Opinions - 7D vs 60D

[fishinchicks]

I have asked for a new camera body for my birthday coming up in October. You have recently seen what I like to shoot - the kids in arenas, posed family type stuff, and landscapes.

For those of you who are familiar with these Canons, which would you recommend?

[beakgeek]

7D.

[Dbl]

I don't own a 60D but have shot the 7D since its introduction. I will keep this brief but let me list a few features that I think you may find useful for your type of shooting.

-Auto focus. the 7D has two processors, one dedicated to auto focus. It has a 19 point (9 point on 60D) cross type auto focus system that does a good job. My only trouble with it has been in very low light, low contrast situations. I do get a lot of misses in those scenarios but that is tough for any camera. I would bet it is much better than the 60D in these situations.

-Weather sealing. The 7D has almost the same weather sealing capabilities that the Series 1 cameras do. I have used mine in light rain with no cover with no problems. I don't recommend that but in a pinch...I also use L series glass which also provides weather sealing, most consumer grade lenses don't so keep that in mind.

-Metal body. The 60D is plastic for the most part.

-100% viewfinder. What you see is what you shoot. Doesn't sound like much but I find it very useful. It also is much brighter to look through than most viewfinders because of the transmissive light viewfinder.

-FPS. 8 vs 5.3. Yes that does make a difference! I am not much of a burst shooter but when I need it I want a fast FPS.

-Flash. Much better flash capabilities. I do use mine with off camera flashes and find it useful. If you don't use a lot of flash it will not matter a whole lot. I do like having the ability to fire another couple of flashes without using a sync chord. Not the greatest in sunlight but it works in a pinch.

-Micro focus. 7D will allow you to adjust your camera to the lenses you own to get the sharpest image. No micro focus on the 60D.

General observations. Both cameras use the same APS-C CMOS sensor. What I have found is that the 7D needs good glass to give you the best image quality. With the same sensor and MP I would guess the 60D will be nearly the same. I also have noticed some noise from ISO 400 to 1250. I have learned to live with it, you do need to use care when processing the images or you can make a mess out of them. I did just shoot a wedding with it this past weekend and am going through them now and was pleased with the results. The church was very low light so it challenged the camera! Of course I have been shooting low light sports since day one with the 7D and have been impressed with its abilities.

All in all you are getting a semi-pro body for a good price. I will add more as a few more thoughts pop into mind.

[fishinchicks]

Dan,

Thanks for the thoughts. I have used my niece's 7D when she comes to visit, and I was impressed by the focusing system. We put my 85mm 1.8 lens on it, and loved what it could do.

I have three lenses: Canon 85mm 1.8, Canon 55-250 4-5.6, and a Tamron 17-50 2.8

[Steve Foss]

Dan, if you have time, could you run through a comparison of the 7D and 1D3? I shoot the 1D3 as one of my two primary bodies, and am wondering if I'm right that it's better than the 7D in all categories mentioned. I've only played with the 7D a couple of times and was not impressed by its noise performance. If memory serves, you've done a lot of shooting with both bodies. Come to think of it, I think Ken has, as well.

The reason I ask is not to throw a monkey wrench into the original question, but because used 1D3 bodies in excellent shape can be had for under $2,000, very close to retail for a new 7D. And if you wanted to buy a 7D and battery grip new, add a couple/three hundo to the total (the 1D3 comes with the equivalent of a battery grip and roughly twice the battery capacity of non 1 series cameras).

So it seems to me the comparison might have value. My lightly used 1D3, which I bought over a year ago for about $2,100, has performed perfectly and been completely trouble free.

I've stayed with the 1D3 and 5D instead of upgrading because, of all Canon digital cameras, they have the best noise performance. I routinely shoot indoor weddings with both bodies at iso1600 and 3200, and the images are very clean, not to mention the excellent low light autofocus performance of the 1D3. As we know, both factors are mighty important for indoor non-flash photography.

Of course, no video capability with the 1D3.

[fishinchicks]

Steve, I hadn't thought about the used market for a 1 series. I don't need the video feature, and would probably never use it on the 7D. I bought an awesome video camera last year that I take all my video with.

[Dbl]

Steve,

You are correct the Mark III wins hands down in every category bar none! The reason I didn't bring it up is that there can be some difficulty choosing a good used camera like the Mark III with its history of focus problems. If you know what you are looking for it is a great bargain, but one should use care when looking at this camera.

You obviously have a great copy and likely a large percentage of those cameras are just fine but if you end up with one that is not up to par you can be in for some expensive fixes with no warranty coverage. Most have had the recall's taken care of and I know Canon is still honoring those that haven't but it can cause you to spend time without a camera to have it taken care of.

Clean copies are in the $1800 to $2000 range so it is about $300 to $500 more than a new 7D. I just saw an ad for the 60D in the paper today for $900! A extra $1000 could put you into a nice used 70-200/2.8 to complement her lens lineup. JMHO.

[Steve Foss]

Agreed, Dan. The 1D3/70-200 f2.8 is a deadly combo!

In nearly every 1D3 ad on POTN (where I do all my buying/selling), details of focus performance and any fixes by Canon seem to be included. And if they are not mentioned in the ad, potential buyers always ask in subsequent posts.

I'm seeing new 7D bodies (without lens but with all other kit generally included with a body) for $1,600, and a gripped 7D will cost the same as a nice used 1D3. Weight can sometimes be an issue with the 1 series bodies, particularly if a person doesn't have strong hands/wrists.

It sure is fun spending other people's money.