Fish House Empire Heater?

[pushbutton]

So, inherited the furnace with the fish house bought last year. First 2 month of use, no problem; it was a flamethrower, ok that and the house is less then 100 square ft. Towards the end of the year, however, it was taking longer and longer for it to kick in. Finally quit working, called an outfit, and they came out cleaned it and put in a new thermostat. While it did work for the rest of the year it did not seem to turn on and off as frequently. Same thing happened this year, worked the first two weeks fine, not as good as originally, but sufficient. Last night, she just quit working, again after taking longer and longer between the furnace kicking in. The pilot is still lit. So what do you guys/gals think? Thermostat again? Is there a part on the furnace itself that is a relay/regulator/sensing type device that could be the issue? Can't imagine there are many working parts. The LP tanks did run out of gas recently, but did work for about 6 hours before taking the dump. On a side but somewhat related note, how do the thermostats and wiring work without electricity?

[schmoe147]

Empire heaters do not need any electricity for them to work. I would suggest Gas Service Company as they work on Empire Heaters. I've had great luck with them

[schmoe147]

Empire heaters do not need any electricity for them to work. I would suggest Gas Service Company as they work on Empire Heaters. I've had great luck with them

[chad austin]

On a side but somewhat related note, how do the thermostats and wiring work without electricity?

The thermostat is basically a switch that completes a circuit telling the furnace to kick in. As far as no electricity goes, something in the system creates a small electrical current and that is all that is needed to complete the said circuit. Maybe someone with a bit more knowledge can chime in and give more detail.

[pikechaser]

The empire heaters run on a millivolt system. Instead of a thermocouple, it use's a thermopile (pilot generator) its a number of thermocouples wired together in series. It puts out more power than a thermocouple, and provides a very small amount of electricity to operate the unit. I would go thru & check all the wire connections, a loose or poor connection will cause a problem. They also use a special thermostat (they are rated for use on millivolt systems) Hopefully they put on the right one. Also if the thermopile is getting weak, it may not be putting out enough power to operate. they are fairly simple to replace, follow the pilot line up to the burners box, where it goes in there should be a metal nut(right next to the pilot line) with a little bundle of two wires(sometimes in a metal sheath) that run back to the gas valve..thats the thermopile. unscrew the nut and you should be able to slide it out, mark your wires on the gas valve & disconnect. Ive bought new ones at hardware stores..or a fireplace or heating dealer.. lastly could also be a dirty pilot & or low gas pressure issue. what does the pilot look like? is it burning yellow?

I'd start checking ALL your wiring connections & if no luck change the thermopile. If that doesnt work, your probly better off having a hvac guy look at, probly something minor.

[pushbutton]

Thanks Pikechaser! Took your info and, more importly, despriptive terms, and did a little googling and phone calling and will probably be able to figure this out. The pilot flame looks decent and it does have an empire thermostat on it. Learned that if you connect the stats wires it will engage the unit so it will be easy to make a call on that, next leaving the wiring, or the thermopile. If that does not work I guess I will have to let you use my house on mille lacs for the weekend...... finding plenty of pike right below it......but you would have to fix the furnace first

[pikechaser]

I thought about mentioning that, but if the thermopile is just weak bypassing the stat or the whole circuit will make it work and not be the actual problem. you can measure what the thermopile is putting out, or check the thermostat circuit if your framiliar with using a volt meter. I saw some pics of some very nice pike & eyes from out of millelacs last weekend. Ive got a house @ the Red Door.

[pushbutton]

I thought about mentioning that, but if the thermopile is just weak bypassing the stat or the whole circuit will make it work and not be the actual problem. you can measure what the thermopile is putting out, or check the thermostat circuit if your framiliar with using a volt meter.

Yeah, realized it was not as simple diagnosing as I thought.....replacing both the pile and stat made up for my lack of knowledge though Thanks again. Good luck and stay safe up on that north end!

[pikechaser]

Id save the stat..probly nothing wrong with it.