found that I have been getting more hits on shiners then on suckers. Caught 3 northerns now on shiners. Zero on suckers. Surpisingly, the lake has an explosive population of Perch, this to my belief would mean that the sucker should be the bait of choice. But for some reason I am not proving that theory. The shiners have been the bait of choice. The lake does have a healthy population of crappies in the summer which might create the attraction to the shiners but not nearly as many as the perch population. Another interesting fact - I am not catching the pike at the edge of the weeds. I am catching them in 18 to 22 feet of water, but the perch are hitting there so that may make sense that the pike are there. Enough rambling from me!
CpR

[Guest]

Avalanche - Some real good points. I've always thought about, but never added blades to a sucker tip - up setup. I will have to give that a try. I have added a small blade to the regular hook setup that use. I add a yellow blade that comes with the swedish pimples. That with a shiner attached has caught a few for me. Also ya gotta tell me, and excuse my ignorance but, Whats a waterdog? Are you talking about a salamander or frog?

[Guest]

Shinners all the way.

Water dogs are lizzard things. The only live bait I ever used other than worms in Colorado. No live bait allowed there, but could use water dogs. Cool, dark brown with big frilly gills.

[Guest]

Try some waterdogs. I recently landed a 44 inch northern with a 19 1/2 inch girth on a water dog and tip-up. Big suckers are good cause they keep off the hammer handles. Also suckers seem to have more scent and more oils. But shinners can be productive too. But with shinners you might get a lot of hammers. One thing you should try is putting some beads and a clevise blade combination on your quick strike rigs. In a perch lake try a orange, green, orange bead combo with a hammered gold blade. Adding blades and beads can give your bait more flash to attract more northerns. I suggest water dogs. Northerns love em they don't have any sharp fins, they are soft and docile.

[Guest]

Avalanche, good tip, I'll have to look for some waterdogs to try the next time I use tp-ups. I like to thread on some spinners on my rigs as well. Adds flash and noise. Thanks.
Good Fishing, Matt.

[Guest]

Water dogs are tiger salamanders in their larve stage. I have been using 1 or 2 sized blades. Also try replacing your weight with a flash lure like a kastmaster. What I mean is take the hooks off, then connect your quick strike rig to the lure then the lure to the tip-up. The lure will provide the weight and flash you need to attract big northerns.

[Guest]

Avalanche, excellent idea with the flash lure. I am gonna give it a try. Thanks
CpR

[Guest]

Someone said in a previous post that sucker minnows will outlast the shiners. One thing I've noticed is the shiners are real aggresive after first being hooked. The suckers seem to slow down after being hooked. I know that sometimes the pike don't want to chase after a real aggresive minnow. Any thoughts??

[Guest]

I've seen shiners last for a few hours on a hook when the fishing is slow. But I'm sure suckers will outlast shiners but who wants to sit in one spot for a long time without catching fish? Go with what works.
Good Fishing, Matt.

[Guest]

Ya know, somedays ya just don't have to catch any fish. I enjoy just being out on the lake and enjoying the day! Catching a fish is always a bonus. I have gotten a bunch of great ideas of this site lately and appreciate everybody's input.
CpR

[Guest]

Crappie Hunter, you're right. I didn't mean anything by having to always catch fish. Just chating.
Good Fishing, Matt.

[Guest]

Oh I know Matt, I wasn't offended. I like the things you have to say. Keep up the good work.
CpR

[MnSportsman]

MJ5,
I posted earlier & stated that Suckers last longer for "me" when I travel. It may have got"lost in translation", but that includes spot to spot, as well as lake to lake, not just from the bait shop to the first spot.If I haven't had a hookup in an hour or so in one spot, I usually move to another spot.And
I usually use the same minnow if it's still lively. Sometimes I just leave the hook in & put hook/minnow in a separate bucket, then rehookup. Other times I just rehook the minnow in a different spot. But the suckers have always outlasted the shiners 10-1, in my opinion.
In regards to "Matching the bait", I have used this method for years & will continue to do so. As in all things, there are "exceptions to the rules". So, if this method doesn't appear to be working in the place that you're fishing, then so be it. But,I personally wouldn't forget that method, especially if the fishing gets slow, or you try another lake & aren't catching as many as you thought you would.
[just an example of this method is....

If you fly-fish for trout,"matching the hatch"is the key to catching more & bigger fish, rather than just throwing out any ol'fly.
But,Even tho'you could have both wet/dry flies & streamers in your vest/bag, the exception to this might be using a "streamer" to attract fish who aren't finding a "hatch" to feed on in that particular stream/river because of the time of year.]

Regardless,
I wish ya the best of luck!
See ya out there!

[This message has been edited by MnSportsman (edited 02-01-2002).]