Guests - If You want access to member only forums on HSO. You will gain access only when you sign-in or Sign-Up on HotSpotOutdoors.

It's easy - LOOK UPPER right menu.

Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0
chasineyes

State Employee Wage Scale vs. Budget

43 posts in this topic

http://www.doer.state.mn.us/lr-salry/lr-salry.htm

After checking out this HSOforum, it has become clear why the state is constantly upping their budget. I don't begrudge anyone for making what they can, but when government is growing faster than the private sector these wages and benefits cannot be sustained. If the private sector is creating jobs in the $24,000-$40,000 range and governemnt is growing jobs in the $40,000-$100,000 you can see we are going to have a shortage somewhere. Not to mention the retirement plan that they are eligble when they are in their mid-50's.

)All plans provide important retirement, survivor, and disability coverage for state employees. (In most cases, you qualify for monthly benefits with three years of service, and reduced benefits can begin as early as age 55 (age 50 for Correctional and State Patrol Plan members) This information is obtained straight from the DNR HSOforum. My issue with the retirement program is if we are paying for someone in their mid-50's to retire with beneifits, then we still have to pay for the new employee. There is the possibility that we the taxpayers could be paying for 3 EMPLOYEE benefits with only 1 actually working. Again this will create a shortage in $$$$$.

These are the issues that the state is facing and no one will talk about it. Whether its' state employees, federal employees, teachers, etc.,. This is an bomb waiting to explode unless people start talking about it. The bottom line is we can't keep growing government greater than the private sector. smirk

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Almost all Full Time State Employees are in Unions...including Teachers...

Not only are they getting very good Guaranteed Salaries...Many Weeks Paid Vacation and a Slew of Paid Holidays, Guaranteed Required Hours, Full Health and Dental...And 50% of Highest Salary at Retirement, which may be Collected Starting at Age 55...in addition to Social Security which may be Collected at age 62...

Many Cry and Cry about Obama Socialism...Until it comes to Their Own Income and Benfits... crazy

It is time that those in the Private sector were Guaranteed Similar Compensation and Benefits of the Government Sectors...

Health Insurance and Retirement Benefits As Good as our Millionaire Elected Officials...and for the Same Price...$0.00... blush

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wouldn't it make more sense to have the private sector become more competitive for jobs,,,? isn't that letting the markets work? O.o

*cough*.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wouldn't it make more sense to have the private sector become more competitive for jobs,,,? isn't that letting the markets work? O.o

*cough*.

Wouldn't it make more sense to let the Government Sector become more Competitive or should we say Competent...or if it is then bring the Private Sector into Compliance...

I think we have seen how Well and Fairly the Markets Work...Without Minimum and Maximum Parameters... crazy

We are all Equal as Citizens, and deserve as Similar Fair Compensation as that the Government pays with Our Tax Dollars...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

i dunno how you can make a government job more competitive on the market...looks like the deals are pretty sweet already....

maybe i'm reading this wrong.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

i dunno how you can make a government job more competitive on the market...looks like the deals are pretty sweet already....

maybe i'm reading this wrong.

The Government can be more Competitive by Cutting All the Paid Vacations, Holidays, Benefits, and Pensions down to the Majority of Private Sector Jobs...or wouldn't that be Fair...it certainly would be more Free Market...Less Socialist... wink

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My dad has considered running for state office just for the retirement plan. Not that he has a problem with his, it's just he'd get almost the same for 3 years as a public servant as will for 40 years with a company.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You have to compare apples to apples here. You cant compare all gov't jobs to all private sector jobs. There are a lot of 24,000 jobs in the private sector because these are general labor or no experience required jobs. Most of the Gov't jobs that you speak of are jobs that require a degree and experience. Do you really think you are going to get someone to go to school for 4 or 5 years for biology to take a job with the DNR as a fisheries biologist for 24,000?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

...he'd get almost the same for 3 years as a public servant as will for 40 years with a company.

Sorry it doesn't work that way. State employees get a portion of their retirement from their Deferred Compensation Accounts. It is like a 401K, you have to invest your own money and have it invested for quite a while to see a return on your investment. The state matches a certain percentage of what employees invest like good employers in the private sector do.

The other portion of their retirement is based on a forumla of yearly salary AND years of service. You aren't going to take a $50K/year job with the state for 3 years and see the same benefit as someone that has worked that same job for 30 years.

Big Dave eluded to it but a lot of the jobs have some pretty specific educational requirements. I know state employees who have a masters in fisheries management that started out at about $35K/year. They aren't taking these jobs because they think they are going to become wealthy doing it. They are taking the job because they want to do that type of work.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm wondering, who will be getting Veterans Day off next week? The fact still remains that the government sector continues to be the #1 or #2 job creater aside from Healthcare. Another thing to consider, since we don't all live in the metro, take a look at the wages of outstate private vs. public. I would bet my paycheck that in most counties it's (other than a Doctor or Attorney) it's going to be your government employee. To Caseymcq what would be your largest employer in the Babbitt area? I know that area is huge for Tourisim and retail and you and I both know how well that pays... So to take a job in rural MN with excellent benefits, low chance of job disappearing, steady pay and raises, really doesn't seem like much to ask for. Maybe someone can chime in on how many applicants do "Govt" jobs get when they have an open position??

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You have to compare apples to apples here. You cant compare all gov't jobs to all private sector jobs. There are a lot of 24,000 jobs in the private sector because these are general labor or no experience required jobs. Most of the Gov't jobs that you speak of are jobs that require a degree and experience. Do you really think you are going to get someone to go to school for 4 or 5 years for biology to take a job with the DNR as a fisheries biologist for 24,000?

There is a whole list of jobs in the link, with all various skill levels required...

A few Examples...Annual Income Minimum Maximum

Child Care Center Aide..........$28,042......$36,352

Cashier.........................$31,779......$42,992

Automobile Driver.............. $25,778......$33,763

LA..............................$22,123......$36,644

(Lavatory Attendent?, Lowest Grade)

These Lowest Paying Jobs, are two to three times what people are getting in Private Sector...plus the Lack of Benefits and Vacation/Holiday Pay and Pensions...which brings it to 3 to 4 times Total Compensations...

I am not against these Pay Scales and Compensations, as they are Decent Livable Wages, with almost Guaranteed Employment and Internal Promotion over time...a very nice Socialist Security...

The Minnesota Government's Minimum wage is $10.72 per hour, though the average is Closer to $25.00-$30.00...Plus all the Aforementioned Compensations...and their are a number of $60.00 per hour Pay Grades...

I just think these Government Parameters ought to be followed through for all Willing and Able to Work Americans...including the Free or Subsidized Childcare... blush

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Originally Posted By: VahnTitrio
...he'd get almost the same for 3 years as a public servant as will for 40 years with a company.

Sorry it doesn't work that way. State employees get a portion of their retirement from their Deferred Compensation Accounts. It is like a 401K, you have to invest your own money and have it invested for quite a while to see a return on your investment. The state matches a certain percentage of what employees invest like good employers in the private sector do.

The other portion of their retirement is based on a forumla of yearly salary AND years of service. You aren't going to take a $50K/year job with the state for 3 years and see the same benefit as someone that has worked that same job for 30 years.

Big Dave eluded to it but a lot of the jobs have some pretty specific educational requirements. I know state employees who have a masters in fisheries management that started out at about $35K/year. They aren't taking these jobs because they think they are going to become wealthy doing it. They are taking the job because they want to do that type of work.

Right, the way it Usually Works is that you have to have 10 Years of Full Time Employment by the State...Then if at Least 55, you may Retire and Collect at the rate of 50% of your Ending and Usually Highest Pay Grade...In Addition To what you paid into a K type Tax Deferred Fund...Plus Social Security at 62...and oh yeah, Steady Lifetime Employment, Virtually No Layoffs... blush

I always get a Good Laugh at the Misdirection some Full Time State Employees use to make it seem they only get Compensation from their Self Funded Plan, knowing Full Well they will Also Receive the State Government Plan... laughlaughlaugh

Many of our Counties have now Adopted the State Mandatory Pay Grades and Compensations...

Again Government Socialists against Socialism by Government... crazy

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Almost all Full Time State Employees are in Unions...including Teachers...

Not only are they getting very good Guaranteed Salaries...Many Weeks Paid Vacation and a Slew of Paid Holidays, Guaranteed Required Hours, Full Health and Dental...And 50% of Highest Salary at Retirement, which may be Collected Starting at Age 55...in addition to Social Security which may be Collected at age 62...

:

Teachers', while in one state union, have benefits largely determiend by the local school distict. Not all teachers belong to one insurance plan, for example. In fact, the school district I work for charges teachers $550/month for family coverage insurance. (Not even close to the anecdotal 'teachers benefits are the cats meow' reputation). As for any retirement plans, we have TRA, which is nothing to brag about, and some schools offer 403B. However, many schools put a low cap on 403b contributions.

In terms of comparing to the private sector, most sought after private sector careers (those who depend on college educated professionals) tend to offer similiar perks.

At least for teachers, there is a huge contrast once you get out of the metro.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Originally Posted By: MOBY RICHARD
Almost all Full Time State Employees are in Unions...including Teachers...

Not only are they getting very good Guaranteed Salaries...Many Weeks Paid Vacation and a Slew of Paid Holidays, Guaranteed Required Hours, Full Health and Dental...And 50% of Highest Salary at Retirement, which may be Collected Starting at Age 55...in addition to Social Security which may be Collected at age 62...

:

Teachers', while in one state union, have benefits largely determiend by the local school distict. Not all teachers belong to one insurance plan, for example. In fact, the school district I work for charges teachers $550/month for family coverage insurance. (Not even close to the anecdotal 'teachers benefits are the cats meow' reputation). As for any retirement plans, we have TRA, which is nothing to brag about, and some schools offer 403B. However, many schools put a low cap on 403b contributions.

In terms of comparing to the private sector, most sought after private sector careers (those who depend on college educated professionals) tend to offer similiar perks.

At least for teachers, there is a huge contrast once you get out of the metro.

I knew you would be back with more Misdirecting Misrepresentation...

As you know Full Well, the Contracts for Wages Benefits and Pensions for Full Time Teachers in the State of Minnesota are very Close to one another, Throughout the State...

They are also Very Close to the General State Contracts...only with a lot more Time Off...

And the TRAs or 403bs are In Addition to the 50% Pension, Early Retirement, and Social Security...

I find it very Disturbing that someone in your Position is So Misleading... eek

And don't Bother with the Teachers or other State Workers are Poor Routine...after a few years service you are in the top 15% or Better...and as far as Retirees, the top 5%... blush

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

To Caseymcq what would be your largest employer in the Babbitt area?

Cliff's Natural Resources Northshore Mine (private industry). Pays better than government job too wink

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Right, the way it Usually Works is that you have to have 10 Years of Full Time Employment by the State...Then if at Least 55, you may Retire and Collect at the rate of 50% of your Ending and Usually Highest Pay Grade...In Addition To what you paid into a K type Tax Deferred Fund...Plus Social Security at 62... blush

Moby, here's what most state folks get under the MSRS plan:

Service Credit Percent

Service years and months are converted to a percentage of your average monthly salary through two formulas—the Step formula or the Level formula.

If you were hired for the first time after June 30, 1989, MSRS must use the level formula. If you were hired before July 1, 1989, MSRS can compute your annuity using either formula. If you are eligible for both, MSRS will use the one that gives you the higher annuity, while considering any early-retirement adjustment.

Step Formula

You receive 1.2% for each year of service for the first 10 years, then 1.7% for each year thereafter. This formula is used in your computation only if your Minnesota public retirement coverage began before July 1, 1989.

Level Formula

You receive 1.7% for all years of service. Anyone hired for the first time after June 30, 1989, must use this formula.

Example (Single-Life annuity)

You are an employee who retires at age 65 with 20 years of service and an average high-year income of $30,000 ($2,500 per month). Your allowable-service percentage is calculated at 1.2% for the first 10 years, then 1.7% for the other years under the step formula. Your allowable-service percentage is calculated at 1.7% under the level formula. In this case, the level formula is used because it provides a greater benefit.

The in addition you speak of is just that, additional investments made by the individual. It is also good to note that the amount paid by the employee has been going up, recently increased from 4% to 5% of salary.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Right, the way it Usually Works is that you have to have 10 Years of Full Time Employment by the State...Then if at Least 55, you may Retire and Collect at the rate of 50% of your Ending and Usually Highest Pay Grade

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Originally Posted By: chasineyes
To Caseymcq what would be your largest employer in the Babbitt area?

Cliff's Natural Resources Northshore Mine (private industry). Pays better than government job too wink

Are they not talking layoffs?? I thought I saw in the news about a company talking layoffs up there??

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

And what would be the Calculation for Forty Years service starting at $40,000 and ending at $65,000...closer to the typical...

The Ten Year and 50% Scenario belongs to the Full Time Teachers...

Casey, I only wish Everyone making Less than the Government Workers was Compensated as Fairly as the State Workers...There would be a lot More Smilin' Faces out there... smile

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So, you think state employees make to much money. Well I work for MN/DOT as a transportation specialist / chief project inspector. My wage is less than an equipment operator, carpenter, iron worker, foreman, superintendant, and etc. if you know what the federal and state pay scale is for those jobs. If my job description is to build a road or bridge to plan and spec. that would mean that I should know exactly how to build, right. Well, I do and make less money. The main thing that keeps us state employees from going to the private sector is the benefits like vacation and sick leave. The civil engineers that work for MN/DOT make less than the engineers who work in the private sector. Thats all I got to say for now.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I hope you can read Plans better than you read Posts...as stated, State Wages and Benefits are a Fair and Decent Compensation...we should All be so Fortunate...I don't think you should make Less, I think everyone to be as Fairly Compensated as Government Employees...

Transportation Specialist...Starting $39,902.00 High $54,539.00

transportation Chief Administration Officer...Starting $84,063.00...High $120,269.00... blush

So since you have the Extra Designation...You're doin' Alright... cool

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I only wish Everyone making Less than the Government Workers was Compensated as Fairly as the State Workers...

Then shouldn't everyone making More than the government workers also be compensated the same?

Sounds a little like socialism doesn't it?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My wife left a state job because the benefits and pay was worse than private sector.

She is an RN. She was making $33.25 with the state as a .5 (part time) paying $400 per month for family health insurance, and yes, had the other benefits (retirement, disability insurance).

She went to work for Fairview. She's making $33.00 per hour, working at a .5 again, paying $100 per month for insurance with zero copays. She still has the retirement plans and disability insurances.

I'm tired of people saying these state jobs are so great. They're not. Many of the higher up jobs are good, yes. That would be the same in the private sector.

If you're just a laborer, you're getting paid like a laborer. I could have gotten a job at the prison at $10 per hour mowing grass.

I run my own business and charge out many more times than that.

I still would have been tied into the retirement system, had access to benefits, etc. Does that mean I'm going to bail on my business so I can get state benefits?

As was said earlier, you can't just look at a job position and the compensation and say they're "overpaid / overcompensated". You've got to compare all job duties, all compensation, and still be able to find all private sector jobs to compare the compensation packages.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I know I'm not from MN, but we get the same [PoorWordUsage] here in Iowa. I am a county conservation officer, which means I am required to be law enforcement certified, have a cdl, have a commercial pesticide applicators license, be able to teach on a number of topics and also be a succesful grant writer. I get paid a little less than 60% of what the Boeing employess went on strike for. My younger brother just quit a job of being an assistant police chief to be the assistant manager at a grocery store because of the better pay and benefits. If it is so great, why don't you just sign up to get a government job? Don't get me wrong, I knew going into this proffession that I wouldn't get rich, it was my choice, but if you think it is so great, sign up and run a snowplow on Christmas morning or cover trafic accidents in blizzrds or stand out and direct traffic around an accident in 100 degree heat for hours.

Sorry for the rant, but it gets to me when people only look at one side of an issue.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0