More trapping of dogs...

[Random guy]

I really feel for the guys up north like Johnny P. I imagine he's long lining in areas a domestic dog rarely ventures. Take away this trap and his life gets alot harder as he's said.

All of my lines are either one of two deals. Way up rivers and ditch grades via boat into the bog, where a hunter/birddog could barely walk let alone hunt, plus no game birds in the bog other then the occasional spruce hen. Or my lines all start on private farm land as the only access point and then go back into unimproved state land without other outside access. One is simply because they are good trapping spots and second is I am the only soul for miles and miles. The private entry assures me of no hunters or other trappers stinking up my line. Works great until you break down or get hurt.

[RangerJack]

Well said Jonny! I sure hope the legislature realizes the importance of Minnesota trappers.

[Trashguy]

SapperACE, My arguments are lot more realistic, than banning the cars on the road, don't you think, thus the childish comment. Look, I sure as hell don't hate any trapper and can see their side TO A POINT. But what am I supposed to do when my dog means as much to me as she does to me? I mean, if my house caught fire I would rush in to save my wife & grand daughter (don't know about the cat) and go right back in to save my dog. And if you think I am just saying that for this forum, you are wrong. I have thought that way for many years. Go ahead & bring on some negative comments on the last few sentences. That is me and where I am coming from. What am I supposed to do, not trying to change things to lesson the risk or just forget about it and stay out of the woods? Please tell me what I am to do! If your answer is just except the risk, then I will buy a camera, sell my guns and let my dog at home. Some of the trapping community seems to know what is going on has some decent answers/compromises and then there are some that won't budge and inch and its their right to do what ever they &^%$# want.

[RBuker]

Rbuker, let's get one thing straight. A trap placed by a trapper is the responsibility of the trapper, if it kills a dog of a hunter it was the action of the trapper that lead to its death. Nothing else, if the trap wasnt there, there would be no dead dog. Who is taking from who? I continue to hear about controlling our dogs, what about the control of the trap? A trapper sets and baits a trap then leaves. What control does he have over his trap then? None. It catches what ever sticks its head in.

Talk about sad to see one outdoorsman not stick up for another, you are sanctioning the cavalier attitude that it's ok to kill our hunting dogs so you can make money.

Brett,

Let's get this thing straight. The safety of a dog is always up to its owner. Not the driver of the car and not the trapper. As dog owners, we are aware of a variety of dangers out there to our dogs. I don't let mine play on the hiway. I don't let mine wander when I'm not out with them. And, when I'm hunting grouse, I keep them close enough to see them. A retriever needs to work close when hunting grouse.

And, you obviously didn't read my post. You said, "it's ok to kill our hunting dogs so you can make more money." If you had read my post you would see that I'm not a trapper. I own more dogs than I do traps. I have five dogs. I DO NOT TRAP. But your narrow minded approach to this is damaging to trappers AND hunters.

Do you realize that SIX dogs have died this year in traps?SIX! How many hundred died by car accidents in the same time period in this state? Get a grip! You are trying to limit trappers when SIX dogs have died. Good grief. Where is the common sense?

[RangerJack]

I love my dog, I love to trap. If my dog gets caught in a trap, it was meant to be. Oh well. I've caught my fair share of dogs in footholds as well. Some were pretty nasty looking after they were released. Dogs are always going to get caught in traps, no matter what type you are using! Snares will kill a dog very quick, and footholds will freeze there paws over night and make your dog worthless.

The seasons just shouldn't overlap anymore! Give both sides what they want, and forget about it. Courses are already offered for beginning trappers, and it's as simple as educating even further for the use of 220's on land. I don't see why the state of Minnesota is freaking out about such a simple matter. I've had numerous customers come into the shop and ask if I've caught any dogs lately with "those traps they showed on WCCO last week!"

This is just going to get worse until people realize that it's not that big of a deal.

good luck

[Trashguy]

This is one of the comments from today's Tribune article on our subject. Thought it was worth posting and I agree:

"The Minnesota Trappers Association, if they're smart, will support this legislation as a reasonable compromise. Pandering to the "don't give an inch" crowd in the trapping community could very well harm the sport they think they're trying to protect. Every dead dog is a PR nightmare for a sport that doesn't enjoy much popular support to begin with."

Another question I thought I would ask, how many trappers are trapping for the love of the sport or for the $$? You can answer with % here and % there. Guess when I was trapping as a kid it was for the love/fun of it and another reason to be out in the woods, when I did it rats were .50 though & mink either side of a dollar an inch, maybe they still are. I know I had some nice bucks around 30" and that was $30! Pretty good money to be made for a kid before getting on the bus before school. Thought any answers would be interesting. Trapped plenty of badgers too (man are they viscous in a leg hold!), but the only money was from the farmer and can't remember what I got.

[RBuker]

Have any of the trappers here spoken with the Minnesota trappers association regarding any of the ideas or compromises suggested here? The bill currently proposed leaves both sides at an all or nothing state. I am sure we can get somebody like cornish or mcnamara behind it if both sides support it.

I haven't heard what Cornish thinks about this. Might be interesting to hear it. I was the person involved in getting the use of lights allowed for hunting predators at night. Tony Cornish was against it even though the Minnesota Deer hunters Association, The DNR Division of Enforcement, the DNR Division of Wildlife and many other organizations were on my side and didn't see a problem with it. Tony had his own agenda and was not very logical or fair in his dealings with me. He threw up a bunch of roadblocks to try to hinder the process. He is the reason we can't shoot 'coons at night (Might be breeding or hibernating..) and he's the reason we can't use rifles. He's not always our friend.

[swampman]

I think people have a tendency to fear things they they are'nt framiliar with as stated already most trappers own hunting dogs and don't have the same reaction to this as non trappers. I personally own around 600 traps of which 5 are 220's that have'nt been set in 3yrs. So me personally it would not be a big deal. Other guys it is a huge deal for there operation and I would hate to see them lose that. I think it just starts a bad trend. I am sure alot of you hunters belong to the NRA they tend not to budge for the same reason.

The bill as it is written makes no sense at all I am not against making some adjustments to the 220 issue if it make sense.

It comes across loud and clear that some here would rather see no trapping at all. I get that I personally don't care for spearfishing but I have friends that do and I would hate to see them lose a privalage just because I don't personally care for it.

I think there can be a reasonable solution to this will it be perfect probably not. Trashguy if my house was burning down after I went in and got my wife and kids out the dog would be on his own if it meant maybe leaving my wife without a husband and my kids with out there dad. Thats just me

[swampman]

Have any of the trappers here spoken with the Minnesota trappers association regarding any of the ideas or compromises suggested here? The bill currently proposed leaves both sides at an all or nothing state. I am sure we can get somebody like cornish or mcnamara behind it if both sides support it.

The trappers assoc is on top of this I am not a officer but do know that they are dealing with it

[NORTHCRAZE]

Brett how can you possibly say that you are not responsible for your actions?

Duck hunters must identify what type of ducks they are shooting at beforethey shoot!

Goose hunters must identify what type of geese they are shooting at before they shoot!

Pheasant hunters must identify a rooster or hen before they shoot!

Deer hunters must must identify between a buck and a doe (unless they have a permit)before they shoot!

And all of the above must be positively sure of the background where their shells or bullets will end up.

I guess I'm not sure why trappers aren't required some how to be sure of their target?

I read all the time in the "Outdoor News" of trappers that accidently

killed lynx,bobcat,protected gray wolves.protected eagles, blue jays, gray jays,etc.How many of these are not reported?

Not sure why some of these don't fall under the "Wanton Waste" law?

Also you know as well as I do that there are a lot more than the"six dogs" like you are talking about!

You talk about common sense, where is this dogs playing on the highway,car accidents, keeping my dog on a 4' lease and telling me that a dog has to work a certain close distance for grouse hunting coming from?

[NORTHCRAZE]

Sorry,

I meant to address my last post to RBuker not Brett

[swampman]

I guess all the coots I find floating dead during duck season died of natural causes

[Trashguy]

Hey Northcraze, Longville, where is that, oh wait, five miles from our place. Where abouts are you located there? If you don't want to say, that is fine, just making conversation. We are on Townline Lake, north of Longville as I am sure you know where that is. Water level just keeps dropping on our lake and with this winter....... I do most of my stuff in the woods though, north of Remer, pushing 40 years now.

[RBuker]

Brett how can you possibly say that you are not responsible for your actions?

Duck hunters must identify what type of ducks they are shooting at beforethey shoot!

Goose hunters must identify what type of geese they are shooting at before they shoot!

Pheasant hunters must identify a rooster or hen before they shoot!

Deer hunters must must identify between a buck and a doe (unless they have a permit)before they shoot!

And all of the above must be positively sure of the background where their shells or bullets will end up.

I guess I'm not sure why trappers aren't required some how to be sure of their target?

I read all the time in the "Outdoor News" of trappers that accidently

killed lynx,bobcat,protected gray wolves.protected eagles, blue jays, gray jays,etc.How many of these are not reported?

Not sure why some of these don't fall under the "Wanton Waste" law?

Also you know as well as I do that there are a lot more than the"six dogs" like you are talking about!

You talk about common sense, where is this dogs playing on the highway,car accidents, keeping my dog on a 4' lease and telling me that a dog has to work a certain close distance for grouse hunting coming from?

Northcraze, Please show me where I said I'm not responsible for my actions. I can't find that statement in my posts. Sorry.

You asked where it's coming from when I said I don't let my dogs play on the highway and that my dogs hunt close when I'm grouse hunting. Friend, that's simple responsibility for your dog. The 4' leash statement was not made by me and I'm pretty sure it was tongue in cheek.

The rest of your post is kind of jumbled and I don't even know how to respond to it.

Anyway, please quote me where I said I didn't have to take responsibility for my actions and I'll respond to it.

[NORTHCRAZE]

I guess all the coots I find floating dead during duck season died of natural causes

As I said in my post, duck hunters must be sure of their target!So If what your saying is true these are illegal hunters and need to be caught and penalized.And I feel that would also be wanton waste.

But with these traps being set out with bait you obviously can't control the type of animals you are killing.

So as this is illegal for the hunter that shot the coot why is it OK for the trapper.

[Trashguy]

+1

and the response is:

[NORTHCRAZE]

I thought my post was very clear as to what was said. Jumbled??

I also thought you were quite clear the stance your were taking even though you don't trap.

Let's get this thing straight. The safety of a dog is always up to its owner. Not the driver of the car and not the trapper.

[LOTWSvirgin]

I smell a troll

[RBuker]

I thought my post was very clear as to what was said. Jumbled??

I also thought you were quite clear the stance your were taking even though you don't trap.

Let's get this thing straight. The safety of a dog is always up to its owner. Not the driver of the car and not the trapper.

Well, you are wrong. Your post was jumbled and confusing.

Anyway, you neglected to show me where I said I don't have to take responsibility for myself. And, yes, you read it right. If you own a dog, you have to take responsibility for it. It can't read road signs and it doesn't know it can't lick up antifreeze off yoru garage floor. Simple enough?

[swampman]

My point being you came across as all duck hunters don't pull the trigger unless they know what they are shooting.

Look I really don't want to argue with you guys and if we met in the field hunting we would probably all get along just fine. We all have a passion for what we do and thats not a bad thing.

We can fight here all we won't and we are'nt going to acomplish anything anyway, I know I have got sucked in, the legal process will sort this out one way or another

[swamptiger]

Quote:

We can fight here all we won't and we are'nt going to acomplish anything anyway, I know I have got sucked in, the legal process will sort this out one way or another

+1.

This will all be sorted out down in St. Paul now. Too bad, but that's the way things work nowadays. It's all about ME...

[NORTHCRAZE]

Hey Trashguy,

My place is also about 5 miles out of town.

Yes I know where Townline is.I still fish it some but fished it allot more before it froze out.

Did you ever hear of a guy named Farley Dare.We got together from time to time to shoot the breeze.Like you he also lived on the lake. Super guy. He passed away some years back. The reason I bring this up is because I think he was originally from Prior Lake, basically your Jordan neighbor.

[squeeb27]

Last year pheasant hunting I had a dog get bit by a conna bear, I had never seen one before. We got the dog out in time and it was all good, would it maybe too much to ask to put a surveyor stake up with like pink or orange tape on it so a guy could see it and direct hos dog back to him? Would that change the outcome of successfully trapping an animal?

[Tinkhamtown]

Six dead dogs because of conibear traps is a very big problem to other dog owners. Not hunting or going on the public lands because you fear for your dog’s safety because of traps is serious.

Public land, State and National forests do not belong to just trappers so they can kill to make a living.

An online petition (see http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/mark-dayton-governor-minnesota/) to outlaw body-gripping traps on public land. Please contact your state representative and senator to outlaw body-grip-traps on public land.

[mallardnwalleye]

Come on guys -banning body gripping traps completely on public areas goes way too far. Underwater sets and x ft. off the ground should be the most you should demand. Maybe a simple change in the trapping season and bumping the public land opener out a little further is all that is needed. We didn't see that many dogs die in previous seasons, my guess is it's related to the the lack of snow and warmth.