water heater

[Stickjiggler]

I need to replace my 20 year old 40 gallon water heater. It just can't keep up any more. We are a family of four. Do you think a 50 gallon would be big enough? What are the best brands and where are the best deals? Will be installing myself, with a little help from the father in law.

Thanks

[delcecchi]

Also look at recovery specs. Recovery can make a big difference. Gas or Electric?

Ever consider a tankless? Never run out of hot water.

[Stickjiggler]

Gas. Tankless are more than I wanted to spend

[BoxMN]

I heard from a plumber friend that water heaters are going to get more expensive in the upcoming months due to new gov regs.... anybody know anything about that? Or maybe just scare tactics...

[Tom7227]

Back in the old days when this problem came up the dad would just send a couple of the girls to the convent.

Maybe the fact that it's 20 years old and probably full of lime deposits has something to do with it.

You could also try to convince a few folks to shower in the evening so there isn't such a great demand at one time in the AM.

Do you really think that the extra 10 gallons is going to make that much difference?

[delcecchi]

I heard from a plumber friend that water heaters are going to get more expensive in the upcoming months due to new gov regs.... anybody know anything about that? Or maybe just scare tactics...

[delcecchi]

I couldn't tell how much difference there is in recovery, that is how fast it heats more water, between the different models.

The shower heads also make a big difference. The old school ones really used a lot more water, and the new low flow shower heads aren't bad. (the first ones they came out with were pretty sad)

The recovery can be figured from the btu input. I just looked, and mine is 40k btu and 40 gph recovery.

[nobody05]

If it's a power vent heater you might as well go tankless. There is not a lot of price difference between the 2 after these new heaters come out.

[TR21HP]

There actually is a big difference in the two especially if you go tankless. The additional cost, if gas, is in the gas supply. You will need to go with a new high pressure service instead of the low pressure you currently have as the new tankless are all high pressure and will require all new service possibly from your street. My advice to stck jiggler is get a conventional 40-50 gallon before April 15th and get it installed. The Canadian products mentioned are not quite up to specs as far as quality and maintenance. Just ran into this issue and got a new one installed.

[aanderud]

I'd have quite a bit of reservation before going tankless, based on what I've read.

Consumer reports doesn't think they're a good idea, necessarily:

http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/appli...-heaters-ov.htm

Quote:

Heating water accounts for up to 30 percent of the average home's energy budget. Some makers of gas-fired tankless water heaters claim their products can cut your energy costs up to half over regular storage heaters. So is it time to switch?

Probably not.

Gas tankless water heaters, which use high-powered burners to quickly heat water as it runs through a heat exchanger, were 22 percent more energy efficient on average than the gas-fired storage-tank models in our tests. That translates into a savings of around $70 to $80 per year, based on 2008 national energy costs. But because they cost much more than storage water heaters, it can take up to 22 years to break even—longer than the 20-year life of many models. Moreover, our online poll of 1,200 readers revealed wide variations in installation costs, energy savings, and satisfaction.

Here's another article describing some downfalls, from a company that repairs water heaters for a living:

http://www.waterheaterrescue.com/pages/WHRpages/English/Longevity/tankless-water-heaters.html

Here's an article that relays some information from a real-world study done IN MINNESOTA with a couple dozen heaters installed in 10 family homes, each used for a year. They found that the INSTALLATION and MAINTENANCE costs were quite high, especially when retrofitting into a system that was previously a tank heater installation site:

http://www.greenbuildingadvisor.com/blogs/dept/musings/are-tankless-water-heaters-waste-money

Quote:

The study found that tankless water heaters cost more to install, and save less energy, than many energy experts claim. “From interviews with eight local contractors, installed costs for whole-house gas tankless water heaters as a retrofit were estimated from $2,000 to $5,000, with typical price range of $2,500 to $3,400. These costs are considerably higher than estimated by others. … For comparison, these same contractors estimated the installed cost of a conventional standard water heater to range from $900 to $1,300, with an average cost of about $1,100.”

...

Should I buy one? Tankless water heaters have at least two drawbacks: they are expensive and mechanically complicated. They also have at least two virtues: they are compact and can provide “endless” quantities of hot water. For some applications, these benefits are desirable enough to tip the balance in their favor. As long as you realize that you'll never save enough energy to justify the high purchase price, you may want to buy a tankless water heater for its performance specifications and compact size.

And finally, for humor, here's a tankless water heater spoof on youtube (warning, he says 'holy sh##' a couple times, so don't watch in front of kids).

[delcecchi]

That's a good point about the gas supply. And tankless seem to require regular maintenance as well.

But if the ladies take long showers and you have old school 3 gallon per minute shower heads, even a 50 won't do it, unless they give it a rest in between.

[fishersofmen]

Cant go wrong with Rheem. I believe they invented water heaters. I have a 40 gallon in my house and we have a few kids. The only time we run out of hot water is if there is a few showers taken in a row. No problems otherwise. We run gas on the water heater and stove it goes about 25-30 bucks a month.

[nobody05]

I guess when i bought mine it was a no brainer. $875 bucks for a power vent vs $1200 for a tankless. installed myself. I just put a tee in my 3/4'' black iron pipe and ran gastite to the heater. No pressure mods or nothing. I can run the furnace 80k btu and 157k btu tankless all at once not a problem. 67% efficiency on a tank heater vs 96% efficiency on the tankless. Oh and by the way $300 rebate from the gas company for high efficiency product. So I guess technically the heater costed me $25 bucks extra. Yes there was probably $200 bucks of re-plumbing to hook up tankless venting ect.

[Stickjiggler]

Thanks all. I bought a Rheem 50 gal. 12 yr warranty. Get $70 back from Centerpoint and got $50 off for opening a home Depot account. Not installing until next weekend though so no reports yet.

[Tom7227]

If you put shut off valves and use stainless flex hoses you won't have the water off so long and be able change out more quickly in the future.