which works better

[nitefisher]

when useing bullheads for catching flats which work better the yellows or the black bullheads.?

[Mr Special]

I don't think it matters, as long as they're lively.

[nitefisher]

i was just wondering because i hear people talk more of the yellow than the black but that could just be that that is what they could get more of.thanks for the help and have a good openner weekend.god bless and be safe.

[Ralph Wiggum]

I use what I can get. I don't think it's really going to matter.

[nitefisher]

thanks ralph check out my question on the minnesota river forum, i know you know your rods,maybe you can help?.

[fiskyknut]

Do any of you flathead people use Stonecats or Madtoms ever? These can be a good baitfish for the Red river Channel Cats at times, good for the BIG ones anyhow.

fiskyknut

[rushing]

A good sized fat lively bullhead no matter the type will get the job done. Madtoms and Stonecats...aren't they pretty small?

[fiskyknut]

Madtoms I trap will get maybe around 4 inches, I catch Stonecats regularily up to around 10 inches or so.

I fish the Roseau river often, this is a trib to the Red. See lots of folks that catch Stonecats and swear they're Flatheads!

[Guest]

Fisky.. madtoms and stonecats are way too small for bait for us. A healthy 7"(they're all 7" arent they?) bullhead will usually weigh somewhere around 1/3-3/4 pound.. thats a whole lot of kicking and thumping down there which draws in the attention of the flatheads.

Flatheads mouths are much larger than channel cats.. a 5 pound flathead can easily take down a bait a 25 pound channel would have a hard time getting its lips around... Flatheads like a big bait.. but will occasioanly take a smaller offering. I guarantee you will have more runs on a 7" bullhead vs a 4" bullhead over time.

[nitefisher]

thanks for all the replys i can get all the above i just don't want to wast time catching the thing i would rather be fishing the right thing so i can get fishing.thanks again and all be safe on opener.

[fiskyknut]

Hmmmm, I am somewhat familiar with Catfish morphology. Though I have'nt caught any Mudcats in MN I have caught them in GA, NC, and SC, this dates back to the mid-eighties though. Yes I was Catfish when Catfish was'nt so cool! Not to be arguementative but I seriously doubt a 25 pound Channel has a smaller mouth than a 5 pound Flathead, and one could easily gobble down an equal sized bait. I'm not sure how many you've seen but a 25 pound Channel Cat has a pretty big mouth eh, especially a bigheaded girthy one, heck I think a 25# Channel Cat might even be able to get down a 5# Mudcat!

1 things for sure, pound for pound a Channel cat will surely out pull a Flatty of equal dimension, would'nt you say? LOL!

I know Stonecats are darn tough on a hook, and 7 inch Stonecats would and do kick up a fuss as well. They're surely not as girthy as the yellow, brown, or black Bullheads though.

Just curious iffin any of you flathead peoples use them for bait as I was thinking of trapping some and bringing down a couple hundred for folks iffin I did make it to the Flathead get-together.

Regards....fiskyknut

[rushing]

I didnt know stonecats got that big I always thought they were like 2-3 inches. I see no reason why they wouldnt work if you can get em that size. I have caught Sheephead on 7in bullies! It musta been super hungery cuz it was wedge in its mouth pretty good! I have also caught walleyes on 7in bullies. They both have pretty small mouths. Although I like to use big bait, sometimes I find a 5-6in bully can create more thump by just being livelier than a bigger bully. Sometimes the big ones are lazy. I'm a big one, and i'm lazy.

[mplspug]

Dip the lazy ones in a cold cup of coffee for a half a minute before tossing them out.

[fiskyknut]

The true Stonecat, noturus flavus, is the largest member of the Madtom family and the longest living of Madtoms. I have found records of a 12.25 inch 9 year old fish being collected in MO. Gobs of these in the Red river and it's tribs, most I catch go right around 6 to 7 inches it seems.

Yepper them Walleyes will munch them Stonecats too.

Maybe what you are seeing down there are either brown Madtoms and/or the tadpole Madtom, aka 'willowcats', both native to Misisippi drainage and both way smaller than true Stonecats. Stonecats are native to that drainage too so there must be some somewhere's down there?

fiskyknut

[Dennis Steele]

I've seen a few (what I would consider) very large madtoms or stonecats at around 7". (I have to admitt, I don't know the difference) I haven't seen too many though. Most I have seined or trapped were around 3 to 4" and fairly thin creatures.

Pack quite a sting too!!!

I don't doubt that the larger ones would make good flatty bait.

As for the difference in the fight between a channel and a flat, its really kind of hard to compare the two. They both fight quite differently.

Channels seem to have more energy. What I mean by that is that they move faster, roll, and twist, and basically "freak out when hooked.

Flats on the other hand seem to have more power. They stay deep and pull consistantly hard and will take rapid controlled runs. It almost seems as it they give thought to their fight. Fight smarter if you will.

I do have respect for both species and would have a tough time choosing one over the other if their sizes were comparable. Heck, I love to fish the smaller cats we have around here just as much as targeting the flats.

One thing for sure is you get a heck of a lot more action, fishing channels. And even a 5lb channel beats a 10" sunfish any day!

(thats for you Mr. Johnson!)

[Guest]

the largest madtom or stonecat I have ever saw were maybe 4 1/2" long.. pretty scronny little guys. I have never seen the larger ones. I could see them as a channel cat bait..

Dennis.. your right, all cats are fun to catch. I must admit, I wouldnt mind a few of those 10" sunfish.. for BAIT!

too bad it isnt legal.

[fiskyknut]

Hmmmm, must be a Red river thing, just like our Channel cats our Stonecats get way BIG too.

I suppose each fish has it's own fighting qualities, but for sure the Channel cat has it all over the Flathead in the beauty department!

fiskyknut

[hanson]

Fisky-

I've gotten a few of them stonecats in the RLR in Crookston as well. I bet they were all of 8 inches in length and they look like little flathead catfish which really had me confused. Their tails are identical.

[mplspug]

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...but for sure the Channel cat has it all over the Flathead in the beauty department!

fiskyknut

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Oh, I must protest! I think flatheads are much prettier than channels. Especially those big channels over 10 lbs when they start getting uglier. Sure, the littler ones being nice, unscarred, and tone look pretty, but I'll take a flat any day. And for sure, the disposition of a flathead is better than any other fish. They battle you tooth and nail, but once you net them, it's almost as if they want to be in your picture, be weighed and fussed over. Iam telling you, beauty is skin deep.

[rushing]

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They battle you tooth and nail, but once you net them, it's almost as if they want to be in your picture, be weighed and fussed over.

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You make Flatheads sound like the Paris Hiltons of the catfish world!

[AQUAJOE]

Rushing thats just wrong!!

[mplspug]

Quote:

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They battle you tooth and nail, but once you net them, it's almost as if they want to be in your picture, be weighed and fussed over.

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You make Flatheads sound like the Paris Hiltons of the catfish world!

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What can I say, I'm smitten. For the record, I'll take a flathead over Paris Hilton any day. Flats are natural beauties! Oh and I do think channels are not the cats meow too! Just not quite on the level of a flathead.