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Wade Joseph

Real Poverty

49 posts in this topic

The discussion on another thread has prompted me to share a few glimpses of real poverty that I have witnessed in my travels around the world. Yes, we have some very poor folks in this country, many are even homeless, but with the social programs we have in this great country of ours, the homeless are not reduced to animals.

1) While in Lima Peru I traveled past a garbage dump. This garbage dump was not like ones in this country with large dozers mixing the refuse with fill and covering it up. It was a huge pile of garbage and the smell was one of the worst I have ever experienced. Looking at it I spotted a young woman probably in her 20's searching thru the garbage and placing items in a small bag. She was holding the bag in the same hand she was using to also supprt an infant on her hip. Along side her helping her dig thru the garbage was a young boy of 3 or 4. They were looking for food.

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On that at least we can agree.

The poor in America are better off than many in developing & third world countries, especially in urban slums and/or rural areas.

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Your kidding! People in some other countrys have it worse off than us?? shocked

Then why are people complaning so much lately? Maybe we should just be happy with what we have.

If your disadvantaged or poor and are upset no one is helping you. just think, you could be digging through a mountain of trash looking for food.

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real poverty

Who defines poverty??

poverty |ˈpävərtē|

noun

the state of being extremely poor : thousands of families are living in abject poverty.

• the state of being inferior in quality or insufficient in amount : the poverty of her imagination.

• the renunciation of the right to individual ownership of property as part of a religious vow.

ORIGIN Middle English : from Old French poverte, from Latin paupertas, from pauper ‘poor.’

I dont mean to stir the pot. sorry. But I guess Im trying to figure out your point.

Poor people here in america certainly do not have it as bad as the poor people in some third world country, but that does not mean that poor americans dont have it bad.

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Go ahead and stir....My point is, there are so many who cry "poor me" when in fact they can eek out a very crude existance, but they can at least rely on the proven generosity of the poeple of this country. Food shelves, food pantries, soup kitchens etc....

So I get a little miffed when I overhear a phone conversation by some young woman complain to some social service office that they babay need diapers, food, formula etc...meanwhile her hubby/boyfreind is loading the checkout with cigarettes, beer, playstation games.etc...

I'll post another example tomorrow.

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While in Lima Peru I traveled past a garbage dump.

Just one more benefit of voting Republican, you won't need to travel that far to see mothers and kids digging through garbage for food.

ok, ok, I know, a partisan shot. blush Just couldn't pass it up.

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Originally Posted By: Wade Joseph
While in Lima Peru I traveled past a garbage dump.

Just one more benefit of voting Republican, you won't need to travel that far to see mothers and kids digging through garbage for food.

ok, ok, I know, a partisan shot. blush Just couldn't pass it up.

if memory serves, i believe peru is a socialist country

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So, by buying fishing poles at Wal-Mart he's doing his share to help keep the Chinese from digging for chow in the trash dump.

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I spent some time in Tijuana and Manila helping setting up factories and they had people standing in line for jobs that paid probably $50 a week and these people thought they were lucky if they got the job. If they got the job they could actually go out and buy clothes and food for their families. Those people didn't consider themselves poor, they considered themselves fortunate to be able to support their families. Here is they can't afford cell phones and Wii etc while on welfare they consider themselves in poverty. Absolutely no perspective of reality.

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I spent some time in Tijuana and Manila helping setting up factories and they had people standing in line for jobs that paid probably $50 a week and these people thought they were lucky if they got the job. If they got the job they could actually go out and buy clothes and food for their families. Those people didn't consider themselves poor, they considered themselves fortunate to be able to support their families. Here is they can't afford cell phones and Wii etc while on welfare they consider themselves in poverty. Absolutely no perspective of reality.

i think of what big babies americans have become. we didnt have much growing up but i dont remember it bugging me. our grandparents went through a great depression and came back strong to win a war and then build this country. never a complaint

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My grandparents didn't have indoor plumbing in their house until 1960 and they raised 4 boys in a 500 sqauare foot house with no basement. In fact their house didn't have siding until my dad was about 3 years old. They never considered themselves poor. In contrast now a person needs a 2500 square foot house with 4 full bathrooms just to live. The funny thing is that my grandparents were happy and paid off their house. Some of the people with the big houses are being foreclosed on because they can't afford them.

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I'll see you a grandparent without indoor plumbing until 1960 & raise you grandparents who didn't receive indoor plumbing until 1988. The same year they got heating not coming off of their wood stove. smile

And they certainly never considered themselves poor, nor did we when we went up there as young pups. Not remotely.

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how in the world did your poor grandparents survive without social programs and welfare? IS... IT... POSSIBLE???

They must have turned to drugs, or domestic assults, and blaming G.W.

It only makes sense to me.

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The discussion on another thread has prompted me to share a few glimpses of real poverty that I have witnessed in my travels around the world. Yes, we have some very poor folks in this country, many are even homeless, but with the social programs we have in this great country of ours, the homeless are not reduced to animals.

1) While in Lima Peru I traveled past a garbage dump. This garbage dump was not like ones in this country with large dozers mixing the refuse with fill and covering it up. It was a huge pile of garbage and the smell was one of the worst I have ever experienced. Looking at it I spotted a young woman probably in her 20's searching thru the garbage and placing items in a small bag. She was holding the bag in the same hand she was using to also supprt an infant on her hip. Along side her helping her dig thru the garbage was a young boy of 3 or 4. They were looking for food.

I can't for the life of me figure out what the point of this is other than there are others that have it worse in the world than Americans. You think? Should we aspire to dumpster diving in Peru or use slightly better than this as the bar to meet with our social programs?

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Not really...the person in China is still in poverty, while the American owner of the company and Wal-Mart are raking in profits using lowly paid labor on both ends.

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poverty in America is a family of four with dad working 2 just above minimum wage jobs and mom working a minimum wage job. Paying daycare to a nieghbor, rent, fixing an old car everyweek, buying a single gift for the family for Chritmas. Forgoing medical and dental care becasue they are too poor for insurance and too proud for MA.

Poor and broke is a relative term. Ive met people with nothing think life is just fine, while another person in a big house with lots of Shtuff claims to be destitiute and broke all the time. It is part of our advertisment and material driven lifetsyles. Youre only poor if you think you are.

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The point Bigtom is to point out that there are many in the world much MUCH worse off that those crying poormouth in this country. Yes, the bar should be set higher for us as a country. Lets set the bar higher with incentives and changing attitudes for success, not by raising taxes and fees to pour money into programs that give handouts and promote wlfare state lifestyles.

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Quote:
poverty in America is a family of four with dad working 2 just above minimum wage jobs and mom working a minimum wage job.

That is not poverty in my eyes that is someone with a some struggles. I don't ever remember anyone saying this living thing was gonna be easy!!

Actually it describes what our family went through at times when I was working my way through a few plant closings. People like that don't need hand outs, they need encouragement and maybe a helping hand every now and then.

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Theres plenty of jobs in America. 2 things, People dont wanna sweat and dont wanna start at the bottom. Well thats too darn bad. I love how the media no longer calls not having ajob 'unemployment' now its 'joblessness'. How about 'goldbricking' or possibly 'lazyitis' or the enlightened 'sedentaryism'. I was in curch and this couple was thanking God that their unemployment benefits were being extended after a hearing because they couldnt find the right teaching posistions. I remember looking at those people thinking, Jesus must be turning over in his grave.

I been poor before. Poor is just about money. This country has real problems that wont easily be solved and money is not the issue. We have generations of people with such a lack of character its driving us to our own end. Thats why people make phone calls to Social Services like the one posted earlier. I sure hope I am all wrong about this.

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"your only poor if you think you are" Good point Papabear. After my Dad got hurt on the railroad in the 60's we were dirt poor for quite awhile. My lunch tickets were a different color when everyone else's and I thought I was special because of it. Talk about naive!

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Theres plenty of jobs in America. 2 things, People dont wanna sweat and dont wanna start at the bottom. Well thats too darn bad. I love how the media no longer calls not having ajob 'unemployment' now its 'joblessness'. How about 'goldbricking' or possibly 'lazyitis' or the enlightened 'sedentaryism'. I was in curch and this couple was thanking God that their unemployment benefits were being extended after a hearing because they couldnt find the right teaching posistions. I remember looking at those people thinking, Jesus must be turning over in his grave.

I been poor before. Poor is just about money. This country has real problems that wont easily be solved and money is not the issue. We have generations of people with such a lack of character its driving us to our own end. Thats why people make phone calls to Social Services like the one posted earlier. I sure hope I am all wrong about this.

i heard a line years ago that said unemployment benefits encourage unemployment. when one of my sons was applying for his first job as a teen, he thought he was too good for certain jobs. i fixed that attitude real fast quick and in a hurry.

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unemployment benefits are good if you have worked at a good job for a while. Otherwise they are nothing to brag about. The rules and everything are set up to discourage you from collecting money and not working.

Luckily I was part of a mass layoff and we were provided grant money to go to school and get another good job, but I had to prove my family could go without me working long enoug to get my education, not many people I got laid off with could do that. My family survived me being unemployed for 18 months by having our priorities squared away long before I was laid off. People who do not think of the future and what may happen are the ones who are going to be hurting if something like unemployment, disaster, or illness affects them. If you go into debt and cant manage money you will be poor no matter what.

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Just afew thoughts....This topic is interesting on many levels.  We have people in this country that pick through garbage to find food.  Usually there is something else in the agenda that prompts them to do this...addiction is usually a contributing factor.Pick through garbage, live under bridges, live in homeless shelters, squats, sewers, beg for money at the ramps.  Poor, sure, financially speaking, but they chose a life style.  Some life choices and the ensuing life styles go hand in hand.  Alot of factors here, not just the hand you are dealt..there are cards that can be thrown away and cards that can be drawn in the game of life!We'er a progressive nation that has means as a society to finance social programs that will help our fellow man if and when the need arises.  The programs are supposed to be a temporary thing to help people over the bumps that life brings.Not everyone is a doctor, lawyer, or an indian chief and not everyone can be one...some folks are just regular everyday workers and some live week to week, raising families and going about the business of living...sometimes, being willing and able isn't enough and thats when someone might need a type of help program. The programs are a good thing if they are used in the way it was intended, but they have been skewed over the years, twisted and turned, used as a political tool and in alot of instances, more so then what governments will admit, it has fostered not a means toward self sufficency, but dependency. They are designed to help the poor and needy, but you have to be perpetually poor and perpetually needy and know how to work the system in order to utilize the programs.  I've know more then a few peoples, our family being one of them, who have lost their jobs and became needy and because they hadn't been needy prior, they weren't eligible for any kind of help to tide them over until new work could be found.I don't know about all the inner workings of other countries governments and social structures.  Maybe the woman digging in the dump in that country, is equivelent to someone digging in a fast food dumpster in ours?  I would think that the definition of poverty is relative to the overall wealth of the country?  Tough row to hoe, no matter what.Somebody in that country has something, because someone created all that garbage and if there is something edible in it, someone has to have enough, to be throwing those ediles away?  It seems to me like there is more here then meets the eye...what we see and precieve, isn't always what the situation really is....but a woman with kids, digging in a dump for food, is terrible no matter where it occurs, or what the circumstances!One last thing...maybe if it wasn't for Americans looking out for other Americans in need, we would have alot more people in that same situation, picking through other peoples garbage to keep the wolf away?    

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